nutshell
Well-Known Member
So you believe that faith is illogical?
Yes I do. But that doesn't affect its value.
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So you believe that faith is illogical?
Does logic and reasoning have value?Yes I do. But that doesn't affect its value.
Ok, after posting on another thread "Non-Trinitarians" the following:-
I had the following response from angellous:-
It brought an interesting topic up (which could not be debated there....) Can religion be logical? can you "choose" a religion and find the truth based on logic? I think it can. To me, If I cant find logic, I dont think its true!
What are you thoughts?
And which one of you is now the guy with the fastest serve in tennis?haha nikki, if you only grew up playin tennis w/ roddick your "andy roddickism" would be shattered ... i used to play w/ the guy in boys 18s and he was the definition of a cry baby.
If we were to actually track and document the success/failure rates of evidenced/granted entreaties/prayers of a god, would it then be reasonable and "logical" to surmise/expect that piety and adherence would provide the most empirically derived evidences as support of such a claim
Hey, of course religion can be logical. I like to call it "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints."
I think that God's church has to be based on truth and logic. It would make no sense to me that God made a confusing and contradictory church although many people throughout the centuries have turned religion into such a thing.
That's why God had to come clear everything up again.
IMHO of course.
Does logic and reasoning have value?
I'll disagree with my Mormon brothers and sisters and say NO - religion cannot be logical because it is based on faith. I cannot reconcile the two. Does that make a religion any more or less true? Nope.
My answer to this would be: Only within the context of its domain, ie in the religious domain.Can religion be logical?
haha nikki, if you only grew up playin tennis w/ roddick your "andy roddickism" would be shattered ... i used to play w/ the guy in boys 18s and he was the definition of a cry baby.
When I said it can be logical, I think that some doctrines or teachings can be more logical than others. Take, for instance, these two biblical teachings:I'll disagree with my Mormon brothers and sisters and say NO - religion cannot be logical because it is based on faith. I cannot reconcile the two. Does that make a religion any more or less true? Nope.
I'll disagree with my Mormon brothers and sisters and say NO - religion cannot be logical because it is based on faith. I cannot reconcile the two. Does that make a religion any more or less true? Nope.
Is this supposed to convey some deeper meaning or allusion?
I this supposed to be some trick, but trite, question?
Of course logic and reasoning help us all to distinguish between that which remains worthless, and that which is valued as "priceless"?
If we deny our species access to either logic or reason in formulating/delivering compelling d clarations of satisfying
Exactly. And at some point, going backwards from fact to fact, you must simply accept a fact, unproven (that is to say - on faith), from which to work. I can logically prove that I am really sweaty right now, but only if I take on faith that I actually did just get back from work. Or, I could prove that I just got back from work if I just accept that I went to work in the morning. Etc. It is simply impossible to prove every single statement. You must take something on faith before logic can even set in. Faith preceeds logic in other words.Logic can only deal with the facts it is given.
That's why math is so fun. It's philosophy at its best.It cannot reason from an effect to a cause. It does not have to refer to anything real. Mathematics is the ultimate expression of logic. Yet its statemetns are entirely self contained. You do not have to actualy have a given number of an object to solve a math problem.
It brought an interesting topic up (which could not be debated there....) Can religion be logical? can you "choose" a religion and find the truth based on logic? I think it can. To me, If I cant find logic, I dont think its true!
What are you thoughts?
Exactly. And at some point, going backwards from fact to fact, you must simply accept a fact, unproven (that is to say - on faith), from which to work. I can logically prove that I am really sweaty right now, but only if I take on faith that I actually did just get back from work. Or, I could prove that I just got back from work if I just accept that I went to work in the morning. Etc. It is simply impossible to prove every single statement. You must take something on faith before logic can even set in. Faith preceeds logic in other words.