Desert Snake
Veteran Member
^ Thanks for replying. I think I have a better idea of what the designation "LHP" is about, after the responses I've gotten.
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Do you have to be evil to be LHP?
- Thread starter Desert Snake
- Start date
Orias
Left Hand Path
If you have time check this thread out.
Desert Snake
Veteran Member
Yes, I saw that. I think the "LHP" designation is more of a catch all for some non-mainstream religions, the opinions voiced by many people claiming "LHP" are quite varied.
thats the beauty of it.
I think this post contradicts your statement that you are beginning to understand the title of "left-hand path". In fact, it's what you'd hear from someone who just learned of the LHP from an uninformative, random website.
Orias
Left Hand Path
Desert Snake
Veteran Member
Yes, LHP or not, it does seem quite inclusive as to individual ideas
Satanix
Setian Medic
Good and Evil are models of perception. The outdated and childish concept of Darkness = Evil and Light = Righteousness and Good is not shared by other religions. Some may see the Self Dwelling in Darkness so as to rise forth toward Self Created Light. Others see it as originating in religions that stoke the fires of piety and devotion with fear, and find it as more of an obstacle.
Evil is a model that, what I have seen, merely represents what threatens the individual at any given moment of perception. Be this a man/woman with a weapon, a speeding car, or maybe a person who is spouting a logical view point that causes the individual to question themselves and their motives. These seem to all hold equal weight of "evil" in the sense that they are all threats, some more physical than others, but the fact is that it is a threat.
The LHP has had a long reputation of playing with social and religious taboos so as to obtain radical individualism and also to be a banner for others who feel the same, not in a ministry sense, but in the sense of crying out as a voice for others who are radical individual gods/goddess but don't know of any viable outlet. The other is a lesser demonstration of power and dethroning abusive and restrictive Models of Perceptions/Religion/World-View.
This reputation of playing with taboos such as The Church of Satan performing publicly open Satanic Wedding, nude alters, or maybe Varg's vengeance of burning down an empty church that ripped up a old pagan sacred grove to selfishly build a church that they validated by their assumed religious superiority*. These actions have earned us a seat at the Evil table with the rest of the other kids that didn't play by established rules. Established rules may not be inherently bad, the LHP practioners can see where the controlling factors are and use them to an advantage. Using your hang-ups to your advantage can be quite beneficial.
Take for instance, the very essence of wearing a hooded sweatshirt with a white inverse pentagram on it in a supermarket. Superficially, this may not be an threat to people's lives, but it is a threat to the establishment of their social perception, and you are evil (not because of the hoody!) because you showed the lack of concrete-ness of that perceptive model, like a scratch on a new CD no one expected.
Most socialites have no clue that the map is not the territory in a Occult sense, those that do know it have only a sensationalist NLP/New Age concept of it. Many perceive only of the realist or solipsistic approach. That either they are the only conscious being that is here making reality at this given moment. Or there is a big, bad scary uncontrollable reality out there that I can't control, I am just a bio-cog in the big Green Machine. Your image initiated the latter due to old religious propaganda. This is in a useful sense being Evil.
For the Setian Evil = Stupidity and The Good = Intelligent
Other than that a wise man once said: Evil is just Live Spelled Backwards!
Xeper,
Setanix
*I was by no means insinuating that Varg Vikernes was LHP, Satanist, or anything other than what he has personally confessed to. Despite his lack of harm to innocents I do not fully agree with immolation of property that is not mine. Fortunately, we have rights in the US that protect us from potential religious abuse, this may not be the case in other places.
Evil is a model that, what I have seen, merely represents what threatens the individual at any given moment of perception. Be this a man/woman with a weapon, a speeding car, or maybe a person who is spouting a logical view point that causes the individual to question themselves and their motives. These seem to all hold equal weight of "evil" in the sense that they are all threats, some more physical than others, but the fact is that it is a threat.
The LHP has had a long reputation of playing with social and religious taboos so as to obtain radical individualism and also to be a banner for others who feel the same, not in a ministry sense, but in the sense of crying out as a voice for others who are radical individual gods/goddess but don't know of any viable outlet. The other is a lesser demonstration of power and dethroning abusive and restrictive Models of Perceptions/Religion/World-View.
This reputation of playing with taboos such as The Church of Satan performing publicly open Satanic Wedding, nude alters, or maybe Varg's vengeance of burning down an empty church that ripped up a old pagan sacred grove to selfishly build a church that they validated by their assumed religious superiority*. These actions have earned us a seat at the Evil table with the rest of the other kids that didn't play by established rules. Established rules may not be inherently bad, the LHP practioners can see where the controlling factors are and use them to an advantage. Using your hang-ups to your advantage can be quite beneficial.
Take for instance, the very essence of wearing a hooded sweatshirt with a white inverse pentagram on it in a supermarket. Superficially, this may not be an threat to people's lives, but it is a threat to the establishment of their social perception, and you are evil (not because of the hoody!) because you showed the lack of concrete-ness of that perceptive model, like a scratch on a new CD no one expected.
Most socialites have no clue that the map is not the territory in a Occult sense, those that do know it have only a sensationalist NLP/New Age concept of it. Many perceive only of the realist or solipsistic approach. That either they are the only conscious being that is here making reality at this given moment. Or there is a big, bad scary uncontrollable reality out there that I can't control, I am just a bio-cog in the big Green Machine. Your image initiated the latter due to old religious propaganda. This is in a useful sense being Evil.
For the Setian Evil = Stupidity and The Good = Intelligent
Other than that a wise man once said: Evil is just Live Spelled Backwards!
Xeper,
Setanix
*I was by no means insinuating that Varg Vikernes was LHP, Satanist, or anything other than what he has personally confessed to. Despite his lack of harm to innocents I do not fully agree with immolation of property that is not mine. Fortunately, we have rights in the US that protect us from potential religious abuse, this may not be the case in other places.
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Shuddhasattva
Well-Known Member
Difference?
Shuddhasattva
Well-Known Member
No. But - we must discern permissivity from sublimation; as tehre are many things peddled as LHP. Mostly LHP is waved around for these 3 letters as a 'i can do whatever I want in my philosophy because it's spiritual, mmkay?' sense - and for social signalling.
There is a necessary component that does not lie in mere hedonism, but can dwell there - sometimes.
The essential thing is to use the 'poisons' and transmute, thru the internal alchemy, the excreta into the desired product; as, a previous poster said, a divinity'.
Beyond this, it's to achieve perfect purity of self-trust, perfect self-confidence thru radical ascesis to constantly keep in mind the great vows and the yidam of the vows and the consort of the vows, subtly present within all beings male or female, and even all things in their subtle arrangement. This ultimately means the flowering of sva-tantrya, perfect free will. Whatever the doer does is perfectly beneficial and benevolent there being no substantial doer in many ways.
In some tradition, a certain amount of LHP classified practice and theory was and is utilized to achieve the goals of enlightenment and cutivating the universal aspiration of liberating all beings.
Part of liberating all beings ... the ultimate dharma
is the nullification of dharma as a category distinct from adharma
One simultaneously endeavors to do no harm, while working to perceive, on one level no harm - no adharma, but on another to sympathize with the harms experienced conventionally.
Eventually all things are rendered innately pure, but recognized as conventionally binding, even hideously so for some in some times and places.
How does this connect? the duality of right and wrong, good and evil, is one of the many that must be surmounted to ascend the mountain of final union, if the haridans in the sky do not catch you and throw you from the ledge, these sky dancers fell and wrathful-burning.
Asides aside, in anycase - in order for beings to become liberated they must perceive the cessation of right and wrong as pertaining to the field of awareness, personal or otherwise, this involves sacralizing the conventionally profane in some cases.
In other cases it means doing what householders generally consider just fine, but doing it correctly; as it were; for the supreme bliss of the non-joy and non-meditation.
There is a necessary component that does not lie in mere hedonism, but can dwell there - sometimes.
The essential thing is to use the 'poisons' and transmute, thru the internal alchemy, the excreta into the desired product; as, a previous poster said, a divinity'.
Beyond this, it's to achieve perfect purity of self-trust, perfect self-confidence thru radical ascesis to constantly keep in mind the great vows and the yidam of the vows and the consort of the vows, subtly present within all beings male or female, and even all things in their subtle arrangement. This ultimately means the flowering of sva-tantrya, perfect free will. Whatever the doer does is perfectly beneficial and benevolent there being no substantial doer in many ways.
In some tradition, a certain amount of LHP classified practice and theory was and is utilized to achieve the goals of enlightenment and cutivating the universal aspiration of liberating all beings.
Part of liberating all beings ... the ultimate dharma
is the nullification of dharma as a category distinct from adharma
One simultaneously endeavors to do no harm, while working to perceive, on one level no harm - no adharma, but on another to sympathize with the harms experienced conventionally.
Eventually all things are rendered innately pure, but recognized as conventionally binding, even hideously so for some in some times and places.
How does this connect? the duality of right and wrong, good and evil, is one of the many that must be surmounted to ascend the mountain of final union, if the haridans in the sky do not catch you and throw you from the ledge, these sky dancers fell and wrathful-burning.
Asides aside, in anycase - in order for beings to become liberated they must perceive the cessation of right and wrong as pertaining to the field of awareness, personal or otherwise, this involves sacralizing the conventionally profane in some cases.
In other cases it means doing what householders generally consider just fine, but doing it correctly; as it were; for the supreme bliss of the non-joy and non-meditation.
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Desert Snake
Veteran Member
So many different answers, takes on "LHP"...interesting
Have you found any of them to be evil?
Desert Snake
Veteran Member
Aren't you supposed to know people by their apples? (and their cookies?)
Shuddasattva's post above (#71) makes me wonder if it frustrates you people that so many have such difficulty understanding your stances.
I certainly have a hard enough time understanding what he means, despite a lot of rather skilled people having tried to explain it to me time and again.
Sometimes I wonder if it would be easier if I actually believed in God or in Hell. Or in fully subjective moralities.
I certainly have a hard enough time understanding what he means, despite a lot of rather skilled people having tried to explain it to me time and again.
Sometimes I wonder if it would be easier if I actually believed in God or in Hell. Or in fully subjective moralities.
That's what LHP is all about; evolution of individual ideas by synchronising the ideas presented by others. That is, for the most part. There are people who find it silly to take on the elements of others' LHP practice and thus create their own from absolute scratch. Again: individuality is key.
Point is, no LHP practitioner's ideas are exactly the same as his fellows'.
Gjallarhorn
N'yog-Sothep
The ignorance people have here is usually not their fault.