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Featured Any questions about the Jehovah's witness faith?

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by capumetu, Dec 27, 2020.

  1. Love God

    Love God Member

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    I am sorry.

    I do not speak Greek. I speak English.
    Not only do I not speak Greek, I do not speak Hebrew.

    You have done what all man-made religions do.

    You have bound up God’s words so that you have control, final authority, and then being able to lord over an ‘uneducated’ dimwit because ‘you know the Greek’.
    And because you know Greek you get to make up what ‘God really meant’.

    Typical religious bondage... not to mention treacherous and deceitful.


    Does the NWT contain errors?
    Why do you have to run to the Greek?
    Does the Greek contain errors?
    How about the Hebrew texts?
    Does the Hebrew contain errors?

    What kind of god do you serve that gives you books full of errors?
    How about a god that says 'you have to know Greek’...or that ‘only the originals are inspired’...
    (FYI. Jesus said to search the scriptures to find him. Did he mean flawed, packed full of errors scriptures!!! Or did Jesus mean for anyone to ‘try and find’ the original inspired scriptures that do not exist! Not very nice of Jesus to do that!!!)

    Why would I serve God if he lies!
    I can lie plenty enough lies on my own. Not only me, but I know plenty of others that can tell some real whoppers, too!

    So don’t waste your Greek on me. I have an inspired word, written on a fifth grade level, in English that any English speaking dummy can know.

    imagine.

    A perfect God who has one book with no errors.

    That is my God.

    (And he saves any sinner that will trust him. Woot! Good news for any sinner! Double woot! All that and heaven, too! Triple woot!)
    I Love God!

    My Joy is beyond containment!

    “God is not a man, that he should lie;
    neither the son of man, that he should repent:
    hath he said, and shall he not do it?
    or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good?”
    ‭‭Numbers‬ ‭23:19‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    This is my God!
     
  2. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    It is the standard of the ' ancient manuscripts ' that support Bible canon, so any translation can be compared to them.
    That is a reason why we know Mark 16 ends at verse 8 and the rest of chapter 16 was an add on (KJV)
    The apocryphal books or verses simply exclude themselves being out of harmony with the harmonious '66' Bible books.
    Bible canon was already established early on the scene that is why the Bible can be testified as to what is the acceptable Word of God.
    Do you have a particular verse or passage in mind that you think might contain an error _________________
    - www.jw.org
     
  3. Love God

    Love God Member

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    I have to admit, I admire your faith in your religion.

    religions are like sport teams to me. Everyone loves their favourite team!

    I do not know if you were born into your religion, switched from another religion, or new convert fresh out of the world...

    my assumption is that you were born into the JW’s. Your education would indicate that to be the matter. And, yes, that is important.

    I understand being ‘born into religion’. I was born into the largest, most ‘powerful’ cult on earth. When I got saved, the backlash from the religion and my family and my friends and almost every other person who is not saved, is real.

    I was 47 years of age when I accepted the reality that I was a sinner in need of a Saviour.
    That God’s plan of salvation is through his only begotten Son, who was not created but always is, that paid the penalty for any sinner who asks so that they can go to heaven and live the right life, the life meant for all mankind.

    I do understand manuscript evidence. I am not a scholar in one field or the other. If I wore a younger man’s clothes, I would do nothing but study the languages of the bible. As I love languages and words.
    I love words.
    But I thank God he gave me words in my native tongue! And error free at that! That I can trust with my whole heart!

    I did not have access nor did I possess the confidence needed to pursue education on my own. That is my only ‘regret’ if I had any.

    and that being because I cannot engage with you about the ‘Greek originals’... and which version of Greek you espouse and where the ‘original Greek’ manuscripts may be...

    I really did take this verse literally:


    “But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:”
    ‭‭1 Peter‬ ‭3:15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    To have an answer for everyone is a rather lofty expectation is it not?

    you expected me to know Greek! The next man may expect Russian. Or French!

    the only language I know is God’s. And he is gracious enough to write his words for me, in English, on a fifth grade level. So I can give an explanation to any asking me about the hope that I have!

    God is not ‘out of reach’. As a matter of fact, he is very accessible for anyone.


    “Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.”
    ‭‭Matthew‬ ‭11:28‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    Pretty simple really.

    Is it unreasonable for me to believe that God never lies? That he is perfect? That he gives perfect words? In ways that he chooses?
    No.
    God is most reasonable.
    Most compassionate.
    And his ways are perfect.
    I thoroughly expect him to have perfect words...

    So I ask you, why is it necessary for you to know Greek if salvation can be known in any language?

    Are you saved? Did Jesus save your soul from the second death? The death of fire? Is this verse in your NWT?
    “And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.”
    ‭‭Revelation‬ ‭20:14‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    To burn for all eternity? Can a JW avoid the second death by only knowing ‘the Greek’ or someone like you that does...

    that is a serious problem if one has to know a different language than their own!

    salvation is the same no matter what language any speak. Salvation is through God’s Son. Jesus.
    Jesus is the language for any sinner who speaks any language in any nation.

    sin.

    A fact of life for any person, race, or creed.

    All sin. Everyone. Jesus is the answer for the payment of sin in any language.

    “Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.”
    ‭‭John‬ ‭14:6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    Joy
     
  4. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    Interesting that you say ' sports team ' because to me 1 Corinthians 9:24-27 is like running a race in a ' spiritual olympics ' !
    ( Running so that each individual personally can completely reach the finish line )
    'Finish line' to either heavenly life, or to earthly life. To gain everlasting life on Earth as originally offered to Adam before his downfall.

    We don't have to know Greek but since the Bible was Not originally written in English it is helpful to know Greek definitions.
    For example: the word Gehenna was translated into English as hell fire ( King James ).
    Hell fire is misleading because Gehenna was just a garbage pit where things were destroyed.
    Thus, Gehenna is a fitting word for: destruction. Destruction for the wicked, Not for the Earth.

    I was raised to believe Earth would be destroyed, That was taught to me in both ' church ' and science class.
    Then, in my early 20's I met a man who said to me ," I have good news for you ! "
    Then he read me Ecclesiastes 1:4 B that the Earth abides forever.
    Since I was already wondering why Jesus said the meek (humble) people will inherit the Earth ( Matthew 5:5; Psalms 37:9-11)
    I wanted to know more because how could anyone inherit the Earth if Earth is destroyed.
    Since Earth is permanent (Psalms 104:5) then who or what would be destroyed.
    Not Earth, but the wicked on Earth are the ones who will be destroyed. Destroyed forever <- Psalms 92:7; Psalms 104:35; Proverbs 2:21-22.

    I found that only people like those of Luke 22:28-30; Daniel 7:18 are called to heaven.
    They have that first or earlier resurrection - Revelation 20:6; 2:10; 5:9-10.
    The rest of us are called to everlasting life right here on Earth. ( I have No desire to leave Earth, I like it here )
    Through Jesus Earth will become a beautiful paradisical Earth as Eden was originally.
    We are Not invited to pray to go to Heaven at Rev. 22:20 but for Jesus to come !
    Come and subdue earthly enemies - Psalms 110
    Come and bring ' healing ' to earth's nations - Revelation 22:2; Isaiah 33:24
    Come and bring an end to ' enemy death ' right here on Earth - 1 Corinthians 15:26; Isaiah 25:8
     
  5. paarsurrey

    paarsurrey Veteran Member

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    Any questions about the Jehovah's witness faith? capumetu

    Please reflect on the following little question from JW's point of view, please, if one like to:

    How does one know right from wrong, please?
    How does one know error from non-error, please?
    How does one know perfect from imperfect, please?
    How does one know good from evil, please?
    How does one know sin from no-sin, please?
    Right friend, please?

    Regards
     
  6. capumetu

    capumetu Active Member

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  7. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest I have the kavorka
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    One question....
    Why are JWs generally nicer to me
    than many of my fellow atheists?
     
  8. capumetu

    capumetu Active Member

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    I appreciate the kind comment sir. Keep in mind all of us are sinners, both in an out of the faith. As Christians we are to be obedient to the teachings of our faith. Among those are these:
    (Galatians 5:22, 23) . . .the fruitage of the spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faith, 23 mildness, self-control.. . .

    Being far from perfect, we fall short of living those things at all times, but we do try hard to live them.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  9. Love God

    Love God Member

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    I didn’t mean ‘favourite sports team’ as a compliment.
    Because having a favourite sports team is arbitrary and irrational.
    Not only that, who wants to sit in a pew and be ‘preached at’ when you can sit in your recliner, with a beer, watching scantily clad girls prancing around your ‘favourite sports team’.

    I have never heard such awful exegesis of scripture than everything that you have posited.

    what do you do with sin?
    I see that you have completely ignored sin and sinners.
    And salvation.
    You have completely ignored salvation and how to get saved.

    it is the Lord Jesus Christ.


    what everyone worries about is judgment. I hear the world mantra all the time: ‘You can’t judge me’.
    Judgment is the biggest show stopper known to man.
    Everyone hates being judged. Meanwhile everyone is busy judging...

    however... there is only One who is the right judge...

    God is going to judge everyone and their sins.
    You either choose his plan of salvation through Jesus Christ his son or you ‘stand’ alone before the judge.

    a man who is his own lawyer has a fool for a client... hmmm
    Truth!


    “Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.”
    ‭‭Acts‬ ‭4:12‬ ‭KJV‬‬


    “My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:”
    ‭‭1 John‬ ‭2:1‬ ‭KJV‬‬


    When you do your JW dance, makes it seem that you have no understanding of sin and salvation.

    Are you a sinner?

    My bible makes it clear that ALL sin.

    My bible also makes it clear that Jesus can cleanse anyone of sin that wants cleansed.
    That Jesus saves any who will call upon him.


    “For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.”
    ‭‭Romans‬ ‭10:13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    Some of the best advice I ever received: Find a bible that you can trust. One that corrects you instead of you having to correct it.

    After all. Who wants a God that has to be corrected!
    (Sinners do like a God they can change into all kinds of nonsense, i.e. religions. And what is more, others like no God to exist.) (Both of which does away with all of God’s righteous judgment.)
    (Convenient indeed...)


    “Thus saith the Lord the King of Israel, and his redeemer the Lord of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.”
    ‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭44:6‬ ‭KJV‬‬


    “Doth God pervert judgment? or doth the Almighty pervert justice?”
    ‭‭Job‬ ‭8:3‬ ‭KJV‬‬


    Joy

    PS. Gehenna is not in my bible. So you are correcting your corrected bible! Now that’s some irony there...
    Hades is not in my bible, either.
    But hell is...a whopping 54 times.

    I don’t want anyone to go there!

    How do people get saved from going to hell... if I only knew... o wait... GOOD NEWS... Jesus died for sin so NO ONE HAS TO CHOOSE HELL.


    “For great is thy mercy toward me: and thou hast delivered my soul from the lowest hell.”
    ‭‭Psalms‬ ‭86:13‬ ‭KJV‬‬
    (this is what my Saviour did! Praise Jesus!)

    ...it is always about sin, judgment, and how to be saved. From hell. The judgment of sin is hell. Not Gehenna. Not even Hades.
    But H E L L.
    Always.
     
    #109 Love God, Jan 15, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2021
    • Creative Creative x 1
  10. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    Yes, each time you read the English word hellfire is where the Greek word Gehenna appeared, so yes Gehenna is in the Bible as was written in Greek.

    The day dead Jesus died righteous Jesus went to hell - Acts of the Apostles 2:27
    Not to flames but to the temporary stone-cold grave for the sleeping dead.
    That is why Jesus and the OT both teach ' sleep ' in death - John 11:11-14; Psalms 115:17; Isaiah 38:18; Ecclesiastes 9:5

    Biblical hell comes to a final end according to Revelation 20:13-14. Everyone in biblical hell is ' delivered up ' out of hell/ grave.
    Then, emptied-out hell is cast empty into that symbolic ' second death ' for vacated hell.

    There is No ignoring about salvation because Jesus is perfectly clear at Matthew 24:13
    The one who endures to the end is saved.
    So, either endure to the end of one's life, or endure being found faithful at the soon coming ' time of separation' on Earth as found at Matthew 25:31-33,37
     
  11. paarsurrey

    paarsurrey Veteran Member

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    paarsurrey said:
    Any questions about the Jehovah's witness faith? capumetu

    Please reflect on the following little question from JW's point of view, please, if one like to:

    How does one know right from wrong, please?*

    How does one know error from non-error, please?
    How does one know perfect from imperfect, please?
    How does one know good from evil, please?
    How does one know sin from no-sin, please?
    Right friend, please?



    capumetu replied vide post #106 ^^

    *God provided His word for that:

    As you can see sir, all of those questions are related. All can be answered by simply stating the Bible. Jehovah is God and sets the laws, He provided them for all to read in His word the Bible.

    Is it easy to get those answers? No sir, and in fact we will never come to know what God knows fully Ecc 3:11. All Christians sign on for an eternity.
    Regards
     
    #111 paarsurrey, Jan 15, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2021
  12. paarsurrey

    paarsurrey Veteran Member

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    Friend @capumetu

    The contents of one's post were not visible like a normal post so excuse me I made them visible by my post #111 for other friends here.

    I put these questions to friend @Evangelicalhumanist who had started a thread " Why I am an atheist". He was brought up as a Christian as he states and opted out as he found "Christianity" not a reason oriented Religion. And such is the case with most/majority of the Atheists.
    I found out that a Christian friend @John D. Brey had subsequently started a thread "Why I am not an atheist.", I also put the same questions to friend @John D. Brey . Please view his response in his post
    #253 :
    Ask Jethro and if he doesn't know ask Jed?
    John

    I want that one, being a JW, should reclaim this Atheist friend to Christianity again, if one may like it.
    Right, friend?

    Regards
     
  13. capumetu

    capumetu Active Member

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    I didn't actually see a question here sir, however if you are asking me if I agree with what you are saying, absolutely.
     
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  14. capumetu

    capumetu Active Member

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    I am not exactly sure of your question sir, but each individual chooses whom they will serve. I have chosen to serve the God Jehovah, choosing to be one of His witnesses. If a person chooses not to serve any god, then that is his own personal choice, of which I have to respect. Jehovah forces no one to serve Him, any individual wanting to belong to Him, has to choose that personally.
     
  15. Love God

    Love God Member

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    But we are back to square one here... I do not speak Greek.
    So I have to run to you to ‘understand’?

    I cannot understand salvation unless I run it by you or some other scholar claiming they alone ‘have the real truth’?

    my bible clearly states:


    “Wherein I suffer trouble, as an evil doer, even unto bonds;
    but the word of God is not bound.”
    ‭‭2 Timothy‬ ‭2:9‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    Furthermore, the words are plain and right:


    “They are all plain to him that understandeth, and right to them that find knowledge.”
    ‭‭Proverbs‬ ‭8:9‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    The bible clearly teaches that the bible must be rightly divided:

    “Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.”
    ‭‭2 Timothy‬ ‭2:15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    what are the right divisions in the bible?

    but according to you, there are errors in the bible and the Greek has to clear it up... but who knows if the Greek contains errors... you have never answered my questions about the errors, where they are, and how you know that?!

    I am waiting.

    “We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us;
    he that is not of God heareth not us.
    Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.”
    ‭‭1 John‬ ‭4:6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    Does God lie? Are his words error filled?
     
  16. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    No, Not errors in the Bible but false clergy teaching errors.
    In modern English when people hear ' hell fire ' they wrongly conclude people will burn in fire forever. False clergy don't teach otherwise.
    Because the King James translated the original word Gehenna which was written in Greek and translated Gehenna as hell fire.
    The people who translated the Bible into 'King James English' from the Greek chose the English word hellfire for the word Gehenna.
    There is No error in the Greek word Gehenna, just the modern-day definition of the word Gehenna into JK English as hellfire.

    A comprehensive concordance helps puts the Bible in ' right divisions '
    Since the Bible is Not written in ABC order as a dictionary is then we need to research Scripture by subject or topic arrangement.
    A comprehensive concordance has the Bible in alphabetical order for all to see ' right divisions ' for each subject, each topic.
    Plus, the Bible itself is full of corresponding cross-reference or parallel verses and passages.
    For example: Matthew 5:5 corresponds with Psalms 37:9-11 which rightly divides the Word of Truth divided rightly.
     
  17. Love God

    Love God Member

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    αμαρτωλός


    σωτηρία


    Ιησούς Χριστός

    I have to trust google on the ‘correct translation’...

    just like you expect me to trust your interpretation of the Greek.

    the Bible clearly states that all are sinners in need of a Saviour.
    That Saviour is the Lord Jesus Christ.

    there is no other name given.


    “Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.”
    ‭‭Acts‬ ‭4:12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    God is not a JW. Not a Mohammedan. Not a Roman. Nor any religion.

    the bible is plain. Clear. On point.

    God does not lie. He has given us perfect words to understand.

    But since you know 'the Greek’, and you obviously possess a fair amount of intelligence, you can change meanings, intent, especially when it comes to sin, salvation, and the Lord Jesus Christ, to suit what satisfies your likes.


    “Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:

    To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.”
    ‭‭Acts‬ ‭10:34, 43‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    God doesn’t care if your IQ is above 200. And you know Greek, Hebrew, and 12 other languages.

    He cares if you have trusted his Son Jesus as your personal Lord and Saviour.

    if ‘the Greek’ is what you need to understand salvation then study ‘the Greek’.

    and then tell everyone in all of those other languages after you have gained understanding in ‘the Greek’ that all have sinned and come short of the glory of God...
    But
    Good News!
    Jesus died for our sin so that any do not have to burn in hell forever!


    “And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire.”
    ‭‭Matthew‬ ‭18:9‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    Exchange Gehenna with hell fire here... doesn’t make any sense. Casting people into ‘Gehenna’ for all eternity.

    eternal life or eternal ‘Gehenna’...
    !!!

    the problem you seem to be having is that you don’t want to burn in hell for rejecting God’s plan of salvation through his Son, the Lord Jesus Christ.

    who does?

    that is why you can do away with any perfect book anywhere. You get to make up whatever you want by changing meanings and words around...

    your own little god!

    just like everyone else who rejects God’s words.

    the best advice out there:
    Find the book that corrects you and not books that you have to correct.

    “He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.”
    ‭‭John‬ ‭12:48‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    If you get to correct God, you may just never need judged...

    the burning bush was not consumed. But it was aflame all the same...

    “And the angel of the Lord appeared unto him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and, behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not consumed.”
    ‭‭Exodus‬ ‭3:2‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    God is an eternal God. His judgment is eternal.
    Eternal life or eternal suffering.

    that’s how it is spelled out in the book that corrects the man rather than the man correcting the book.

    Joy
     
  18. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    Yes, God sent pre-human heavenly Jesus to earth for us to save us, thus Jesus is: savior.
    Jesus does the judging according to John 5:22 if you agree __________

    Since the dead know nothing - Ecclesiastes 9:5 - nothing but sleep - Psalms 115:17; Isaiah 38:18; John 11:11-14 then No eternal suffering.
    Rather the wicked ' perish ' they are ' destroyed forever ' according to Psalms 92:7; Psalms 104:35; 2 Peter 3:9.
    Any thoughts about Proverbs 2:21-22 ______________

    Sinner Satan is wicked and Jesus destroys Satan according to Hebrews 2:14 B.
    Thus, No eternal life anywhere for Satan but destruction - Revelation 21:8
     
  19. capumetu

    capumetu Active Member

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    As well as all those who have chosen to join him in his rebellion

    100% in agreement
     
  20. Love God

    Love God Member

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    some well received advice:
    Find a God that corrects you and avoid a god that you need to correct.


    “And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”
    ‭‭John‬ ‭8:32‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    So who has the truth? You or God’s word?

    “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.”
    ‭‭John‬ ‭1:1‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    I choose God. Who is not a liar like all of mankind is...

    I choose a God who gives perfectly inspired words for any to understand.

    You have never told me if the NWT contains errors... hmmm...

    If Jesus is the word, he cannot lie. If Jesus does lie, then why bother? One liar is as ‘good’ as the other.


    “Ye are of your father the devil,
    and the lusts of your father ye will do.
    He was a murderer from the beginning,
    and abode not in the truth,
    because there is no truth in him.
    When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own:
    for he is a liar, and the father of it.”
    ‭‭John‬ ‭8:44‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    so does God lie? Does God only give imperfect words to follow. Jesus is a liar? The very words of God are wrong?!


    “Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made.
    And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, ...?”
    ‭‭Genesis‬ ‭3:1‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    Hath God said? Anything? Anytime?

    Joseph Smith has the only truth and not God?!
    The popes all claim the only truth, too.
    Same as Imams. Shamans, Buddhists, Hindus...
    And all of man’s religions...

    So much confusion!

    “For God is not the author of confusion,...”
    ‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭14:33‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    I submit that God is the only truth. Has the only truth. And only God can be trusted.

    and Jesus is God. Always is and always has been and always will be.

    so does the NWT contain errors? How about the Greek? Does the Greek contain errors?

    Joy
     
    #120 Love God, Jan 23, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2021
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