sealchan
Well-Known Member
Do you recommend that we be submissive to the will of the facts? Or to make our will in line with the fact's way or to be at one with the facts?
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Belief and Imagination
- Thread starter Fool
- Start date
Do you recommend that we be submissive to the will of the facts? Or to make our will in line with the fact's way or to be at one with the facts?
sealchan
Well-Known Member
As with power...with imagination comes great responsibility. Good and evil are so intermixed that we must always balance initiative with outcome, invention with reality, movement with reflection.
TagliatelliMonster
Veteran Member
I don't even know what that means, and understand even less why you would ask that question.
All I'm saying is: facts are facts. And ignoring / rejecting facts, seems like a pretty stupid thing to do.
Same as above. I don't even know what that means, nore understand why you would ask that question.
If you believe X and the facts disagree with your beliefs, then it's not the facts that are incorrect.
So my recommendation is the following: if facts disagree with your beliefs, then change your beliefs so that they are in line with the facts. It will prevent you from believing false things.
Workman
UNIQUE
You mean the understanding is too astounding for you..hence why you don’t want to understand it!..
Go back to Lab and do more experiments on your self!
It depends, if you believe you are Superman and try to fly by jumping from the Empire State Building, that might not very healthy.
Ciao
- viole
osgart
Nothing my eye, Something for sure
Faith is merely confidence toward something or someone, nothing more.
Religion has faith that their own logic is factual, and beyond dispute.
Facts are something you either do or do not have faith in.
Belief is based on one's own induction. If it is likely to be true according to someone's own standards then belief arises from that.
Imagination with a strong basis in reality might gain power to become reality if you choose to work on its realization.
So long as beliefs and imaginations do not contradict reality, and harm no one, then they could actually turn out to be healthy.
Someone had to imagine a computer and then believe one could be made before computers ever existed. The precondition to the advent of computers was that there were enough facts to conceive of its possibility.
So facts, with imagination, and belief are means to invention.
Imagination, and belief are sometimes not healthy when you have no facts to support them.
My question is Can we derive facts from our own interpretations of reality? Can we prove things to be for ourselves with no outside consensus? Can we trust our experiences?
Often times we can, and often times we cannot.
Then there is the inconvenient happening that facts get overturned in light of new studies.
Anyways its all a matter of wise discretion.
Knowledge trumps certainty. Certainty is often about faith. Knowledge is evident beyond doubt.
Since we cant know absolutely everything, we find ourselves having to exert reasonable faith often times.
Religion has faith that their own logic is factual, and beyond dispute.
Facts are something you either do or do not have faith in.
Belief is based on one's own induction. If it is likely to be true according to someone's own standards then belief arises from that.
Imagination with a strong basis in reality might gain power to become reality if you choose to work on its realization.
So long as beliefs and imaginations do not contradict reality, and harm no one, then they could actually turn out to be healthy.
Someone had to imagine a computer and then believe one could be made before computers ever existed. The precondition to the advent of computers was that there were enough facts to conceive of its possibility.
So facts, with imagination, and belief are means to invention.
Imagination, and belief are sometimes not healthy when you have no facts to support them.
My question is Can we derive facts from our own interpretations of reality? Can we prove things to be for ourselves with no outside consensus? Can we trust our experiences?
Often times we can, and often times we cannot.
Then there is the inconvenient happening that facts get overturned in light of new studies.
Anyways its all a matter of wise discretion.
Knowledge trumps certainty. Certainty is often about faith. Knowledge is evident beyond doubt.
Since we cant know absolutely everything, we find ourselves having to exert reasonable faith often times.
sealchan
Well-Known Member
Who is in possession of the facts? And if two disagree how does one resolve the conflict for ones own purposes?
Workman
UNIQUE
Sometimes with belief to a truth..
Makes one measure themselves to it..in accordingly to their beliefs.
Ex..If you believe in super man than you will believe less of yourself.
Which I believe some dwell on thoughts..making themselves measured to which they make cannot be reached..when along there is more to us humans that can achieve! But ones belief doesn’t believe in it.
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Sky Rivers
Active Member
Radical Islamic example there, don’t you think?
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People generally see what they want to see. For the "deceived" (Revelation 13:14), they should be wary of what they believe. One should be careful of what one reads, as the ruler of the world (John 14:30) decides what is written for the most part. If you are one of the "many", then one should be concerned.
Workman
UNIQUE
This I totally agree..100%
TagliatelliMonster
Veteran Member
TagliatelliMonster
Veteran Member
You devise a proper test and test your idea against physical reality.
TagliatelliMonster
Veteran Member
If you want, I can also go with any of the following:
Faith has the gruesome ability of:
- thinking it's a good idea not to get your kids much needed medicine, because god has a plan
- thinking it's a good idea to burn witches (before you complain about medieval christianity as opposed to today's christianity : christians in africa today, are happily burning witches)
- turning people extremely homophobic for no other reason then a 2000 year old book instructing them to
- ....
I can go on for quite a while if you really wish
sealchan
Well-Known Member
That is a great way to do it but do you make all the decisions in your life based on this method?
TagliatelliMonster
Veteran Member
No.
I, for example, don't think about how to test if I want chicken or beef for dinner.
But we're not talking about "decisions". We're talking about claims about reality and how to find out which are accurate and which aren't.
We're talking about "does X exist and is it responsible for Y?". Those are pretty much scientific questions.
As in: the scientific method is a very usefull and succesfull way to investigate, and get answers to, such types of questions.
How else do you propose to distinguish truth from fiction concerning claims about physical reality, if not by testing it against physical reality?
Shantanu
Well-Known Member
A more reliable method is to await truth to be revealed to one through devotion and reverence to God, for He is know-all and benevolent towards all humanity despite humanity's ills towards the environment.
TagliatelliMonster
Veteran Member
8000 years of doing that brought us witch hunts, some construction technology and the wheel.
300 years of test-based scientific inquiry, enabled us to build machines that will fly us to the moon and back and communication technology that allows us to talk to someone, with speech and vision, at the other side of the world at light speed.
I think it's quite clear what the most reliable method is to find out how reality works. And it's not sitting on your knees with your hands clapped together.....
Workman
UNIQUE
Lol..call it as you see it!.your thoughts have stolen your understanding in it..which would make in a lot of mis judgings.Responding to an accusation of arrogance with... more arrogance.
Excellent....
Did you learn anything different about yourself?
Workman
UNIQUE
Ahhh!..and you do not see what you’ve done wrong here? Not surprised! Let me re-fresh your mind since its playing tricks on you.
If a question is put forth..it’s really IMPORTANT that it’s answer is based ONLY on the question ITSELF! it’s reason of why,.. it can easily jump into another of its conclusions..but hey! I don’t blame you..hence is why your confusion in having.
“Where does it show my post saying of anything about chicken or beef? Exactly NO where! “
Don’t talk rumours now!..
Of that being your case this means you’ve placed an uncertainty of yours in questioning!..than making a fool out of yourself by TELLING YOUR OWN UNDERSTANDING to ‘get a grip’.
Common..DUDE!..it looks like you are in need of getting a grib.lol!.
Since you’ve jumped conclusions..
I won’t leave you hanging, because I like you..you make me happy with laughter. So in answering your GOOD question with chicken over beef..
No, you don’t worship chickens and than eat it! don’t you think it’s quite stupid looking at it that way?? Only an arrogance will think this way..
However, It means you worship its taste, In other words; you favour its taste(flavour) of chicken over beef.
And again YES...is caused from faith in believing.