Divine Revelation in Hindu Religions versus Abrahamic Religions

[Dawnofhope]

In Abrahamic Religions, it is believed that there are Messengers of God who have come with new covenant each time and each brought a set of teachings or commandments from divinity. Example of these Messengers are Noah, Abraham and Moses.
There are also other prophets such as the Jewish Prophets (Daniel, Ezekiel), who did not bring commandments, but according Bible, the saw visions and dreams, and prophesied about future events.

Now, regardless of the usage of the Terms 'prophet', and 'Messenger', how different is the idea of inspiration in Hinduism.
Essentially both Religions claim that a God or gods communicated to humanity.

What are the Teachings of Krishna and Buddha if not inspired in some way? What about the countless sages and gurus? There are clearly differing capacities amonsgt individuals to reflect spiritual teachings. But it does not matter if we come from the East or the West. We share the same humanity, inhabit the same earth and are illuminated by the one sun. This isn't just a Baha'i principle, but one shared by peoples of good will and peaceful intent throughout differing faith traditions. The is no reason a Just and Loving Creator would not guide all peoples whether in the East or the West. Some of us are universalists and want to see the essential unity throughout the world of mankind as well as within the spiritual realm. Others insist their own religious and cultural traditions are better than everyone elses.

 

[Epic Beard Man]

I'm trying not to go into debates on RF just glide through. Just wanted to clarify. They are talking about theological differences not the results of charity both faiths promote. Not all religions need a teacher; that is completely biased. There is another site me, @Vinayaka and other Bahais were discussing this for a good year. From what I gather, culture and laws vary in Hinduism in relationship to practice and theology. The experience not the laws of god are totally different than the type of relationship (therefore different beliefs) of both religions. God's laws are limited to scripture.

Scripture has god's laws. Believers follow scripture because of god's laws. From god's laws, they do good things. Everything they do and experience is from god and his doctrine. Nothing wrong with that. Hinduism, it's about one's self only. According to what I learned, it is not a scripture-focused faith. It's a self-focused. Original sin means one is born to sin. Therefore, when we are born, we are already likely to go against god. That's why christians need christ. I'm not familar with Islam. Not all Indian cultures approve homosexuality (from what I gather) because of culture not theology.

To put it in perspective and this is the core of the OP.

This is like finding similarities in black and white people's experiences.

1. Both have history and culture
2. Both have some interaction with each other than built the history
3. Both have their good and bad sides
4. Both sides are human beings

But they are different because of their theology and thereby their experiences and meaning behind their theology and experiences. These things above have nothing to do with the core and spirit of what both sides represent. Either side having their own views is not negative (case in point). I think Hindus just wish people can see that the focus is on the spirit of each beliefs differences in their own right not trying to find what black and whites have in common as above.

Kinda understand?

I understand differences in theology and in their respective philosophies. I'm not saying they are both similar in most respects. But what I'm saying on contrast to @Vinayaka is that it is not totally "night and day" differences, rather they are seasonal with respect to certain theological beliefs they have. But what I'm saying is that not all religious traditions are completely opposite of each other. Each tradition does have elements that are relatable to other traditions that are worlds apart. Nothing is completely opposite.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

I understand differences in theology and in their respective philosophies. I'm not saying they are both similar in most respects. But what I'm saying on contrast to @Vinayaka is that it is not totally "night and day" differences, rather they are seasonal with respect to certain theological beliefs they have. But what I'm saying is that not all religious traditions are completely opposite of each other. Each tradition does have elements that are relatable to other traditions that are worlds apart. Nothing is completely opposite.

I'd say there are night and day because their foundations are different. Most religions would be ideal and hopefully similar in charity, love thy neightbor etc. Though the foundation of those things like sacrifice opposes the core of religions like buddhism and most likely Hinduism (or Dharmic teachings) as well.

The external things are similar. Most religions promote good conduct. Bahais are trying to find similarities in theology saying that Hindus have prophets and their religion is outdated.

@Vinayaka has a pet peeve with bahai. But I'm sure he doesn't disagree in the externals.

 

[Epic Beard Man]

I'd say there are night and day because their foundations are different. Most religions would be ideal and hopefully similar in charity, love thy neightbor etc. Though the foundation of those things like sacrifice opposes the core of religions like buddhism and most likely Hinduism (or Dharmic teachings) as well.

The external things are similar. Most religions promote good conduct. Bahais are trying to find similarities in theology saying that Hindus have prophets and their religion is outdated.

@Vinayaka has a pet peeve with bahai. But I'm sure he doesn't disagree in the externals.

But sacrifices although in ancient times were literal are more aligned with having spiritual meanings. Nowadays sacrifices are normally done by giving up vices or daily activities in recognition of God. But yes, a lot of religions are night and day. The geographical origins alone denote their differences.

 

[Marcion]

In Abrahamic Religions, it is believed that there are Messengers of God who have come with new covenant each time and each brought a set of teachings or commandments from divinity. Example of these Messengers are Noah, Abraham and Moses.
There are also other prophets such as the Jewish Prophets (Daniel, Ezekiel), who did not bring commandments, but according Bible, the saw visions and dreams, and prophesied about future events.

Now, regardless of the usage of the Terms 'prophet', and 'Messenger', how different is the idea of inspiration in Hinduism.
Essentially both Religions claim that a God or gods communicated to humanity.

I think this is more the Bahai way of thinking. Pehaps it is then better to ask these question specifically to Bahai people.

 

[RoaringSilence]

I find no pleasure in pointing out the hypocrisy among the Hindu followers who like to throw rocks and hide their hands. However I like to be fair and call a spade a spade. There is plenty of blame to go around among humans who mistreat other humans regardless of religion.



List of Indian massacres

Anti-Brahmin riots of 1948

1969 Gujarat riots (Hindu/Muslim riots in which majority of the Muslims took heavy losses)

Moradabad riots

Bhagalpur riots (False rumors that reported regarding the killing of a Hindu students by Muslims which resulted in 900-1000 deaths mostly Muslim).

I could go on....



Um, I think you might need help sir....I would like to think most Hindus not tainted by a cultural belief of a caste system and have a more progressive mindset do not think as you do but more importantly it is important to note that Hindus have their fair share in a bloody history of death.

Ok ty for your feedback .

 

[RoaringSilence]

to answer the thread , Hindus don't have prophets ,please teach us about your prophet , convert us and take our country in your law . i will send a donation for your next bahai temple we really need more of those , if u need land to build just demolish our old ones.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

But sacrifices although in ancient times were literal are more aligned with having spiritual meanings. Nowadays sacrifices are normally done by giving up vices or daily activities in recognition of God. But yes, a lot of religions are night and day. The geographical origins alone denote their differences.

In christianity,for example, physical sacrifice and spiritual sacrifice go hand in hand. You need christ to die on the cross in order to experience spiritual sacrifice.

A lot of religions have external things in common; but, things like sacrifice and god even, they don't. The Hindu definition of god is totally different than the abrahamic. There is no soul/self in Buddhism therefore, no god. There is no concept of human sacrifice in either.

I mean, in foundation, you'd have to at least compare the Hindu god and Christian god (incarnation or not) and Muslim and Bahai (manifestation). Hindus have what christians would call idols. What theology can do these and other religions have in common to where we would consider one person's definition of charity the same as another? (Believe me, each have their own views and reasons of practices)

 

[Vinayaka]

I understand differences in theology and in their respective philosophies. I'm not saying they are both similar in most respects. But what I'm saying on contrast to @Vinayaka is that it is not totally "night and day" differences, rather they are seasonal with respect to certain theological beliefs they have. But what I'm saying is that not all religious traditions are completely opposite of each other. Each tradition does have elements that are relatable to other traditions that are worlds apart. Nothing is completely opposite.

I agree that there are many similarities, like in some ethical behaviour, the existence of God or gods. I think I use 'night and day' for effect when I hear the idea that they're totally the same. Really, the biggest difference in this very long debate is that some folks, (not me) see differences as a deterrent, while people like me see differences as an asset. From that premise, each side goes looking for one or the other, and cherry picks.

 

[GoodbyeDave]

I came upon a small Murugan temple. Right beside it was a Muslim meat shop, displaying dead carcasses of calves right close to the entrance of the Hindu temple. I spoke to the temple owner who was discouraged by the obvious but legal and nasty attempt to harass..

Or perhaps he was just trying to make a living and that shop was available. It seems that intolerance is as common in Hinduism as in other religions.

 

[Vinayaka]

Or perhaps he was just trying to make a living and that shop was available. It seems that intolerance is as common in Hinduism as in other religions.

Not according to the owner of the temple. He could have hung the meat on the other side his stall, or bought land somewhere else nearby. It seemed to me that it was of malicious intent. Course I could be wrong. Land, as you know, has long been a war or dispute tool. Look what happened in North America with the indigenous folk.

But who knows, really? People do have to make a living. In America the fundies have every right to protest across the street from abortion clinics.

In India there is an early morning loud music war going on in most cities. The mosques play their 'call to prayer' stuff on loudspeakers, and so Hindus blare their bhajans in protest. I stayed in a nice enough hotel to actually have some degree of soundproofing.

Edited to add: Of course, his other choice is to run, move away, like the Kashmiris had to.

Exodus of Kashmiri Hindus - Wikipedia

 

[CG Didymus]

if you guys really wanna convert people , try these guys . but make sure you wear appropriate attire so u blend in or they might poke an arrow in the wrong place.

When I first learned about the Baha'i Faith in 1970, they told me stories of Baha'i "pioneers" going to remote villages and that the whole village became Baha'is. As I recall one time was because a leader had seen a gray haired man in a vision. That man was Abdul Baha. Another was about Hooper Dunbar. I think he drank some concoction the native people were drinking and that won them over.

But that was almost fifty years ago. I wonder what happened to those people? Same kind of stories in India, that large amounts of people joined the Baha'i Faith. What happened? Are they still Baha'is? Is it working for them? Or, what? Although Baha'is say they don't try and convert people, I was told these things for the express purpose of getting me to believe the Baha'is were changing the world and were taking control, according to God's plan of course. I hope it wasn't just hype.

 

[CG Didymus]

What are the Teachings of Krishna and Buddha if not inspired in some way? What about the countless sages and gurus? There are clearly differing capacities amonsgt individuals to reflect spiritual teachings. But it does not matter if we come from the East or the West. We share the same humanity, inhabit the same earth and are illuminated by the one sun. This isn't just a Baha'i principle, but one shared by peoples of good will and peaceful intent throughout differing faith traditions. The is no reason a Just and Loving Creator would not guide all peoples whether in the East or the West. Some of us are universalists and want to see the essential unity throughout the world of mankind as well as within the spiritual realm. Others insist their own religious and cultural traditions are better than everyone elses.

Just going by the Bible, I don't see how God was all that loving and just. Assuming what is stated in the Bible is true and historically accurate, which some of us don't believe, then right from the beginning, God allowed Adam and Eve to be deceived and then cursed them for it. God destroyed all living things with a flood, except those that were on Noah's Ark. God ordered the Israelites to kill women and children in the cities they invaded. God was against the religions of all the people around the Israelites and had them war against them.

Where did those religions come from? Why didn't those people have the truth? Why was their religion so wrong that they had to be killed? And this is after the flood that supposedly killed all the wicked people. It is too easy to find the things religions have in common, and to ignore the bad stuff. Because of what the Bible teaches, and with the addition of the NT, why wouldn't Christians assume they weren't the "only" ones that were right about God? Why wouldn't they go into every land and ban and kill if necessary the people that taught other religions? And they did... in the name of God.

Fortunately the Baha'i Faith isn't like that. But, can they accept and believe as true all the different religious practices in the world? No. Even Baha'is have to say that a lot of those practices are wrong. And a lot of the beliefs of the other religions are wrong. Hindus are wrong. Jews are wrong. Christians, Muslims, all the other religions are wrong by what they do and say... and even by what some of the things in their Scriptures say. So sure get rid of the false beliefs. But it's hard to do that when at the same time Baha'is say the prophets, the manifestations and the Scriptures of all those religions are true. The only problem is people have misunderstood, misinterpreted and changed the original message.

 

[Vinayaka]

When I first learned about the Baha'i Faith in 1970, they told me stories of Baha'i "pioneers" going to remote villages and that the whole village became Baha'is. As I recall one time was because a leader had seen a gray haired man in a vision. That man was Abdul Baha. Another was about Hooper Dunbar. I think he drank some concoction the native people were drinking and that won them over.

But that was almost fifty years ago. I wonder what happened to those people? Same kind of stories in India, that large amounts of people joined the Baha'i Faith. What happened? Are they still Baha'is? Is it working for them? Or, what? Although Baha'is say they don't try and convert people, I was told these things for the express purpose of getting me to believe the Baha'is were changing the world and were taking control, according to God's plan of course. I hope it wasn't just hype.

In India the official government census has Baha'i at less than 10 000 while Baha'u stats claim 2 million. The Baha'i temple in Delhi is 90% sponsored by one very wealth donor. They're constantly pleading for donations. But we're derailing this thread. OP just want to know if there are any differences at all between all the religions.

If that were true, any of us could just switch round whenever we pleased, because it really wouldn't matter one iota. But I don't see Baha'is becoming Christian overnight. There just has to be something different about Christianity, I guess, or else they just would. Be like the Indian taxi drivers. Just be the same religion as your passenger.

 

[Dawnofhope]

Just going by the Bible, I don't see how God was all that loving and just. Assuming what is stated in the Bible is true and historically accurate, which some of us don't believe, then right from the beginning, God allowed Adam and Eve to be deceived and then cursed them for it. God destroyed all living things with a flood, except those that were on Noah's Ark. God ordered the Israelites to kill women and children in the cities they invaded. God was against the religions of all the people around the Israelites and had them war against them.

Where did those religions come from? Why didn't those people have the truth? Why was their religion so wrong that they had to be killed? And this is after the flood that supposedly killed all the wicked people. It is too easy to find the things religions have in common, and to ignore the bad stuff. Because of what the Bible teaches, and with the addition of the NT, why wouldn't Christians assume they weren't the "only" ones that were right about God? Why wouldn't they go into every land and ban and kill if necessary the people that taught other religions? And they did... in the name of God.

Fortunately the Baha'i Faith isn't like that. But, can they accept and believe as true all the different religious practices in the world? No. Even Baha'is have to say that a lot of those practices are wrong. And a lot of the beliefs of the other religions are wrong. Hindus are wrong. Jews are wrong. Christians, Muslims, all the other religions are wrong by what they do and say... and even by what some of the things in their Scriptures say. So sure get rid of the false beliefs. But it's hard to do that when at the same time Baha'is say the prophets, the manifestations and the Scriptures of all those religions are true. The only problem is people have misunderstood, misinterpreted and changed the original message.

Some beliefs within Hinduism are not part of Abrahamic traditions. Reincarnation in the sense of the transmigaration of souls from one life to another, between castes and even between species is an example. However, reincarnation is not a unanimous belief among all Hindus. Some movements in modern Hinduism, including the Brahmo Samaj and the Prarthana Samaj, reject it.

Moksha is another example. Moksha or liberation is the way out of the cycle of rebirths but there is no agreement within Hinduism as to how to achieve it.

 

[CG Didymus]

In India the official government census has Baha'i at less than 10 000 while Baha'u stats claim 2 million. The Baha'i temple in Delhi is 90% sponsored by one very wealth donor. They're constantly pleading for donations. But we're derailing this thread. OP just want to know if there are any differences at all between all the religions.

If that were true, any of us could just switch round whenever we pleased, because it really wouldn't matter one iota. But I don't see Baha'is becoming Christian overnight. There just has to be something different about Christianity, I guess, or else they just would. Be like the Indian taxi drivers. Just be the same religion as your passenger.

Speaking of derailing, if there is only one God, and that God sent a continuous line of "manifestations" that looked like normal people but were quite different. They were special. They brought a new message from this one God that would lead people into a new stage of their spiritual development. But, each time the perfect message got derailed. People found ways to mess it up.

So the original, real message from God was whatever Baha'is say it is. So for Hinduism, there were never many gods. No Shiva. No Vishnu and all the rest. The Baha'is are probably okay with Brahma being a supreme God. But they are not okay with Krishna or anyone else being an incarnation of the one God. There are no multiple lives that a soul goes through on Earth. But lots of things in all the other religions are wrong also. So they are all wrong.

Obviously, Baha'i need to show some continuity, some progression from one religion to another. But they also need to show that there were divine manifestations that brought spiritual teachings to people everywhere. For the "Abrahamics" they have the Book of Genesis. They go from Adam to Noah to Abraham... and then on to Moses to Jesus to Muhammad and their prophets. Where is that line in the other religions? I don't even see it in the "Abrahamic" line. Adam, Noah and Abraham, and even Moses do not fit the definition of a manifestation. One problem, did they even exist. If they did, how much is legend and myth. And if the story about them is accurate, then they were very ordinary men with flaws... not "perfectly" polished mirrors.

I don't know all the vast teachings that are included in Hinduism, but what do Baha'is actually use and say "Ah, now that's the truth"? We've learned from Baha'is that they don't have much to say about Hinduism. There main focus is on Christianity and Islam. And do they even believe anything about how Christianity is practiced? Islam is a different story. They have lots of practices that are very similar to Islam. So, I know they don't think so, but I see them as a liberalized version of Islam. Which is fine. But if they can't be honest about how many people are Baha'is, then how can they be trusted in other things. But I do like some of their threads. They keep trying to convince and convert in a nice way... No, no, I mean they try to show the truth of their religion when asked. And they are fairly nice about it. Hey, take care.

 

[SomeRandom]

Or perhaps he was just trying to make a living and that shop was available. It seems that intolerance is as common in Hinduism as in other religions.

It’s the equivalent of having a butcher display a pig carcass right at the front door next door to a mosque or Jewish temple.
There’s benefit of the doubt and then there’s naivety. I’m sure the owner has tried to have a polite word with the butcher shop owner. If not then I retract my statement. But it’s a little too convenient to me.

 

[CG Didymus]

Some beliefs within Hinduism are not part of Abrahamic traditions. Reincarnation in the sense of the transmigaration of souls from one life to another, between castes and even between species is an example. However, reincarnation is not a unanimous belief among all Hindus. Some movements in modern Hinduism, including the Brahmo Samaj and the Prarthana Samaj, reject it.

Moksha is another example. Moksha or liberation is the way out of the cycle of rebirths but there is no agreement within Hinduism as to how to achieve it.

You know, where did those spiritual ideas come from? I'd imagine someone thought they were being "inspired". But, they were wrong. Where did the idea of a Godhead along with lessor gods come from? If there was a manifestation that brought the perfect truth about God to the people of India, where did it go? When did it get changed? It seems like they have many "inspired" spiritual teachers that teach many variations. And, a lot of those variations are based on the beliefs about a Godhead and reincarnation.

But now back to the Bible, God ordered the killing of women and children and he caused the flood. God sided with the Israelites to war against other people. The gods of those other people are said to be "false" gods. Why didn't God send them a manifestation to straighten them out, instead of declaring war on them? It kind of sets the precedence of fighting people that have different beliefs, which are thought to be false beliefs. And isn't that exactly what happened when Christianity spread around the world? The other religions were never seen as being true. They were usually banned. But now those religions, including the tribal religions, are okay with God? And, in fact, don't Baha'is believe that tribal people were sent manifestations or at least prophets?

 

[Dawnofhope]

You know, where did those spiritual ideas come from? I'd imagine someone thought they were being "inspired". But, they were wrong. Where did the idea of a Godhead along with lessor gods come from? If there was a manifestation that brought the perfect truth about God to the people of India, where did it go? When did it get changed? It seems like they have many "inspired" spiritual teachers that teach many variations. And, a lot of those variations are based on the beliefs about a Godhead and reincarnation.

We've discussed at length the Christian concept of resurrection and its origins with the New Testament, particularly the gospels and Paul's first epistle to Corinthians. With reincarnation the origins of this belief are obscure. Within Hinduism we find references in the Vedic texts, long before the emergence of Buddhism.

Reincarnation - Wikipedia

But then what are the origins of the Vedas?

Vedas - Wikipedia

The problem with beliefs about Krishna is the lack historical certainly about any of the ancient writings that mention Him.

But now back to the Bible, God ordered the killing of women and children and he caused the flood. God sided with the Israelites to war against other people. The gods of those other people are said to be "false" gods. Why didn't God send them a manifestation to straighten them out, instead of declaring war on them? It kind of sets the precedence of fighting people that have different beliefs, which are thought to be false beliefs. And isn't that exactly what happened when Christianity spread around the world? The other religions were never seen as being true. They were usually banned. But now those religions, including the tribal religions, are okay with God? And, in fact, don't Baha'is believe that tribal people were sent manifestations or at least prophets?

It would seem reasonable that most ancient peoples have had their wise peoples and seers. Generally many such cultures have no written records, so the uncertainty about the origins of their actual beliefs is obscure.

War and fighting were a necessary part of life for most tribes, nations and empires up until relatively recently in human history. The name of God may well have been invoked by many a warring nation or tribe but generally its been much more about power, land and money.

 

[Sundance]

In my own studies of and experiences with various religions, I've come to recognize that the differences between religions are beautiful. Whether it was through the chanting of Sanskrit mantras, visions of the image of the Amida Buddha, the reading and recitation of the Holy Qur’an, the singing of Hebrew praises to the Almighty, or meditating upon the Words of the Blessed Beauty, my soul bears witness to the Goodness, Truth, Beauty, and Wisdom of each religion. And in this, their Essence, their Spirit, the Light they carry within, they are One. Like light and the various colors. Each color is different from the others, but they all exist as reflections of one and the same thing: light


The Messages, Teachings, Forms, and Methods will differ, but the fundamental goal of all religions is the same. Each religion brings forth deeper understandings, deeper insights into our relationships with the Divine, with ourselves, with the Greater Universe, and with each other. They, each and all, show us the importance of applying the knowledge we receive to our lives everyday.

So, with this understanding, I ask: why is there the word “versus” in the title of the thread? Why not, rather, the word “and”? Why is there a competitve or otherwise antagonistic mindset between the religions?