Christ Is King, But Business Is Business?

[rocka21]

They all lived under Jewish law not Christs.
No one know if they are all in Heaven.

new testament rich man.

57When the even was come, there came a rich man of Arimathaea, named Joseph, who also himself was Jesus' disciple:


poverty is of the DEVIL!

look at the picture above. You tell me Jesus likes that? someone starving, sick, with no clothes. I see the devil there and not jesus.

the doctrine of Poverty is one of the greatest LIES ever told to the new testament church.

God gives us Power to get wealth, God supplies all our needs, God give us richly all things to enjoy.

I thank God that i am RICH and am not ashamed.

2 Corinthians 8:9
For ye know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that, though he was rich, yet for your sakes he became poor, that ye through his poverty might be rich.

 

[Bishka]

so David and Solomon fell from grace because they had money? .... ok......

Perhaps that was one of the underlying reasons they fell from grace, because of greed and pride.

and yes they had wealth in the PHYSICAL FINANCIAL WAY. Do you really need me to pull scriptures?

Aboslutley. There have been several scriptures stated in the obvious that God is not a God of physical financial wealth. If you are going to state that the scriptures support something you might as well show us where.

 

[Majikthise]

God allows suffering in this life so He can judge those who were in a position to help but did nothing..

Sorry, but that is messed up.

 

[Bishka]

2 Corinthians 8:9
For ye know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that, though he was rich, yet for your sakes he became poor, that ye through his poverty might be rich.

I believe this is a twisting of scripture. Jesus Christ was never phsycially rich in this mortal world. His father was a carpenter and His mother stayed home. That's not brining much money into the home and neither did Christ, He went out and preached the gospel with nothing but the clothing on His back.

What I beleive this scripture is referring to is eternal riches, and eternal rewards. Jesus Christ was rich in the eternal sense, by that, I mean He was literally God's Son, I don't think you can get any more eternal then that. Then for our sakes, He became poor, He descdended beneath everything and bled from every pore of His body so that we could taste the richnes of His Father who was in Heaven.

The scripture has nothing to do with physical wealth, but everything to do with spiritual wealth and eternal rewards.

 

[Majikthise]

poverty is of the DEVIL!

Yet god allows it. Ok.

 

[Radio Frequency X]

God allows suffering in this life so He can judge those who were in a position to help but did nothing.

Things will definitely be reversed in Heaven.

This is not a very good god.

 

[rocka21]

Perhaps that was one of the underlying reasons they fell from grace, because of greed and pride.



Aboslutley. There have been several scriptures stated in the obvious that God is not a God of physical financial wealth. If you are going to state that the scriptures support something you might as well show us where.

Ok becky, just for you.


Genesis 13:2
And Abram was very rich in cattle, in silver, and in gold.

Joshua 22:8
And he spake unto them, saying, Return with much riches unto your tents, and with very much cattle, with silver, and with gold, and with brass, and with iron, and with very much raiment: divide the spoil of your enemies with your brethren.

Deuteronomy 8:18
But thou shalt remember the LORD thy God: for it is he that giveth thee power to get wealth, that he may establish his covenant which he sware unto thy fathers, as it is this day.

2 Chronicles 1:12
Wisdom and knowledge is granted unto thee; and I will give thee riches, and wealth, and honour, such as none of the kings have had that have been before thee, neither shall there any after thee have the like.

Ecclesiastes 5:19
Every man also to whom God hath given riches and wealth, and hath given him power to eat thereof, and to take his portion, and to rejoice in his labour; this is the gift of God.


Job 31:25
If I rejoice because my wealth was great, and because mine hand had gotten much;

1. Psalm 66:12
   Thou hast caused men to ride over our heads; we went through fire and through water: but thou broughtest us out into a wealthy place.
2. Psalm 112:3
   Wealth and riches shall be in his house: and his righteousness endureth for ever.
3. Proverbs 13:22
   A good man leaveth an inheritance to his children's children: and the wealth of the sinner is laid up for the just.

 

[doppelganger]

They fired him because he was too slow.

These owners mark up their decks enough to rake in a fortune in profits each year. By replacing the man with someone a bit faster, they will have saved on labor costs and thus "earned" a bit more profit. Jesus wants you to be rich.

Perhaps they did him a favor. Who knows? He knows how to build high end decks with enormous profit margins, so he should start his own business doing it and keep the profits of his labor for himself.

He can even teach some young bucks how to design and build high-end decks, too, paying them for their labor and marking it up like his former employers did. That way he can increase his volume of sales and if one of them is too slow, he can make the decision for himself whether he needs to find someone else.

But, the OP is right, "Jesus" is a brand and when it's associated with a business or a political position it is usually a con. Business and politics should rise and fall on their own merits rather than hooking up to the emotional connection people associate with a religious symbol. When someone feels compelled to do the latter it's a sign something is suspect to me.

Take Tom Delay, for example. While going on and on about his duties as a Christian politician championing the causes of unborn fetuses and vegetative women, and enjoying enormous support from Evangelicals and Fundamentalist Christians, he was also taking money to protect people who were subjecting teenaged girls to forced prostitution and forced abortions in the Northern Marianas Islands, and advancing legislation for gambling operations.

http://www.tompaine.com/articles/2006/05/09/sex_greed_and_forced_abortions.php

One would imagine that Tom DeLay, a right-wing Christian, would be appalled by the teeming red-light district of Saipan, the main island in the Micronesian chain of the Northern Marianas. Or Jack Abramoff, an Orthodox Jew. Yet these two men have been among the strongest supporters of an exploitative labor and immigration system on Saipan that has helped fuel not just this sex tourism, but work arrangements that are tantamount to indentured servitude.
When asked about reports of forced prostitution and labor abuses, DeLay told the Galveston County Daily News in May 2005: “Sure, when you get this number of people, there are stories of sexual exploitation. But in interviewing these employees one-on-one, there was no evidence of any of that going on. No evidence of sweatshops as portrayed by the national media. It’s a beautiful island with beautiful people who are happy about what’s happening.”
No evidence? DeLay’s support persisted even when a Department of Interior report documented that workers in Saipan’s garment factories were coerced into having unwanted abortions. The damage continues to this day, even though both men have been stripped of their power.
The Northern Mariana Islands are a U.S. territory, and thus subject to most U.S. laws. But the 30,000 “guest workers” there—predominately women from China, the Philippines, and Thailand who sew clothing for top-name American brands, which are then allowed to label them “Made in Saipan (USA),” “Made in Northern Mariana Islands (USA)," or simply “Made in USA”—are not covered by U.S. minimum-wage and immigration laws.

I don't know about the rest of y'all, but I'm definitely anti-forced abortions - even if it means my Banana Republic shirt will cost a little more.

 

[rocka21]

Yet god allows it. Ok.

yes, we lived on a cursed earth......

thats a whole other topic.........

 

[doppelganger]

yes, we lived on a cursed earth......

thats a whole other topic.........

From where do we derive authority to judge "God" or "Creation"?

 

[Random]

From where do we derive authority to judge "God" or "Creation"?

That's make an interesting thread of its own. I believe we humans are born to stand in judgement of Heaven and Earth, we are the Prime race of this universe and our Cosmic destiny is to be the rightful custodians of creation. But maybe I'm nuts...

 

[Cynic]

"Jesus said to him, "If you wish to be perfect, go, sell what you have and give to (the) poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me."When the young man heard this statement, he went away sad, for he had many possessions. Then Jesus said to his disciples, "Amen, I say to you, it will be hard for one who is rich to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I say to you, it is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for one who is rich to enter the kingdom of God." Matthew 19:21-24

Now this is all my opinion:
It doesn't matter if you are rich or poor, that is not the point itself. You don't have to be a bum living on the street. What matters are the attachments one carries. Those who aren't willing to give up what they have in abundance are attached to the material. Those who are willing have no attachments and find contentment in spiritual things, and thus have little need for material riches.
Spiritual wealth brings contentment and self sufficiency where you have no desire in an abundance of worldy things.

"Once, having been asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, Jesus replied, "The kingdom of God does not come with your careful observation, nor will people say, 'Here it is,' or 'There it is,' because the kingdom of God is within you." Luke 17:20-21

What exactly is the kingdom of God? Certainly it's not a place, as Jesus describes it. Rather the kingdom of God is within you. Perhaps it is a state of being that one realizes.

 

[doppelganger]

That's make an interesting thread of its own. I believe we humans are born to stand in judgement of Heaven and Earth, we are the Prime race of this universe and our Cosmic destiny is to be the rightful custodians of creation. But maybe I'm nuts...

Have you read Carl Jung's Response to Job? It is a very insightful exploration of the judgment of "God" and our authority to do so. If you have the means, I highly recommend it.

 

[Halcyon]

2 Corinthians 8:9
For ye know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that, though he was rich, yet for your sakes he became poor, that ye through his poverty might be rich.

The scriptures are very clear on this rocka;

Matthew 19:21-24
Jesus answered, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me."
When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth. Then Jesus said to his disciples, "I tell you the truth, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven.
Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."

You can deny that all you want, but these words (if you believe in the Bible) issued from the mouth of Jesus himself.
As a Christian, anything from the Old Testament or from the letters of Paul and other apostles are secondary to the testament of Christ's own words.

As a Christian you should be ashamed to be excessively wealthy, as clearly you are rich because you are not donating enough to the poor.

 

[Cynic]

2 Corinthians 8:9
For ye know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that, though he was rich, yet for your sakes he became poor, that ye through his poverty might be rich.

In other words Christ came down into the flesh to spread the good news, so that we would be spiritually "rich".

And considering how Paul and the early church ran their business, I would assume a literal interpretation would be totally out of context.

 

[rocka21]

The scriptures are very clear on this rocka;

Matthew 19:21-24
Jesus answered, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me."
When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth. Then Jesus said to his disciples, "I tell you the truth, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven.
Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."

You can deny that all you want, but these words (if you believe in the Bible) issued from the mouth of Jesus himself.
As a Christian, anything from the Old Testament or from the letters of Paul and other apostles are secondary to the testament of Christ's own words.

As a Christian you should be ashamed to be excessively wealthy, as clearly you are rich because you are not donating enough to the poor.

yes Halcyon the scripture is VERY clear

Matthew 19

20The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet?
21Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.
22But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions.

He did not possess money, money possessed him
23Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven.
24And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
25When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved?
the disciples were AMANZED and said, who can be saved? ONLY POOR PEOPLE?

26But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.
27Then answered Peter and said unto him, Behold, we have forsaken all, and followed thee; what shall we have therefore?
28And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. 29And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life.

Jesus was not trying to take his money, he was going to give him a hundredfold.



22And he was sad at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions.
23And Jesus looked round about, and saith unto his disciples, How hardly shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God!
24And the disciples were astonished at his words. But Jesus answereth again, and saith unto them, Children, how hard is it for them that trust in riches to enter into the kingdom of God!
25It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
26And they were astonished out of measure, saying among themselves, Who then can be saved?
27And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.
28Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee.
29And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's, 30But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.

NOW IN THIS TIME! :angel2:

see my friend, ........ VERY PLAIN


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[Random]

Have you read Carl Jung's Response to Job? It is a very insightful exploration of the judgment of "God" and our authority to do so. If you have the means, I highly recommend it.

I'll look out for it, thanks.

 

[rocka21]

As a Christian you should be ashamed to be excessively wealthy, as clearly you are rich because you are not donating enough to the poor.


Excessively wealthy by whose standards, yours?

have you donated to the poor more than me?

the reason I have money to donate to the poor is because i am rich. The more riches i have , the more good i can do for them.

 

[Cynic]

29And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life.

Okay, lets study the context of this saying.
First,

And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake.

Clearly this means leaving behind possessions and family members to follow Jesus.
So in a sense he is saying that if you leave everything behind and follow him, then you will inherit more wealth, which is not necassarily material, but more likely spiritual in meaning.
Jesus asked his disciples to leave everything behind and come follow him. Did Jesus literally give them a hundredfold of dinari afterwards? Did the disciples become rich?

 

[rocka21]

I have no attachments to my riches. They are a tools in my hand. Money is my servant , not my master. I have loose strings on all i possess. I don't lust after money, but money in your life helps alot. it is a blessing from god , not a curse. Jesus made a point to warn people not to make money your master. if you think the richer you are the farther away from god you are and the poorer you are the closer to God you are, thats just nuts!