Let this thread be a place to collect every passage
anyone can find that could shed light on whether or
not a fetus is the same as a baby.
anyone can find that could shed light on whether or
not a fetus is the same as a baby.
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"Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I appointed you a prophet to the nations.”Let this thread be a place to collect every passage
anyone can find that could shed light on whether or
not a fetus is the same as a baby.
"Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I appointed you a prophet to the nations.”
"For You formed my inward parts;
You wove me in my mother’s womb.
I will give thanks to You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made;
Wonderful are Your works,
And my soul knows it very well.
My frame was not hidden from You,
When I was made in secret,
And skillfully wrought in the depths of the earth;"
The Lord said to her,
“Two nations are in your womb;
And two peoples will be separated from your body;
And one people shall be stronger than the other;
And the older shall serve the younger.”
When her days to be delivered were fulfilled, behold, there were twins in her womb.
"Did not He who made me in the womb make him,
And the same one fashion us in the womb?"
"When Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the baby leaped in her womb; and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit. And she cried out with a loud voice and said, “Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb! And how has it happened to me, that the mother of my Lord would come to me?"
So *before* someone was in the womb, he was known. In other words, he was known even before conception.
That doesn't say much about the status of a fetus as a baby.
OK, so the commonplace fact that humans develop in the womb says what about the actual question?
Clearly an allegory. And, again, it says nothing about the actual moral status of the fetus in the womb.
And, again, humans are made in the womb. That doesn't say anything about the moral status of the fetus in the womb.
Sort of a special case, don't you think?
It certainly does. Are you trying to say God knew him before conception then forgot and he became a nothing until birth?So *before* someone was in the womb, he was known. In other words, he was known even before conception.
That doesn't say much about the status of a fetus as a baby.
That a human is valuable at every stage.OK, so the commonplace fact that humans develop in the womb says what about the actual question?
Proof that the fetus was a baby is what I think.Sort of a special case, don't you think?
It certainly does. Are you trying to say God knew him before conception then forgot and he became a nothing until birth?
"So *before* someone was in the womb, he was known. In other words, he was known even before conception."
It takes about 6-12 days for a fertilized egg to travel to the uterus and attach to the uterus.
So maybe its saying he knew them once the egg was fertilized, before it reaches the uterus(womb).
22 “When people who are fighting injure a pregnant woman so that there is a miscarriage and yet no further harm follows, the one responsible shall be fined what the woman’s husband demands, paying as much as the judges determine. 23 If any harm follows, then you shall give life for life, 24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, 25 burn for burn, wound for wound, stripe for stripe."
Exodus 21:22-25
"she has made herself impure and been unfaithful to her husband, this will be the result: When she is made to drink the water that brings a curse and causes bitter suffering, it will enter her, her abdomen will swell and her womb will miscarry, and she will become a curse. 28 If, however, the woman has not made herself impure, but is clean, she will be cleared of guilt and will be able to have children.
29 “‘This, then, is the law of jealousy when a woman goes astray and makes herself impure while married to her husband, 30 or when feelings of jealousy come over a man because he suspects his wife. The priest is to have her stand before the Lord and is to apply this entire law to her. 31 The husband will be innocent of any wrongdoing, but the woman will bear the consequences of her sin."
Numbers 5:11-31
Are you trying to say potential human beings who aren't even conceived have the same status as a baby?
I see you avoiding the question.
8 days as in 8 days from conception?Either way, this specific male fetus is similar to a fully developed viable child from the perspective of "the Lord". It's at least 8 days old or equivilent.
no sorry8 days as in 8 days from conception?
Actually, I need to revoke this one. I just remembered. In the story, God names Isaac before he was conceived. So it doesn't work. Sorry.Here's my submission: Not the best, but it's something.
Isaiah 49:1
1Hearken, you islands, to me, and listen closely, you nations, from afar; the Lord called me from the womb, from the innards of my mother He mentioned my name.Fetuses are not named; Jewish tradition is that babies are named after they are deemed viable, for boys it's 8 days after birth. I don't know the rules for girls. Either way, this specific male fetus is similar to a fully developed viable child from the perspective of "the Lord". It's at least 8 days old or equivilent.