My answer explained that already
Did it, though?
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My answer explained that already
the self creates suffering by trying to maintain/project an image, a personality.The question is:
Do you want a teaching that you like? Or do you want a teaching that transforms you?
To transform you have to do the things you do not like.....those that make you suffer before you see the light.
The question is:
Do you want a teaching that you like? Or do you want a teaching that transforms you?
To transform you have to do the things you do not like.....those that make you suffer before you see the light.
Yes, though a bit hidden, and when speaking about vedanta you have double and triple interpretations all the time, just depending on one's POVDid it, though?
A useful start is their "Shivambu" start of the day.
I did it for many years. Took ca. 3 days to overcome initial physical disgust, but ca. 3 weeks to overcome mental disgust.
They attribute it to Shiva, so I would not be surprised that it is mentioned somewhere in the ancient Hindu Scripture (vaguely I remember even having seen those Sanskrit lines, but don't ask me where, that's more than 30 years ago)Interesting. Is Shivambu a scriptural Hindu practice or is it as some say imported recently? I mean in the early 20th century?
The question is:
Do you want a teaching that you like? Or do you want a teaching that transforms you?
To transform you have to do the things you do not like.....those that make you suffer before you see the light.
Coincidentally, a friend I met in India, at the Ashram of Sai Baba, who also used to do Shivambu, send me a few days ago, out of the blue, below linkInteresting. Is Shivambu a scriptural Hindu practice or is it as some say imported recently? I mean in the early 20th century?
The suffering I speak of in the OP is in the practice when we working on the Nafs, the nafs or ego want us to cling to this physical world, but as a practitioner, we understand the real-life is with God and when the ego trying to make us want, like, lust for, feel greed and so on, it creates suffering because it is not what we seeking, but we feel suffering when we can not have what feels good.I think, if a teaching feels like suffering, it should not be practiced. It depends how you would look at it I suppose. Diabetes patients consider their diets suffering sometimes. But they do it for their wellbeing. A martial artist might consider his training as a suffering. Some do. But its a good suffering with benefits, and soon it is enjoyable.
But there are some practices that I think are invalid because people do them for some divine purpose or to get close to God or even as a path of enlightenment. Like in Buddhism it teaches that the Buddha stopped doing his Dhushkara Kriya or difficult tasks or sufferings, and got onto Madhyama or the middle which means not over indulging like an idiot, but also not suffering like a fool. Middle path. Madhyama Prathipadha.
Even in the Qur'an it speaks of religion not to be taken as a burden or a suffering.
In my personal opinion, people invariably tend to invent a lot of things as "sufferings" to teach others for whatever reasons and attribute them to God and enlightenment. I guess this might be coming from humans urge for seeking that so called "higher truth".
Speaking of transformation, I have a friend of mine who owned a few night clubs. I personally know that he spent approximately 300,000 dollars gambling. Just wasted the money. I think something went wrong at that point in his life, but the guy was married and had a kid. Good guy. Well, his transformation came from some hallucinogenic drug. I mean this guy is a transformed man. He sold his dirty clubs (no pun intended) and opened top class, decent night clubs, and became quite successful, and has a very good family life. Just one day. Thats it.
I am interested in knowing what kind of teaching you are specifically referring to if you have some time.
They attribute it to Shiva, so I would not be surprised that it is mentioned somewhere in the ancient Hindu Scripture (vaguely I remember even having seen those Sanskrit lines, but don't ask me where, that's more than 30 years ago)
Note: Even my grandmother, who lived for 92 years, and who was a devout Christian, and not interested in India, told me, when I told her about Shivambu, "Oh yes, of course I know, we used it also when we were young ... helped against all kind of troubles" (so, as my grandmother was born ca. 1900, it could still be imported quite recently, but not early 20th century, then it would be at least early 19th century). But my gut feeling tells me that people knew about Shivambu way before this (if my grandmother already knew it, and she was very Christian, far away from any other religion)
Coincidentally, a friend I met in India, at the Ashram of Sai Baba, who also used to do Shivambu, send me a few days ago, out of the blue, below link
Knowing Yourself: THE WATER OF AUSPICIOUSNESS: SHIVAMBU KALPA VIDHI
Note: I do take those verses with a grain (or 2) of salt though, and definitely when drinking Shivambu, you better don't take more than a few grains of salt, otherwise the Shivambu experience can taste quite "salty". Sometimes the writers of Scriptures seem to exaggerate a bit, this seems one of those cases, if you ask me (reading about 'flying in the air', it never happened to me, and I was drinking it for more than 8 years I think). But that was not my intention, I just was interested in the experience and face my judgmental mind
Nowadays with all this fake news, I don't know what to believe or not, when it comes to Scripture verses (people posting on the internet, can make up anything, easily adding words or editing words even (even Sanskrit). But even such things could have happened with original Scriptures)Do you consider this Shivambu Kalpa scripture? (I have not read it btw. Just asking).
The suffering I speak of in the OP is in the practice when we working on the Nafs, the nafs or ego want us to cling to this physical world, but as a practitioner, we understand the real-life is with God and when the ego trying to make us want, like, lust for, feel greed and so on, it creates suffering because it is not what we seeking, but we feel suffering when we can not have what feels good.
It is this form of suffering within the practice that I may be clumsy try to convey.
For a sufi the only truly important in life is being closer to Allah, and the practice of conquering the ego is the hardest one
Nowadays with all this fake news, I don't know what to believe or not, when it comes to Scripture verses (people posting on the internet, can make up anything, easily adding words or editing words even (even Sanskrit). But even such things could have happened with original Scriptures)
I am fully agreeing with what you say here @firedragonAh. I understand what you say.
I dont understand nafs as ego. But it would probably depend on how you render the English word "ego". I understand "nafs" as "self". The Quranic words Faqbilu anfusakum means "turn toward yourself", but if you translate it "turn toward your ego" the whole meaning changes. But that's just a side point.
The Qur'an says, "have you seen the one who takes his Havah as ilah". That means "desire as God". This desire or Havah is actually "ego". And it says vehemently, very clearly, this is shirk. Taking your ego/desire as God is shirk.
Peace.
I am fully agreeing with what you say here @firedragon
I had a feeling when using the word nafs you would get where I wanted you to see the OP from,
The question is:
Do you want a teaching that you like? Or do you want a teaching that transforms you?
To transform you have to do the things you do not like.....those that make you suffer before you see the light.
Neither. I want a teaching that can be used.The question is:
Do you want a teaching that you like? Or do you want a teaching that transforms you?
To transform you have to do the things you do not like.....those that make you suffer before you see the light.
Spiritual teaching used for?Neither. I want a teaching that can be used.
The question is:
Do you want a teaching that you like? Or do you want a teaching that transforms you?
To transform you have to do the things you do not like.....those that make you suffer before you see the light.