-
Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:- Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
- Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
- Access to private conversations with other members.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
Can Confucianism be considered a religion?
- Thread starter glass
- Start date
Doktormartini
å°è
No, not according to my Chinese history university professor and I don't think it is either. I believe it's more of a political philosophy.
Secret Chief
nirvana is samsara
This tangles with the typical Western view of religions involving deities. It is often asked Is Buddhism a religion? It clearly has the characteristics of one but the denial of a creator deity causes confusion to some Western minds.
Although Confucius was primarily a philosopher concerned with morality and social behaviour, his thinking interacted with other philosophies / religions such as Daoism and Buddhism. This can be seen represented here:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vinegar_tasters
Although Confucius was primarily a philosopher concerned with morality and social behaviour, his thinking interacted with other philosophies / religions such as Daoism and Buddhism. This can be seen represented here:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vinegar_tasters
Last edited by a moderator:
Leftimies
Dwelling in the Principle
I am a Confucian adherent, and yes it is a religion. Do not come and tell me that I am not religious person while I am paying my spiritual respects to Heaven and it's ruler Shangdi. It is a religion, a guide intended to lead its followers to fulfill the Will of Heaven. It has temples, holy sites and I can quote Confucius saying "Heaven means to one with God" right from this seat.
Confucianism. Is. A. Religion.
Confucianism. Is. A. Religion.
Vishvavajra
Active Member
Neo-Confucianism was explicitly designed to function as a religion in competition with Buddhism. In that regard it is a religion in every sense of the word.
Classical Confucianism, by contrast, was developed as a philosophy of life based on a humanistic view of traditional values and practices, whatever those happened to be. It is therefore something that people of just about any religious culture can appreciate and put into practice. Definitely not a religion in the modern sense of the word.
Classical Confucianism, by contrast, was developed as a philosophy of life based on a humanistic view of traditional values and practices, whatever those happened to be. It is therefore something that people of just about any religious culture can appreciate and put into practice. Definitely not a religion in the modern sense of the word.
Last edited:
GoodbyeDave
Well-Known Member
As I've said elsewhere on the forum, the idea of the "three Chinese religions" is a Western one. Confucius wrote about philosophy and politics and practiced the same religion as his contemporaries.
Theweirdtophat
Well-Known Member
Isn't a religion by default a philosophy? Doesn't it have guidelines of how one should live their life? I see religion as a spiritual philosophy.
NoGuru
Don't be serious. Seriously
Came for this. I've just recently finished the Analects of Confucius and while I found some of it rather... Lengthy in some things not really interesting (just as discussions of certain rulers, etc.), it was a good read. I'd never heard of it being a religion until I found this sub-forum and was curious as to how it could be. But to this quote below:
It makes sense how it can be. Christianity is a religion based upon a man that lived and claimed divine powers. Buddhism is much in the same. Stories told by men that speak of something greater. I'm not doubting any sect their perceived divinity, merely pointing out the value of the above quote.
Which is a reasonable way to view it as the Analects contained much in the way of governing people. Some of the fundamental or "Golden rules" were also there. The Bible has similar directives regarding ruling a people, but people tend to focus on Christ's message (if Christian) as opposed to the other pages therein.
Animore
Active Member
Response to OP.
Religion is defined as "
the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods."
Let's see if this holds up for Confucius.
-Do people believe in Confucius?
Well, sort of. They believed his teachings.
-Do people worship Confucius?
Not really, no. It's more of honoring him.
-Is Confucius superhuman?
No, he was mortal.
-Did he control power?
No, he was for tradition and power, but he didn't control it.
-Was Confucius a God?
Nope, he was mortal, and as already addressed, not superhuman.
I think it's safe, then, to say that it's not a religion, but more-so a philosophy. But that's just how I feel.
Religion is defined as "
the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods."
Let's see if this holds up for Confucius.
-Do people believe in Confucius?
Well, sort of. They believed his teachings.
-Do people worship Confucius?
Not really, no. It's more of honoring him.
-Is Confucius superhuman?
No, he was mortal.
-Did he control power?
No, he was for tradition and power, but he didn't control it.
-Was Confucius a God?
Nope, he was mortal, and as already addressed, not superhuman.
I think it's safe, then, to say that it's not a religion, but more-so a philosophy. But that's just how I feel.
The Emperor of Mankind
Currently the galaxy's spookiest paraplegic
Just like people believe in Jesus? Also, Confucius taught people to venerate Heaven as the highest authority. While not a specific deity or group of deities, Heaven is supernatural in that it has control over the Universe through abilities we would consider to be magical. Confucius' birth can be considered one such Heaven-ordained action.
There are temples dedicated to Confucius & his followers where people can make sacrifices. AFAIK, targeted worship of something is the province of religions, not philosophy.
I think there's a lot of Venn-style overlap here.
Religion can also be defined as: "A set of beliefs manifesting an ethic among adherents." A lot depends on how you define something.
Religion is also commonly associated with rituals, temples and professional practitioners -- which Confucianism has.
Not my DIR, but I sure think the whole question is rather arbitrary.
Of course Confucianism is a religion.
Some versions of it are even theistic, including (so I am told) the early ones, although I think it is a flat-out mistake to care about whether it does.
Of course Confucianism is a religion.
Some versions of it are even theistic, including (so I am told) the early ones, although I think it is a flat-out mistake to care about whether it does.
Samantha Rinne
Resident Genderfluid Writer/Artist
In order to be considered a religion, there are a number of standards. Some of the more common ones are 1. belief system, 2. community, 3. myths/stories, 4. rituals, 5. ethics, 6. emotional state (believers experience joy, calm, etc), 7. material expression (using stuff in their worship), 8. sacredness
http://college.holycross.edu/projects/himalayan_cultures/2011_plans/sshmitt/images/Elements.pdf
A deity is not essential to a religion. But a sense of wonder kinda is. Confucianism is more a philosophy than a religion, as it completely lacks #3, #6, and #8.
http://college.holycross.edu/projects/himalayan_cultures/2011_plans/sshmitt/images/Elements.pdf
A deity is not essential to a religion. But a sense of wonder kinda is. Confucianism is more a philosophy than a religion, as it completely lacks #3, #6, and #8.
I am not aware of any general consensus among scholars of religion on what the requirements for a religion must be.
Buddha Dharma
Dharma Practitioner
Confucianism is arguably a religion because it accepts Wu Wei. Edward Slingerland explained that Taoism and Confucianism's contentions boil down to different approaches to Wu Wei.
Taoists believe you return to Wu Wei through not self, while Confucians believe one lines up through the right moral code.
For the Chinese, Wu Wei is inseparable from the essential nature. You are acting in accord with the essential nature when your actions are effortless.
The Confucian approach is the legalistic approach. That you're acting with nature when you know what the correct actions are to do so. Confucians hold right action is living by the ethics of the religion.
Buddhism became another approach to Wu Wei for the Chinese. That's why Taoism, Confucianism, and Buddhism are called the Three Ways in China's history.
Taoists believe you return to Wu Wei through not self, while Confucians believe one lines up through the right moral code.
For the Chinese, Wu Wei is inseparable from the essential nature. You are acting in accord with the essential nature when your actions are effortless.
The Confucian approach is the legalistic approach. That you're acting with nature when you know what the correct actions are to do so. Confucians hold right action is living by the ethics of the religion.
Buddhism became another approach to Wu Wei for the Chinese. That's why Taoism, Confucianism, and Buddhism are called the Three Ways in China's history.
Last edited:
Samantha Rinne
Resident Genderfluid Writer/Artist
Those 8 or 9 are widely accepted as the difference between philosophy and religion. The main difference is some people believe it needs all of them, and some, just think a majority is okay. I'm in the majority group, but I do think a religion should have a sense of faith, which Confucianism is kinda lacking.
I guess that bit about Wu Wei makes sense though.