Does the Bible mention Islam?

[InvestigateTruth]

Does the Bayan or the Kital al-Aqdas teach that Ishmael was the sacrificed son of Abraham? The Quran doesn't teach that Ishmael was the sacrificed son of Abraham, it doesn't mention a name, it just says 'the child of Abraham'.

But the Tora and the Gospel teach that hes name is Isaac. And i have checked it in Greek and Hebrew. It clearly says Isaac. It also makes sense that it was Isaac, since Jesus Christ was the Lamb who sacrificed himself for humanity, and Jesus is from the line of Isaac.

Bahaullah taught that, this story in reality is symbolic. It is not like, Abraham literally took anybody to cut his neck. Bahaullah says, both are correct, Isaac or Ishmael. He says God in Torah had given the station of Sacrifice to Isaac, but in Quran, this station is given to Ishmael. Whatever God says, it is true.

 

[Dawnofhope]

Does the Bayan or the Kitab al-Aqdas teach that Ishmael was the sacrificed son of Abraham?

Neither the Kitab-i-Aqdas nor the Bayan.

From the lineage of Isaac came Judaism, from Ismael came Islam.

…Abraham stood fast and showed forth extraordinary constancy, and God changed His exile into abiding honour, till at last He established the oneness of God… This exile became the cause of the progress of Abraham’s descendants. This exile resulted in the diffusion of Abraham’s teachings. This exile resulted in the appearance of a Jacob from the seed of Abraham, and of a Joseph who became ruler of Egypt. This exile resulted in the appearance of a Moses from that same seed. This exile resulted in a Hagar being found, of who Ishmael was begotten, and from whom Muhammad in turn descended. This exile resulted in the appearance of the Prophets of Israel from the progeny of Abraham—and so will continue forevermore. …Behold what a power it was that enabled an emigrant to establish such a family, to found such a nation, and to promulgate such teachings.
Abdu’l-Baha, Some Answered Questions, newly revised edition, p. 15.

This seems to me to be the most important distinction to make between Isaac and Ishmael. Who was nearly sacrificed doesn't matter at all to Baha'is but it does matter to Christian apologists who want to criticise both Islam and the Baha'i Faith.

In Gleanings from the Writings of Bahá'u'lláh, passage number 32, Bahá'u'lláh mentions the sacrifice that Abraham must make to prove His faith. It states:

"That which thou hast heard concerning Abraham, the Friend of the All-Merciful, is the truth, and no doubt is there about it. The Voice of God commanded Him to offer up Ishmael as a sacrifice, so that His steadfastness in the Faith of God and His detachment from all else but Him may be demonstrated unto men. The purpose of God, moreover, was to sacrifice him as a ransom for the sins and iniquities of all the peoples of the earth."

In the Bible, however, The sacrifice is not of Ishmael, son of Hagar, but of Isaac, son of Sarah. The passage in Genesis 22:12 states:

1 Some time later God tested Abraham. He said to him, "Abraham!"
"Here I am," he replied.
2 Then God said, "Take your son, your only son, Isaac, whom you love, and go to the region of Moriah. Sacrifice him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains I will tell you about."
3 Early the next morning Abraham got up and saddled his donkey. He took with him two of his servants and his son Isaac. When he had cut enough wood for the burnt offering, he set out for the place God had told him about. 4 On the third day Abraham looked up and saw the place in the distance. 5 He said to his servants, "Stay here with the donkey while I and the boy go over there. We will worship and then we will come back to you."
6 Abraham took the wood for the burnt offering and placed it on his son Isaac, and he himself carried the fire and the knife. As the two of them went on together, 7 Isaac spoke up and said to his father Abraham, "Father?"
"Yes, my son?" Abraham replied.
"The fire and wood are here," Isaac said, "but where is the lamb for the burnt offering?"
8 Abraham answered, "God himself will provide the lamb for the burnt offering, my son." And the two of them went on together.
9 When they reached the place God had told him about, Abraham built an altar there and arranged the wood on it. He bound his son Isaac and laid him on the altar, on top of the wood.
10 Then he reached out his hand and took the knife to slay his son.
11 But the angel of the Lord called out to him from heaven, "Abraham! Abraham!"
"Here I am," he replied.
12 "Do not lay a hand on the boy," he said. "Do not do anything to him. Now I know that you fear God, because you have not withheld from me your son, your only son."

Shoghi Effendi has commented that the Quran corroborates Baha'u'llah's statement.

"As to the question raised by the Racine Assembly in connection with Bahá'u'lláh's statement in the 'Gleanings' concerning the sacrifice of Ishmael: Although this statement does not agree with that made in the Bible, Genesis 22:9, the friends should unhesitatingly, and for reasons that are only too obvious, give precedence to the sayings of Bahá'u'lláh which, it should be pointed out, are fully corroborated by the Qur'an, which book is more authentic than the Bible including both the New and the Old Testaments. The Bible is not wholly authentic, and in this respect is not to be compared with the Qur'an, and should be wholly subordinated to the authentic writings of Bahá'u'lláh."
(From a letter written on behalf of the Guardian to the National Spiritual Assembly of the United States and Canada, July 28, 1936: Bahá'í News, No. 103, p. 1, October 1936, in Lights of Guidance, no. 1688)

For an Islamic perspective that the Quran corroborates Ishmael being sacrificed and not Isaac read:

The Sacrifice Of Abraham

 

[CG Didymus]

The period covering the two world wars was the apocalypse. I saw the stars fall from heaven and how the sun of G-d’s Revelation was dimmed. The moon of the Holy Teachings ran red with blood as Europe the heart of Christendom became the stage for unspeakable abominations.

Which verses are you trying to make into WWI and WWII? 'Cause if you have Baha'u'llah long since dead before the "apocalypse" even happens? I really gotta see which verses you're using, because I get the feeling the "apocalypse", which is what the "Battle of Armageddon", happens before or during the return of Christ.

And about the 1260 days, 42 months and any other reference of time you make to mean 1260 years, you keep forcing it into meaning the same thing. Even when it is referring to something else. If it is referring to a beast or dragon or whatever, that you say is the Umayyad dynasty, and the beast or whatever is to do something for 1260 days, and that gets changed to mean 1260 years, then how does that go back, every time, to mean 621AD to 1844AD? That would mean that beast did not have power for 1260 days. And, the Umayyads didn't have power for 1260 day/years, so Jesus misinformed or misspoke to John? Now if Jesus told John that during the 1260 lunar years between 621AD and 1844 there would be a beast, that would be different. Then that's on John for writing down the wrong information.

Or, the more likely explanation, the Baha'is have one good, rock solid prophecy, and that is all the things that can be changed to add up to 1260 years, and the only thing that fits is the time period between the start of Islam and the proclamation of The Bab, so you make everything that you can refer to that. Like what, you have a woman that flees to the wilderness for 1260 days, so that too is referring to 621AD to 1844? The context don't make sense to me no matter how you try and spin it.

 

[W3bcrowf3r]

Some of the Quran verses are in the form of allusions, and to understand them, Muslims are supposed to learn its interpretations from those who Are well-grounded in knowledge, and in Islamic traditions, Muhammad and the Shia Imams are the well-grounded in knowledge. They interpreted some verses of Quran as reference to Ali, and in one of those verses, it states He is sufficient as a witness. In the traditions, that verse is about Ali, who is Witness.

The real question is, what is your understanding about the Quran.

Which verse do you people believe mentioned Ali? The word Ali doesn't appear even once in the Quran.

 

[Dawnofhope]

Nah the Quran doesn't mention the name of the sacrificed son of Abraham. Even early sectarians in 'Islam' used to believe that it was Isaac. It's just these later denominations that are lying about Isaac.

The Tora and Gospel give the name, i have checked it myself in Greek and Hebrew. And the Quran doesn't mention the name, so it's Isaac. Case closed.

Now i want to know if it's written in the book of the Bahai's. Im am very curious. I want to know if its in the kitab al-aqdas. What denominations or people doesn't matter if the book doesn't say it.

I did a quick search in the Kitab al-Aqdas of the Bahais and i couldn't find the name of Ishmael even once? Are you talking about the Bayan or the Kitab al-Aqdas?

Please see post #242 above

Does the Bible mention Islam?

 

[CG Didymus]

The beast does not represent ( Umayyad)
Nor does the stars represents four of the twelve Imams.
It's all been explained in Revelation who the beast is and who the stars are.

It's been explained in Revelation what the number 666 represents and who it represents.
It seems have a hard time in keeping up with the program in Revelation.
For everything that is given in Revelation, it's all been explained in Revelation as to who and what everything represents.

The 666 explanation by the Baha'is is the weakest of all their interpretations I've read. They add 5 years, assuming that Jesus was born approximately 5BC, to 661AD, the start of the Umayyad dynasty, to get 666? Did this dynasty do any of the things that the dragon or beast were supposed to do? I don't think so. Especially when it says that the number or mark of the beast would be 666. How do they convert that into meaning a year?

 

[W3bcrowf3r]

Neither the Kitab-i-Aqdas nor the Bayan.

From the lineage of Isaac came Judaism, from Ismael came Islam.

…Abraham stood fast and showed forth extraordinary constancy, and God changed His exile into abiding honour, till at last He established the oneness of God… This exile became the cause of the progress of Abraham’s descendants. This exile resulted in the diffusion of Abraham’s teachings. This exile resulted in the appearance of a Jacob from the seed of Abraham, and of a Joseph who became ruler of Egypt. This exile resulted in the appearance of a Moses from that same seed. This exile resulted in a Hagar being found, of who Ishmael was begotten, and from whom Muhammad in turn descended. This exile resulted in the appearance of the Prophets of Israel from the progeny of Abraham—and so will continue forevermore. …Behold what a power it was that enabled an emigrant to establish such a family, to found such a nation, and to promulgate such teachings.
Abdu’l-Baha, Some Answered Questions, newly revised edition, p. 15.

This seems to me to be the most important distinction to make between Isaac and Ishmael. Who was nearly sacrificed doesn't matter at all to Baha'is but it does matter to Christian apologists who want to criticise both Islam and the Baha'i Faith.

In Gleanings from the Writings of Bahá'u'lláh, passage number 32, Bahá'u'lláh mentions the sacrifice that Abraham must make to prove His faith. It states:

"That which thou hast heard concerning Abraham, the Friend of the All-Merciful, is the truth, and no doubt is there about it. The Voice of God commanded Him to offer up Ishmael as a sacrifice, so that His steadfastness in the Faith of God and His detachment from all else but Him may be demonstrated unto men. The purpose of God, moreover, was to sacrifice him as a ransom for the sins and iniquities of all the peoples of the earth."

In the Bible, however, The sacrifice is not of Ishmael, son of Hagar, but of Isaac, son of Sarah. The passage in Genesis 22:12 states:

1 Some time later God tested Abraham. He said to him, "Abraham!"
"Here I am," he replied.
2 Then God said, "Take your son, your only son, Isaac, whom you love, and go to the region of Moriah. Sacrifice him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains I will tell you about."
3 Early the next morning Abraham got up and saddled his donkey. He took with him two of his servants and his son Isaac. When he had cut enough wood for the burnt offering, he set out for the place God had told him about. 4 On the third day Abraham looked up and saw the place in the distance. 5 He said to his servants, "Stay here with the donkey while I and the boy go over there. We will worship and then we will come back to you."
6 Abraham took the wood for the burnt offering and placed it on his son Isaac, and he himself carried the fire and the knife. As the two of them went on together, 7 Isaac spoke up and said to his father Abraham, "Father?"
"Yes, my son?" Abraham replied.
"The fire and wood are here," Isaac said, "but where is the lamb for the burnt offering?"
8 Abraham answered, "God himself will provide the lamb for the burnt offering, my son." And the two of them went on together.
9 When they reached the place God had told him about, Abraham built an altar there and arranged the wood on it. He bound his son Isaac and laid him on the altar, on top of the wood.
10 Then he reached out his hand and took the knife to slay his son.
11 But the angel of the Lord called out to him from heaven, "Abraham! Abraham!"
"Here I am," he replied.
12 "Do not lay a hand on the boy," he said. "Do not do anything to him. Now I know that you fear God, because you have not withheld from me your son, your only son."

Shoghi Effendi has commented that the Quran corroborates Baha'u'llah's statement.

"As to the question raised by the Racine Assembly in connection with Bahá'u'lláh's statement in the 'Gleanings' concerning the sacrifice of Ishmael: Although this statement does not agree with that made in the Bible, Genesis 22:9, the friends should unhesitatingly, and for reasons that are only too obvious, give precedence to the sayings of Bahá'u'lláh which, it should be pointed out, are fully corroborated by the Qur'an, which book is more authentic than the Bible including both the New and the Old Testaments. The Bible is not wholly authentic, and in this respect is not to be compared with the Qur'an, and should be wholly subordinated to the authentic writings of Bahá'u'lláh."
(From a letter written on behalf of the Guardian to the National Spiritual Assembly of the United States and Canada, July 28, 1936: Bahá'í News, No. 103, p. 1, October 1936, in Lights of Guidance, no. 1688)

For an Islamic perspective that the Quran corroborates Ishmael being sacrificed and not Isaac read:

The Sacrifice Of Abraham

"That which thou hast heard concerning Abraham, the Friend of the All-Merciful, is the truth, and no doubt is there about it. The Voice of God commanded Him to offer up Ishmael as a sacrifice, so that His steadfastness in the Faith of God and His detachment from all else but Him may be demonstrated unto men. The purpose of God, moreover, was to sacrifice him as a ransom for the sins and iniquities of all the peoples of the earth."

From where is this quote? This clearly contradicts the Tora and the Gospel.

The Quran doesn't mention the name of the sacrificed one.

I checked in Greek and Hebrew and Arabic.
The Quran used the word 'Ghulaam', which means son, and in Hebrew and in Greek it says 'Isaac', which is the name of the son who was nearly sacrificed.

So these people are changing the word son in the Quran. And making it Ishmael. And they are denying the word Isaac in the Tora and the Gospel. So they are the ones who are changing the Tora, Gospel and the Quran! And not the other way around.

 

[W3bcrowf3r]

Bahaullah taught that, this story in reality is symbolic. It is not like, Abraham literally took anybody to cut his neck. Bahaullah says, both are correct, Isaac or Ishmael. He says God in Torah had given the station of Sacrifice to Isaac, but in Quran, this station is given to Ishmael. Whatever God says, it is true.

The Quran doesn't mention the name of the nearly sacrificed son of Abraham. The Tora and Gospel say it's Isaac. I have check it in Arabic, Hebrew and Greek.

 

[Dawnofhope]

Which verses are you trying to make into WWI and WWII? 'Cause if you have Baha'u'llah long since dead before the "apocalypse" even happens? I really gotta see which verses you're using, because I get the feeling the "apocalypse", which is what the "Battle of Armageddon", happens before or during the return of Christ.

We've been over this before. The tribulation happens after the appearance of the Manifestation of God. It would be contrary to G-d's justice to punish them for failing to recognise the Manifestation of G-d when He hasn't even come yet.

The flood happened after Noah warned the people and failed to heed His call. The destruction of the Jewish temple and Jerusalem happened after Jesus warned His people. The tribulation (WWI/WWII) happened after Baha'u'llah warned the leaders of the world and they failed to heed HIs call.

Armageddon is simply a metaphor for the decisive battle of (Har) Meggido when the Jews were finally defeated and exiled.

Armageddon - Wikipedia

And about the 1260 days, 42 months and any other reference of time you make to mean 1260 years, you keep forcing it into meaning the same thing. Even when it is referring to something else. If it is referring to a beast or dragon or whatever, that you say is the Umayyad dynasty, and the beast or whatever is to do something for 1260 days, and that gets changed to mean 1260 years, then how does that go back, every time, to mean 621AD to 1844AD? That would mean that beast did not have power for 1260 days. And, the Umayyads didn't have power for 1260 day/years, so Jesus misinformed or misspoke to John? Now if Jesus told John that during the 1260 lunar years between 621AD and 1844 there would be a beast, that would be different. Then that's on John for writing down the wrong information.

I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree about that one.

Or, the more likely explanation, the Baha'is have one good, rock solid prophecy, and that is all the things that can be changed to add up to 1260 years, and the only thing that fits is the time period between the start of Islam and the proclamation of The Bab, so you make everything that you can refer to that. Like what, you have a woman that flees to the wilderness for 1260 days, so that too is referring to 621AD to 1844? The context don't make sense to me no matter how you try and spin it.

Its simply textbook dispensationalism.

Dispensationalism - Wikipedia[/QUOTE]

 

[W3bcrowf3r]

The 666 explanation by the Baha'is is the weakest of all their interpretations I've read. They add 5 years, assuming that Jesus was born approximately 5BC, to 661AD, the start of the Umayyad dynasty, to get 666? Did this dynasty do any of the things that the dragon or beast were supposed to do? I don't think so. Especially when it says that the number or mark of the beast would be 666. How do they convert that into meaning a year?

An English translation of the Gospel - Revelation 13:12 It exercised all the authority of the first beast on its behalf, and made the earth and its inhabitants worship the first beast, whose fatal wound had been healed.

This is obviously the EU, it's fatal wound was when the Roman Empire was destroyed. But now it's being revived again.

An English translation of the Gospel - Revelation 13:3 One of the heads of the beast seemed to have had a fatal wound, but the fatal wound had been healed. The whole world was filled with wonder and followed the beast.

How can this be applied to the Umayyad dynasty...

An English translation of the Gospel - Revelation 13:2 The beast I saw resembled a leopard, but had feet like those of a bear and a mouth like that of a lion. The dragon gave the beast his power and his throne and great authority.

I think that the leopard is Germany, the bear Russia, and the Lion is the UK.

An English translation of the Gospel - Revelation 19:19 Then I saw the beast and the kings of the earth and their armies gathered together to wage war against the rider on the horse and his army.

The EU is already one government, i think Russia will join them as a coalition. That will be the army of the anti-Christ.

 

[W3bcrowf3r]

Bahaullah taught that, this story in reality is symbolic. It is not like, Abraham literally took anybody to cut his neck. Bahaullah says, both are correct, Isaac or Ishmael. He says God in Torah had given the station of Sacrifice to Isaac, but in Quran, this station is given to Ishmael. Whatever God says, it is true.

The Quran doesn't teach that Muhammad and an Ali are the two witnesses. The Quran doesn't even mention the name Ali at all.

Also the Gospel teaches this about the two witnesses:

An English translation of the Gospel - Revelation 11:7 Now when they have finished their testimony, the beast that comes up from the Abyss will attack them, and overpower and kill them. Their bodies will lie in the public square of the great city--which is figuratively called Sodom and Egypt--where also their Lord was crucified. For three and a half days some from every people, tribe, language and nation will gaze on their bodies and refuse them burial. The inhabitants of the earth will gloat over them and will celebrate by sending each other gifts, because these two prophets had tormented those who live on the earth.But after the three and a half days the breath of life from God entered them, and they stood on their feet, and terror struck those who saw them. Then they heard a loud voice from heaven saying to them, "Come up here." And they went up to heaven in a cloud, while their enemies looked on. At that very hour there was a severe earthquake and a tenth of the city collapsed. Seven thousand people were killed in the earthquake, and the survivors were terrified and gave glory to the God of heaven.

 

[Faithofchristian]

The 666 explanation by the Baha'is is the weakest of all their interpretations I've read. They add 5 years, assuming that Jesus was born approximately 5BC, to 661AD, the start of the Umayyad dynasty, to get 666? Did this dynasty do any of the things that the dragon or beast were supposed to do? I don't think so. Especially when it says that the number or mark of the beast would be 666. How do they convert that into meaning a year?

That's beyond me, how they get that.

 

[CG Didymus]

A better explanation is the use of the tribes of Israel tosymbolise the tribes of the earth. Tribalism within Israel belongs to a bygone era. It makes no sense to think about Israel as being 12 tribes anymore.

The woman is clothed with the stars and moon is likely a refernce to the Ottoman Empire.

This was adopted in 1844, the year the Bab declared.

Flags of the Ottoman Empire - Wikipedia



The Lamb of G-d is a Messianic reference.

Lamb of God - Wikipedia

In the context, can you explain how the woman is the Ottoman Empire? Plus, in verse 6 is a 1260 day reference and also in verse 14 there is the time, and time and half a time reference. Who are you saying this "red dragon" is? Is this the one that you say is the Umayyad's?

12 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars: 2 And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.

3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.

4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.

5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, 8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.

9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.

14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent. ​

 

[CG Didymus]

Neither the Kitab-i-Aqdas nor the Bayan.

From the lineage of Isaac came Judaism, from Ismael came Islam.

…Abraham stood fast and showed forth extraordinary constancy, and God changed His exile into abiding honour, till at last He established the oneness of God… This exile became the cause of the progress of Abraham’s descendants. This exile resulted in the diffusion of Abraham’s teachings. This exile resulted in the appearance of a Jacob from the seed of Abraham, and of a Joseph who became ruler of Egypt. This exile resulted in the appearance of a Moses from that same seed. This exile resulted in a Hagar being found, of who Ishmael was begotten, and from whom Muhammad in turn descended. This exile resulted in the appearance of the Prophets of Israel from the progeny of Abraham—and so will continue forevermore. …Behold what a power it was that enabled an emigrant to establish such a family, to found such a nation, and to promulgate such teachings.
Abdu’l-Baha, Some Answered Questions, newly revised edition, p. 15.

This seems to me to be the most important distinction to make between Isaac and Ishmael. Who was nearly sacrificed doesn't matter at all to Baha'is but it does matter to Christian apologists who want to criticise both Islam and the Baha'i Faith.

In Gleanings from the Writings of Bahá'u'lláh, passage number 32, Bahá'u'lláh mentions the sacrifice that Abraham must make to prove His faith. It states:

"That which thou hast heard concerning Abraham, the Friend of the All-Merciful, is the truth, and no doubt is there about it. The Voice of God commanded Him to offer up Ishmael as a sacrifice, so that His steadfastness in the Faith of God and His detachment from all else but Him may be demonstrated unto men. The purpose of God, moreover, was to sacrifice him as a ransom for the sins and iniquities of all the peoples of the earth."

In the Bible, however, The sacrifice is not of Ishmael, son of Hagar, but of Isaac, son of Sarah. The passage in Genesis 22:12 states:

1 Some time later God tested Abraham. He said to him, "Abraham!"
"Here I am," he replied.
2 Then God said, "Take your son, your only son, Isaac, whom you love, and go to the region of Moriah. Sacrifice him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains I will tell you about."
3 Early the next morning Abraham got up and saddled his donkey. He took with him two of his servants and his son Isaac. When he had cut enough wood for the burnt offering, he set out for the place God had told him about. 4 On the third day Abraham looked up and saw the place in the distance. 5 He said to his servants, "Stay here with the donkey while I and the boy go over there. We will worship and then we will come back to you."
6 Abraham took the wood for the burnt offering and placed it on his son Isaac, and he himself carried the fire and the knife. As the two of them went on together, 7 Isaac spoke up and said to his father Abraham, "Father?"
"Yes, my son?" Abraham replied.
"The fire and wood are here," Isaac said, "but where is the lamb for the burnt offering?"
8 Abraham answered, "God himself will provide the lamb for the burnt offering, my son." And the two of them went on together.
9 When they reached the place God had told him about, Abraham built an altar there and arranged the wood on it. He bound his son Isaac and laid him on the altar, on top of the wood.
10 Then he reached out his hand and took the knife to slay his son.
11 But the angel of the Lord called out to him from heaven, "Abraham! Abraham!"
"Here I am," he replied.
12 "Do not lay a hand on the boy," he said. "Do not do anything to him. Now I know that you fear God, because you have not withheld from me your son, your only son."

Shoghi Effendi has commented that the Quran corroborates Baha'u'llah's statement.

"As to the question raised by the Racine Assembly in connection with Bahá'u'lláh's statement in the 'Gleanings' concerning the sacrifice of Ishmael: Although this statement does not agree with that made in the Bible, Genesis 22:9, the friends should unhesitatingly, and for reasons that are only too obvious, give precedence to the sayings of Bahá'u'lláh which, it should be pointed out, are fully corroborated by the Qur'an, which book is more authentic than the Bible including both the New and the Old Testaments. The Bible is not wholly authentic, and in this respect is not to be compared with the Qur'an, and should be wholly subordinated to the authentic writings of Bahá'u'lláh."
(From a letter written on behalf of the Guardian to the National Spiritual Assembly of the United States and Canada, July 28, 1936: Bahá'í News, No. 103, p. 1, October 1936, in Lights of Guidance, no. 1688)

For an Islamic perspective that the Quran corroborates Ishmael being sacrificed and not Isaac read:

The Sacrifice Of Abraham

Thanks Adrian for the quotes dealing with this thing about Isaac and Ishmael. And thanks for yet another awesome thread.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

The real question is, what is your understanding about the Quran.

Which verse do you people believe mentioned Ali? The word Ali doesn't appear even once in the Quran.

The name of Ali is not explicitly mentioned in Quran, but then again, the name of Jesus is not mentioned in the Torah either, even He is the Messiah of Jews according to Christian Bible.
Ali, and other Shia Imams till the 12 imams are not mentioned in the Quran explicitly, even there are many traditions about Ali.

The verse I am talking about is like : "sufficient is Allah as witness, and He who knowledge of the Book is with Him"
The witness who the knowledge of the Book is with Him, according to many Hadithes is an allusion to Ali. Sorry didn't have time to give you the verse number, but if you google it, you can find about it.

 

[CG Didymus]

We've been over this before. The tribulation happens after the appearance of the Manifestation of God. It would be contrary to G-d's justice to punish them for failing to recognise the Manifestation of G-d when He hasn't even come yet.

The flood happened after Noah warned the people and failed to heed His call. The destruction of the Jewish temple and Jerusalem happened after Jesus warned His people. The tribulation (WWI/WWII) happened after Baha'u'llah warned the leaders of the world and they failed to heed HIs call.

Armageddon is simply a metaphor for the decisive battle of (Har) Meggido when the Jews were finally defeated and exiled.

Armageddon - Wikipedia



I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree about that one.



Its simply textbook dispensationalism.

Dispensationalism - Wikipedia

[/QUOTE]
So Armageddon happens in Rev 16:16. In verse 15 it says that "I am coming like a thief"? You have to flip flop a lot of verses to make Baha'u'llah having come and gone before the Battle of Armageddon. But then you say Armageddon is when the Jews get defeated and exiled? Is any of this from official Baha'i writings?

 

[CG Didymus]

That's beyond me, how they get that.

666 is a number or mark of the beast and represent his name and people will get his mark on their hands or forehead. People won't be able to buy or sell without the mark? It don't sound like it means the year 666AD.

 

[W3bcrowf3r]

666 is a number or mark of the beast and represent his name and people will get his mark on their hands or forehead. People won't be able to buy or sell without the mark? It don't sound like it means the year 666AD.

666 is related to gold, the system of wealth. Study how 666 appears in the other Scriptures. If i remember correctly, it was always used for gold, but in revelation its also used for the Beast, and how the people wont be able to buy or sell.

 

[W3bcrowf3r]

The name of Ali is not explicitly mentioned in Quran, but then again, the name of Jesus is not mentioned in the Torah either, even He is the Messiah of Jews according to Christian Bible.
Ali, and other Shia Imams till the 12 imams are not mentioned in the Quran explicitly, even there are many traditions about Ali.

The verse I am talking about is like : "sufficient is Allah as witness, and He who knowledge of the Book is with Him"
The witness who the knowledge of the Book is with Him, according to many Hadithes is an allusion to Ali. Sorry didn't have time to give you the verse number, but if you google it, you can find about it.

The Quran doesn't mention the 12 'imams' of the Shia doctrine. The Quran doesn't mention the name Ali.

You are being brainwashed. You see things which aren't there. And that's why i actually do not believe in the Bayan or the Aqdas, it's just another tool of the Persians to make others believe in the Shia fabrication.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

The Quran doesn't mention the 12 'imams' of the Shia doctrine. The Quran doesn't mention the name Ali.

You are being brainwashed. You see things which aren't there. And that's why i actually do not believe in the Bayan or the Aqdas, it's just another tool of the Persians to make others believe in the Shia fabrication.

Off course you do not see them.
Refer to verse 3:7 of Quran. There are verses which are clear, and there are verses which are not clear. Those verses which are about 12 Imams are of those which are not clear. For example, in a verse in Quran, it says God created stars to protect heaven. These stars according to traditions are allusions to the Imams. And the heaven is the Religion of God. Just because there is no clear verse in the Quran about 12 Imams, does not mean there is no unclear or figurative verse about them.