* sigh* Just Another Day In Heaven

[oldbadger]

What makes you think I don't have other plans?

Well, absolutely!
Who wants to wander about, eating grass and veg (only) for sustenance, in a state of puritanical self-righteous boredom, when you can be 'down there' with the naughty ones?

Alternatively, the Muslim Heaven would be much more fun, basking in beautiful green meadows, being waited upon for every desire by dark-eyed houris, and occasionally peeping over the esdge of heaven to look down into the depths of hellish fire and chaos to see old acquaintances squirming in everlasting agony. I can think of a few faces that I would like to see down there.

 

[Revoltingest]

Well, absolutely!
Who wants to wander about, eating grass and veg (only) for sustenance, in a state of puritanical self-righteous boredom, when you can be 'down there' with the naughty ones?

Alternatively, the Muslim Heaven would be much more fun, basking in beautiful green meadows, being waited upon for every desire by dark-eyed houris, and occasionally peeping over the esdge of heaven to look down into the depths of hellish fire and chaos to see old acquaintances squirming in everlasting agony. I can think of a few faces that I would like to see down there.

Yes....you can enjoy the comfort of your 57 virgins.
You may start with these 5 lusty consorts.....

 

[oldbadger]

Yep, that's how we do it. It's called the Memorial of Christ's Death and we celebrate it on the right date, just as the Jews celebrated Passover on Nisan 14 each year according to the Jewish calendar, after sundown.
................

Ah ha!. Yes!
Now, I'm not a fan of G-John, but that gospel nails the date to Nisan 14 smack-on.
You might be interested to scrutinize Matthew and Mark because they get the day wrong because their account calculates out to Nisan 15. I have the homework for that somewhere but not on this laptop.

 

[oldbadger]

Yes....you can enjoy the comfort of your 57 virgins.
You may start with these 5 lusty consorts.....

No........ if that lot fancied me then I'd definitely be in the wrong place, and Big G would seriously be after me ....!

 

[Unveiled Artist]

How silly. In heaven you wont take stock of you life. It will be new every day. with no worries.

Isn't the experience of a stress free life is in something we do for ourselves, others, and our environment?

Are you just thoughts? A new body floating around with a permanent smile on your face (no pun)?

What makes heaven, heaven to someone who has never gone to earth to find it?

 

[Neo Deist]

Of course you want to leave it at that because even you know that not all Th.Ds are equal (or, you should know). In fact, because of your evasion I'm beginning to suspect your Th.D may actually have come from something like a Liberty Online University or a Patriot Bible University. And don't kid yourself that just because you may have one means you know anything about translating classical Hebrew and Koine Greek, because we both know there's no necessary correspondence.

And as long as you're flaunting your Th.D, how about telling us where you got it from and when, where you were ordained, and what you are ordained as.

We await your honest disclosure.


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Did that already, long ago.

 

[Skwim]

Did that already, long ago.

And now you've forgotten?

You know, not all of us had the foresight to read all 2,685 of your previous posts, so unfortunately we missed out on your account of your educational and ordinational background. So how about helping us out. Where did you get your Th.D from and when? Where were you ordained? And what are you ordained as?

We're ready to take notes, be impressed, and corroborate.

.​

 

[djhwoodwerks]

Since we believe that only 144,000 will go to heaven, and most of them are already there,

I thought that when a person dies, they're dead, cease to exist, how can anyone be in heaven yet?

 

[djhwoodwerks]

But passing around the bread and the wine reminds us of the sacrifice Jesus made on our behalf and this is the only thing Christ commanded us to do. (Luke 22:19-20)

Jesus commanded watchtower members to "pass around" the bread and wine?

Matthew 26:26-29 (ESV Strong's) 26 Now as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and after blessing it broke it and gave it to the disciples, and said, “Take, eat; this is my body.” 27 And he took a cup, and when he had given thanks he gave it to them, saying, “Drink of it, all of you, 28 for this is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins. 29 I tell you I will not drink again of this fruit of the vine until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father's kingdom.”

 

[Ouroboros]

Consider: you finally die and find yourself in Heaven. A year goes by and you start taking stock of your life there.

What is your day-to-day existence like?

What do find that's keeping you from being bored, day after day after day---like forever?

That's a question that hit me as a Christian many years ago. I couldn't answer it. Also, back then, it was the beginning of the PC era. I had my first VIC-20, and people said that there won't be any computers in heaven... that made me sad. What's so evil about computers that we can't have them in heaven?

Anyway, your question is very valid. If you can do anything, you end up doing nothing. I've experienced it in some games (like No Man's Sky for instance) where the challenge of not having it all is driving you to push on, but when you finally have all things you want, there's no drive to play anymore. I think boredom would be a serious problem in heaven. Hell is probably more fun, they have Hell's kitchen and BBQ party all the time!

 

[Skwim]

That's a question that hit me as a Christian many years ago. I couldn't answer it. Also, back then, it was the beginning of the PC era. I had my first VIC-20, and people said that there won't be any computers in heaven... that made me sad. What's so evil about computers that we can't have them in heaven?

Anyway, your question is very valid. If you can do anything, you end up doing nothing. I've experienced it in some games (like No Man's Sky for instance) where the challenge of not having it all is driving you to push on, but when you finally have all things you want, there's no drive to play anymore. I think boredom would be a serious problem in heaven. Hell is probably more fun, they have Hell's kitchen and BBQ party all the time!

The only thing I can think of as saving one from boredom is if our experience was utterly delightful and our memories were only good for one "day"; the next day being a replay of the great previous day, but without our knowledge of it.

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[Ouroboros]

The only thing I can think of as saving one from boredom is if our experience was utterly delightful and our memories were only good for one "day"; the next day being a replay of the great previous day, but without our knowledge of it.

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I was thinking the same thing! Basically having a brain damage so the storage of short term to long term memory is shut off.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

This is why it helps to have a formal education in theology.

Koine Greek does not use punctuation, so when the verse says "Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise" [Luke 23:43] the placement of the comma is "best guess" and supports the traditional yet non-biblical belief in going to Heaven upon death. The comma can also be placed here: "Truly I say to you today, you shall be with Me in Paradise" which then makes it future tense, and supports everything in Revelation 20 and 21.

Besides, paradise does not mean Heaven. If Jesus wanted to say Heaven, he would have used the same word as he did everywhere else in the NT.

So really you don't have much of an argument. The comma could be moved, so therefore you choose to interpret it differently. I think I'll go with the "best guess" of centuries of Biblical scholarship over "could bes".

 

[URAVIP2ME]

So if flesh can not inherit the kingdom of earth how can His body have been lifted up into Heaven. I'm presuming with all these leaps of logic you believe in a physical resurrection.

Please keep in mind that God did Not resurrect Jesus back in his physical body.
God resurrected Jesus back to his original pre-human heavenly body.
That is why before the resurrected Jesus ascended to heaven Jesus used different materialized bodies to appear to his followers so that they would know he was resurrected as a spirit.

On the other hand, Adam, like us, was never in heaven. Adam was made from the dust of the ground and Adam returned back to the dust of the ground - Genesis 2:7; Genesis 3:19

God send His already existing heavenly Son to Earth because Adam and Eve passed down their physical imperfection to us. In other words, because we can Not stop sinning we die. We can Not resurrect oneself or another, so we need someone who can resurrect us. Please note that ALL of Jesus' resurrections were physical resurrections. God's purpose 'was and is' Not to change us into angels, but to give us the original opportunity that was given to father Adam before his downfall which is to live forever on a beautiful paradisical Earth free of enemy death.- 1 Corinthians 15:26; Isaiah 25:8

Jesus chose only some to have a resurrection into a spirit body - Luke 22:28-30, but as for the majority of mankind
(John 3:13) they will have a happy-and-healthy physical resurrection back to life on Earth starting with calendar Day One of Jesus' coming 1,000-year governmental rulership over Earth begins when Jesus will have earthly subjects or citizens from sea to sea - Psalms 72:8; Psalms 72:12-14

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I was thinking the same thing! Basically having a brain damage so the storage of short term to long term memory is shut off.

Then, to me, you are thinking Adam was created with brain damage, because Adam was created to live forever on a beautiful paradisical Earth as long as he did Not break God's Law.
If Adam was reliving a ' groundhog day' ( the movie ) then Adam would Not have broken God's Law because Adam did Not break the Law the day he was created and nor did Eve.

 

[psychoslice]

Thanks for comnirming what I already knew.

Do you think "self" can be wrong or is self omniscient?

Depends on what self you are talking about, the Self or the self.

 

[Neo Deist]

So really you don't have much of an argument. The comma could be moved, so therefore you choose to interpret it differently. I think I'll go with the "best guess" of centuries of Biblical scholarship over "could bes".

Ok.

Just understand that the comma placement is only opinion, no matter where it is placed. Besides, modern scholarship, as you call it, tends to agree with what I said because of Revelation 20 and 21.

 

[oldbadger]

Where did you get your Th.D from and when? Where were you ordained? And what are you ordained as?..................

Your question was to another, but it interests me.

A local Christian Community Ordains people but they don't act/serve as priests, and one ordained person (there) only acts as a 'celebrant' at humanist funerals. Most strange.

I remember one trainee that attended a London course (years ago) which I was trainer at, who introduced himself to all as 'a priest ordained by God'.

And so it would seem that mostly anybody can attach ordination to themselves if they receive the right vision or message.

Theological degrees cannot help the seeker too much imo, because they seem to be based upon one Institutional indoctrination or another, and the ideas of a few theological professors tend to look (to me) like absolute buffoonery.

A license to install gas central heating might actually be a better grounding for religious investigation, maybe, or a Heavy Goods Vehicle licence?

If it's not being too nosey, could you tell us all about any qualifications which you hold, or held?

 

[Skwim]

Your question was to another, but it interests me.

A local Christian Community Ordains people but they don't act/serve as priests, and one ordained person (there) only acts as a 'celebrant' at humanist funerals. Most strange.

I remember one trainee that attended a London course (years ago) which I was trainer at, who introduced himself to all as 'a priest ordained by God'.

And so it would seem that mostly anybody can attach ordination to themselves if they receive the right vision or message.

Yeah. Ordination need not indicate any educational background in the relevant subject at all. In fact, ministerial ordinations can be had online for nothing: No education and no cost. See HERE. In essence, an ordination can mean something or it can mean bupkis.

Theological degrees cannot help the seeker too much imo, because they seem to be based upon one Institutional indoctrination or another, and the ideas of a few theological professors tend to look (to me) like absolute buffoonery.

From what I've seen Th.Ds pretty much follow the theology of the Th.D granting institution.

If it's not being too nosey, could you tell us all about any qualifications which you hold, or held?

Well, I was a qualified Graves Registration Specialist in the army. Oh yes, I was also a qualified marksman with the M1 rifle in the army. Impressed?


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[Dawnofhope]

Thank you for your response. I'm trying to better understand your Christian Faith.

Please keep in mind that God did Not resurrect Jesus back in his physical body.
God resurrected Jesus back to his original pre-human heavenly body.
That is why before the resurrected Jesus ascended to heaven Jesus used different materialized bodies to appear to his followers so that they would know he was resurrected as a spirit.

Didn't He have just one physical body or was he like a spirit during His time on earth? Or perhaps you mean a body and a soul like the rest of us and his soul ascended to heaven. Then there would be no rational contradiction with Jesus' body ascending to heaven. So His Spirit or Soul ascends to heaven in the unseen heavenly realm (not in the sky) and His body remains on earth. His resurrection then becomes spiritual and not physical. That would make more sense to me.

On the other hand, Adam, like us, was never in heaven. Adam was made from the dust of the ground and Adam returned back to the dust of the ground - Genesis 2:7; Genesis 3:19

Wouldn't that make Adam greater than Jesus? If Jesus didn't have a father but a mother, and Adam had neither a mother or a father, an greatness is a measure of miraculous signs then Adam would be greater! Or perhaps the story of Adm and Eve is a symbolic one filled with hidden intrinsic spiritual meanings not to be taken literally. Perhaps God was the father of Jesus in a spiritual not physical sense. Then Christ's greatness can be explained by His Divine attributes rather than the Divine mystery of His virgin birth.

What do you think? Is that plausable or is your way the only way of understanding Christianity.