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Did God Create This ???

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Draka

Wonder Woman
Thats right, Yah did do it. Yah had man created and allowed him to have the where for all to learn down through the years in how to develop certain sciences that would enable man to further advance mankind and continue on in Yah's scheme of his big picture.

Just wanted to point out this post. If god "had man created and allowed him to have the where for all to learn down through the years in how to develop certain sciences that would enable man to further advance mankind etc.." then that should also include medical sciences to save lives. If all things are from god, then the ability to save another's life by giving of yourself, quite literally, is from god as well. If it was god who granted us the knowledge and ability to advance our sciences to further "advance mankind" then it was god who helped us discover how to transplant organs, tissue and blood. Since acts of love and compassion are supposedly of god...and to donate your blood or organs after death is an act of compassion and mercy...then transfusions and transplants are ordained by god.
 

Berachiah Ben Yisrael

Active Member
No, I'm really anxious to know what you'd buy after you sue the crap out of someone for saving your life. I get the itching feeling it wouldn't go to charity.

Charity? LOL. Why would I want to give a dollar to an organization that keeps .90 cents and gives only .10 cents to the cause? They call it overhead. I do give to the poor though as much as I can when I can and I also give freewill offerings to my Tabernacle. I really do not know what I would spend it on right now. Might do something nice for my wife and kids. Might take a vacation to the holy land or just invest it to make more. Who knows.

Oh right, right. When it comes to money, it's whatever YOU want, not Yah.

What does Yah need with money? He has no need for the vanities of this world. LOL

The law also states medical personnel must do everything they can to save a life.

Yes it does and I agree.

They break the law if they don't do that. Understand?

Crystal!

In my scenario I was talking ONLY about an emergency where the decision couldn't wait, or you would die. They would, of course, still be trying to contact your wife...but they are DOCTORS. They don't waste precious seconds or minutes, they save you.

And in such a scenario no one is to blame. I haven’t a problem with this.

Yea, I see right through you.
And I assure you, missy. I do you as well. ;)
 

Berachiah Ben Yisrael

Active Member
you are allowing yourself to be bitten:

The Torah doesn’t say that we have to protect ourselves in such a way as to help prevent a bug from sucking on us. When Torah is talking about one allowing something in this context it is speaking on the terms that one would “allow” by writing or word of mouth that a certain abominable act could take place with our permission.

And you're right - normally, this would be rather silly. However, you've made it clear that what you see as God's command cannot be compromised: no blood, period. No ifs, ands or buts. You've said that this is so important that you would sacrifice your own life to obey this command if need be; compared to that, the personal cost of wearing a slightly funny-looking bug suit every now and then is negligible.

Your scenario is silly within any context, not just normal. LOL

I have made it perfectly clear that my choice is for nothing whatsoever from another human being that has living cells with the DNA intact be allowed to enter into my body. I have a power of attorney and living will that states as such.

"Everything created by God is good, and nothing is to be refused, if it is received with thanksgiving, for it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer."

LOL, I thought I answered that already. My answer hasn’t changed.

Let's try again:
- let's assume for the moment that God's will and Law is perfect.

There is no assumption in that ever as far as I am concerned,

- the lens through which any of us might take in that will and Law is ourselves: our senses, our minds.

Your opinion only and not actual proven fact. But anyways………….

- an image is the product of both its object and the lens that created the image.
- a perfect image of a perfect object can only be created by a perfect lens.
- similarily, a perfect understanding of God's will and Law can only be gained by a perfect person.
Do you consider yourself to be a perfect person? If so, then I'd argue that you engage in self-idolatry. If not, then you must acknowledge that you're incapable of perfect certainty in your understanding of God's will and His Law... if you're worried about consistency, anyhow.

It’s not up to me to make that decision. When it is my time to be judged then that decision will be made as to whether I was good enough. No one is perfect but one. I make mistakes each and everyday but what I have been allowed to understand within the Torah is how I believe and it is how I try to live even to perfection with my zeal. Do I sin? I am sure I do unknowingly. Do I presumptuously? I can’t say that I do because I continually make a self analysis and can find nothing within the scope of my knowledge, wisdom and understanding that has been allowed me through the true word of Yah.

Also I would like to state that just because you state something doesn’t mean it is true. You claim the understanding of what self-idolatry is and yet nothing to show any scriptural evidence to back up such claims. Just because one claims to know what Yah meant through his Torah doesn’t mean that he has somehow put himself equal to or greater than Yah.

Not even that, if you believe the 1 Corinthians quote that I mentioned before, that you skipped over (verse 12):

Your going to have to refresh my memory again. If your going to keep bringing up things from other post and you want me to answer to them then you need to post them again or just let it go.
 

Berachiah Ben Yisrael

Active Member
Just wanted to point out this post. If god "had man created and allowed him to have the where for all to learn down through the years in how to develop certain sciences that would enable man to further advance mankind etc.." then that should also include medical sciences to save lives. If all things are from god, then the ability to save another's life by giving of yourself, quite literally, is from god as well. If it was god who granted us the knowledge and ability to advance our sciences to further "advance mankind" then it was god who helped us discover how to transplant organs, tissue and blood. Since acts of love and compassion are supposedly of god...and to donate your blood or organs after death is an act of compassion and mercy...then transfusions and transplants are ordained by god.


I agree that Yah has allowed man to develop such sciences but using those knowledges to commit acts of abomination knowingly is another story altogether. Even though it may save the fleshly body of this world it could destroy the one to come.
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
The Torah doesn’t say that we have to protect ourselves in such a way as to help prevent a bug from sucking on us.
No? Apparently, the Torah means exactly what you want it to mean... nothing more, nothing less. It's one thing to say that "eat" means "transfusion". It's another to say that it means "transfusion, but not other ways you'd be foreseeably exposed to someone else's blood".

When Torah is talking about one allowing something in this context it is speaking on the terms that one would “allow” by writing or word of mouth that a certain abominable act could take place with our permission.
Ah. Moving the goalposts. So... apparently, "allow" doesn't mean to fail to prevent something reasonably foreseeable from happening; it means only verbal or written permission.

By that standard, it would also be acceptable to eat bacon-wrapped scallops, as long as somebody else tossed them into your mouth: "I may have stuck my face in front of them, but I didn't pick them up myself and I didn't ask for them; they just landed in my mouth without my explicit permission!"

In any case, I was just going by what you said before:

I cannot have something that has the living cells, as well as the genetic makeup of another human being, placed inside of my body. That is an abomination before Yah.

Your scenario is silly within any context, not just normal. LOL

I have made it perfectly clear that my choice is for nothing whatsoever from another human being that has living cells with the DNA intact be allowed to enter into my body.
No, you haven't. If that were your choice, logic would dictate that you would stop this from happening as best you can. If you don't protect yourself from bug bites, then you don't do that.

You know that this is how diseases like malaria and Lyme disease are transmitted, right? An insect (mosquito in the case of malaria, tick in the case of Lyme disease) bites a person or animal infected with the disease, ingests their blood, then flies over to you, bites you, injects a fluid to prevent your blood from congealing (which includes blood from its previous victim mixed in) and takes your blood.

If you knowingly expose yourself to mosquitoes or other blood-sucking insects, you knowingly introduce the blood of other people and creatures into your body.

LOL, I thought I answered that already. My answer hasn’t changed.
Your answer was "I do not consider the apostle Shaul as a prophet." This does nothing to explain why you consider his words to carry no weight in this case, but you do in others, which was the question I asked.

Also I would like to state that just because you state something doesn’t mean it is true. You claim the understanding of what self-idolatry is and yet nothing to show any scriptural evidence to back up such claims. Just because one claims to know what Yah meant through his Torah doesn’t mean that he has somehow put himself equal to or greater than Yah.
No; it's claiming that one knows with perfect certainty that does that.

Your going to have to refresh my memory again. If your going to keep bringing up things from other post and you want me to answer to them then you need to post them again or just let it go.
I find it odd that your memory would be so short that you'd forget a passage as you're responding to it, but here it is again - 1 Corinthians 13:12:

Now we see but a poor reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.
 

Berachiah Ben Yisrael

Active Member
No? Apparently, the Torah means exactly what you want it to mean... nothing more, nothing less. It's one thing to say that "eat" means "transfusion". It's another to say that it means "transfusion, but not other ways you'd be foreseeably exposed to someone else's blood".

Well even though I never said that “eat” was “transfusion” you will continue to state that I have. Nonetheless you still do not understand except that which you dream up of your own . So being that your understanding is different then mine then I agree to disagree.

Ah. Moving the goalposts. So... apparently, "allow" doesn't mean to fail to prevent something reasonably foreseeable from happening; it means only verbal or written permission.
By that standard, it would also be acceptable to eat bacon-wrapped scallops, as long as somebody else tossed them into your mouth: "I may have stuck my face in front of them, but I didn't pick them up myself and I didn't ask for them; they just landed in my mouth without my explicit permission!"
In any case, I was just going by what you said before:

Then you totally do not understand if you are still saying this after what I said. You don’t have a clue. If you were truly going by what I said then you wouldn’t continue in posting false accusations as to what you say I said. And being that we differ in our understanding then I agree to disagree.

No, you haven't. If that were your choice, logic would dictate that you would stop this from happening as best you can. If you don't protect yourself from bug bites, then you don't do that.

I stop it by choosing not to accept it. What happens by others or things are of no concern. This is outside of Torah. This is my belief and what I accept and as it differs from yours then I agree to disagree.

You know that this is how diseases like malaria and Lyme disease are transmitted, right? An insect (mosquito in the case of malaria, tick in the case of Lyme disease) bites a person or animal infected with the disease, ingests their blood, then flies over to you, bites you, injects a fluid to prevent your blood from congealing (which includes blood from its previous victim mixed in) and takes your blood.
If you knowingly expose yourself to mosquitoes or other blood-sucking insects, you knowingly introduce the blood of other people and creatures into your body.

Well then I guess I have to admit to read the minds of bugs as well as know from who or what they last sucked on to be in sin for not covering myself as all the other people in the scripture. I bet Moshe and Shlomo both looked hot in their but net suits. We do so differ in our beliefs and understandings so I will have to agree to disagree.

Your answer was "I do not consider the apostle Shaul as a prophet."

He wasn’t a prophet. He was one that was considered an overseer of the assemblies. He was an apostle. He established assemblies and traveled not to much unlike a circuit judge from one to another explaining and teaching the true word of Yah.

This does nothing to explain why you consider his words to carry no weight in this case, but you do in others, which was the question I asked.

Did I say his words didn’t carry any weight? Ummmmmmmm. If I did then I might have misspoken. His words, unless repeating the Torah, are just his opinions on such but are not the truly inspired works as we see with the Torah and the prophets.

Your biggest argument here is that you want to believe that where in Tim it stated about “the word of Yah sanctified it” you feel that this verse is where it sanctified it but it didn’t. You would have to say that 1Timothy was in fact Torah and it is plainly nothing more than a letter to Timothy. The sanctification of the foods we eat again are found in the Torah and not the NT. But as I have answered you to great lengths to my own exhaustion, it is evident that we do not see eye to eye so I will agree to disagree.

No; it's claiming that one knows with perfect certainty that does that.

Really? What are your sources? Never mind. We won’t agree here either so I agree to disagree

I find it odd that your memory would be so short that you'd forget a passage as you're responding to it, but here it is again - 1 Corinthians 13:12:

Hey something else we agree on. I think it odd too.
What was the question about this verse?

 

painted wolf

Grey Muzzle
What about kissing?
You get the cells and genetic material of other human beings inside you when you kiss.

What about sex? That's the ultimate genetic swap!

wa:do
 

Berachiah Ben Yisrael

Active Member
Just wanted to point out this post. If god "had man created and allowed him to have the where for all to learn down through the years in how to develop certain sciences that would enable man to further advance mankind etc.." then that should also include medical sciences to save lives.

It does.

If all things are from god, then the ability to save another's life by giving of yourself, quite literally, is from god as well.

Not if you believe in Torah.

If it was god who granted us the knowledge and ability to advance our sciences to further "advance mankind" then it was god who helped us discover how to transplant organs, tissue and blood. Since acts of love and compassion are supposedly of god...and to donate your blood or organs after death is an act of compassion and mercy...then transfusions and transplants are ordained by god.

I think you are confusing the deceptions of Helel with the will of Yah. I believe Yah said it was wrong to do these things. I also believe there are times you confuse your own emotions as the will of Yah as well. I see we disagree so I agree to disagree.
 

Berachiah Ben Yisrael

Active Member
What about kissing?
You get the cells and genetic material of other human beings inside you when you kiss.

What about sex? That's the ultimate genetic swap!

wa:do

It would need be mouth to mouth and even then it more than likely would be between husbands and wives which isn't under the same thing because they become as one. Very good question though. I liked that, thanks. I would have to also say that its not even close to blood or body parts. Ummmmmm. What makes up "spit"? :D
 

Sententia

Well-Known Member
I have made it perfectly clear that my choice is for nothing whatsoever from another human being that has living cells with the DNA intact be allowed to enter into my body. I have a power of attorney and living will that states as such.

LOL... I find this hysterical. 21st century world with 1st century medicine. The book you believe in is false as is the god. :yes:
 

Draka

Wonder Woman
Just thought of something else. Since children are made up half from each parent then would it really be wrong for a parent to donate blood or tissue to a child? They are not taking anything into their body that isn't already a part of them. Half their DNA, half of their genes, are from you anyway. So if your child were dying and you were of the same blood type would it be alright for you to donate part of you which is half of what they already are? Do you see my point at all?
 

stacey bo bacey

oh no you di'int
Charity? LOL. Why would I want to give a dollar to an organization that keeps .90 cents and gives only .10 cents to the cause? They call it overhead. I do give to the poor though as much as I can when I can and I also give freewill offerings to my Tabernacle. I really do not know what I would spend it on right now. Might do something nice for my wife and kids. Might take a vacation to the holy land or just invest it to make more. Who knows.

Hmm, very interesting. The only reason I would ever want that much money would be to give it away. And yet, here you are, someone who claims to try to do everything they can to please Yah and you would spend it on yourself.



What does Yah need with money? He has no need for the vanities of this world. LOL

Haha! What the hell are you talking about? I never even alluded to that kind of thought. I said when it comes to money, it's whatever YOU want to do (i.e.--sue someone). Would Yah want someone to be so vengeful? Methinks not.



Super!



And in such a scenario no one is to blame. I haven’t a problem with this.

Which is the scenario I laid out originally until you took it off somewhere else. So good. You agree. That wasn't so hard, was it?


And I assure you, missy. I do you as well. ;)

Very doubtful. ;) And don't call me missy, punk.
 

stacey bo bacey

oh no you di'int
I agree that Yah has allowed man to develop such sciences but using those knowledges to commit acts of abomination knowingly is another story altogether. Even though it may save the fleshly body of this world it could destroy the one to come.

:biglaugh: Oh yea, I'm sure scientists and doctors made sure to check the Torah every time they invented or developed something...just to make sure it didn't conflict with god's word. :rolleyes: Aaaaaaahahahahaha.
 

darkendless

Guardian of Asgaard
I agree that Yah has allowed man to develop such sciences but using those knowledges to commit acts of abomination knowingly is another story altogether. Even though it may save the fleshly body of this world it could destroy the one to come.

Who are you and what does your religion think it is to claim to know what is and is not an abomination?
 

FFH

Veteran Member
Did God make this possible ??? :angel2:
nachopizza.jpg


Nacho Pizza
  • Whole Wheat Pizza Dough
  • Blue Corn Tortilla chips
  • Pizza Sauce
  • Chili or ground meat flavored with taco seasoning
  • Mexican blend cheese
  • Lots of jalepenos
  • Black beans
  • Salsa
 
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