Why is the American Conservative Movement so Anti-American?

[Sunstone]

If it is the case, then just why is it the case that the Conservative Movement in America (which is not actually the same as the Republican Party, but is instead generally to the Right of the Republican Party) -- why is it so Anti-American these days?

For the purposes of this thread, the Conservative Movement might be thought of as including the ideologies of the John Birch society, the Religious Right, the Koch brothers, Rupert Murdoch, Roger Ailes, Pete Peterson, etc. That is to say, not everyone who calls themselves a Conservative is a member of the Conservative Movement.

Do the findings of Robert Altemeyer shed any light on the Anti-Americanism of today's Conservative Movement? If so, why? If not, why not?

(Movement Conservatives -- please do not use sarcasm (a.k.a "sarcasium") in your responses. This is a serious -- nay, a grim -- thread. It's a grim thread because I don't know how to be serious: Instead, I only know how to be grim.)

So, why is the Conservative Movement so anti-American these days? If, indeed, it is?

 

[Revoltingest]

Why do some leftists start histrionic threads?

 

[Sunstone]

Why do some leftists start histrionic threads?

Maybe to parody some Fox Viewing Right Wingers.
Of course, I didn't see any Right Wingers object to this particular thread as "histrionic".
But then Jiddu Krishnamurti used to point out that humans are natural born hypocrites.
Lighten up. Folks might think you're too grim.

 

[Revoltingest]

Maybe to parody Right Wing nutjobs.

Hmm....pretty good reason.

 

[Gunfingers]

The far, far right are generally religiously motivated, not to mention possessed of a fair number of bigotries. In a nation that is finally getting past its reliance on religion, and finally giving up its bigotries, it's only natural that those people would feel threatened.

 

[Sunstone]

The far, far right are generally religiously motivated, not to mention possessed of a fair number of bigotries. In a nation that is finally getting past its reliance on religion, and finally giving up its bigotries, it's only natural that those people would feel threatened.

That's an interesting take on it. I'm not sure to what extent I agree, but it's food for thought. Thanks!

 

[esmith]

In order to answer your question in either a positive or negative manner I would have to know what you consider "Conservative"ideas or beliefs are. Your idea what a Conservative is may be completely alien to me. I consider myself as a Conservative, but do not necessarily subscribe to all or possible none of your references. Please be more specific in you question.

 

[Debunker]

If it is the case, then just why is it the case that the Conservative Movement in America (which is not actually the same as the Republican Party, but is instead generally to the Right of the Republican Party) -- why is it so Anti-American these days?

For the purposes of this thread, the Conservative Movement might be thought of as including the ideologies of the John Birch society, the Religious Right, the Koch brothers, Rupert Murdoch, Roger Ailes, Pete Peterson, etc.

Do the findings of Robert Altemeyer shed any light on the Anti-Americanism of today's Conservative Movement? If so, why? If not, why not?

(Conservatives -- please do not use sarcasm (a.k.a "sarcasium") in your responses. This is a serious -- nay, a grim -- thread. It's a grim thread because I don't know how to be serious: Instead, I only know how to be grim.)

So, why is the Conservative Movement so anti-American these days? If, indeed, it is?

It is not un-American. Your thread is simply a cry for the usual suspects to come running to bash the Republican Party because you guys are looking real bad in the USA at this time in history. Have a nic bash and keep trying to wiggle out of the mess you guys have placed the country in. Fox News will not allow the people to overlook your contributions to the failures of the USA.

 

[Sunstone]

In order to answer your question in either a positive or negative manner I would have to know what you consider "Conservative"ideas or beliefs are. Your idea what a Conservative is may be completely alien to me. I consider myself as a Conservative, but do not necessarily subscribe to all or possible none of your references. Please be more specific in you question.

Good question! But I would rather allow "the John Birch society, the Religious Right, the Koch brothers, Rupert Murdoch, Roger Ailes, Pete Peterson, etc." to speak for themselves than to offer my interpretation of them. I think those folks are pretty representative of the Conservative Movement in America. For instance, it's not an interpretation, but just a fact, that some members of the Religious Right oppose teaching the Theory of Evolution in public schools. That is, they are not just advocates for teaching creationism, but also advocates against teaching evolution. I don't think that's an American value.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

I don't know about conservatives or liberals, but I'm anti-American because Americans are people. America would be awesome if you took away most of the people. I suppose that applies to the whole world.

 

[Engyo]

It is not un-American. Your thread is simply a cry for the usual suspects to come running to bash the Republican Party because you guys are looking real bad in the USA at this time in history. Have a nic bash and keep trying to wiggle out of the mess you guys have placed the country in. Fox News will not allow the people to overlook your contributions to the failures of the USA.

Sounds like a self-reinforcing psychosis to me, being co-dependently enabled by Fox News. You and your fellows are making Rupert Murdoch and his Saudi banker friends rich, and they are laughing all the way to the bank.

 

[esmith]

Good question! But I would rather allow "the John Birch society, the Religious Right, the Koch brothers, Rupert Murdoch, Roger Ailes, Pete Peterson, etc." to speak for themselves than to offer my interpretation of them. I think those folks are pretty representative of the Conservative Movement in America. For instance, it's not an interpretation, but just a fact, that some members of the Religious Right oppose teaching the Theory of Evolution in public schools. That is, they are not just advocates for teaching creationism, but also advocates against teaching evolution. I don't think that's an American value.

As I said, "I am a Conservative but do not necessarily subscribe to all of the beliefs of those organizations". Therefore, I would have to answer your question as follows: you are full of the male bovine conversion of agriculture products.

 

[Sunstone]

As I said, "I am a Conservative but do not necessarily subscribe to all of the beliefs of those organizations". Therefore, I would have to answer your question as follows: you are full of the male bovine conversion of agriculture products.

It is a pleasure and an honor to be thought full of BS by a Conservative who is incapable of admitting that even the John Birch Society might not be a paradigm of American values. Can we go for the KKK, too? Is there anyone on the Right you do not believe represents American values? Or are you just calling me full of BS for the fun of it?

 

[Sunstone]

It is not un-American. Your thread is simply a cry for the usual suspects to come running to bash the Republican Party because you guys are looking real bad in the USA at this time in history. Have a nic bash and keep trying to wiggle out of the mess you guys have placed the country in. Fox News will not allow the people to overlook your contributions to the failures of the USA.

Did you fart again?

 

[Gunfingers]

It is a pleasure and an honor to be thought full of BS by a Conservative who is incapable of admitting that even the John Birch Society might not be a paradigm of American values. Can we go for the KKK, too? Is there anyone on the Right you do not believe represents American values? Or are you just calling me full of BS for the fun of it?

There might be a differing view of what a conservative is going on here. Can you two give us an idea of what you mean by "conservative"?

 

[doppelganger]

America is an unifying identity - an idea whose central feature is the notion of a collective or shared identity in which we work together toward common goals, mutually sacrificing but mutually benefiting from sharing this common identity.

The central value of the modern conservative movement, as defined by its main philosophers, is self-interest, which is contrary to maintaining a working shared identity if elevated to the position of the highest value.

A stable society places civic virtue slightly ahead of self-interest, recognizing that both are vital to sustainable prosperity.

 

[esmith]

It is a pleasure and an honor to be thought full of BS by a Conservative who is incapable of admitting that even the John Birch Society might not be a paradigm of American values. Can we go for the KKK, too? Is there anyone on the Right you do not believe represents American values? Or are you just calling me full of BS for the fun of it?

No I am not just calling you full of BS for the fun of it. I am doing it because you are basically trolling. You can not assign all Conservatives to one set of ideas. I do not know what political beliefs you expound to, your age, gender, or educational level. However, I know that you are expressing anti-American ideals by saying that Conservatives are anti-American. I also know that whether or not I agree with various organizations does not necessarily indicate that I am anti-American; just anti-liberal in various programs.

 

[LuisDantas]

(...) However, I know that you are expressing anti-American ideals by saying that Conservatives are anti-American. (...)

Is that so? Would you like to elaborate on how and why?

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Why? They are self-haters and misanthropes who live in a fairyland which is composed of several definable parts.

It's interesting that in 2008 the GOP was struggling to re-define itself in the shadow of Bush's failure. And now they want to do it all over again. Insanity.

 

[Sunstone]

There might be a differing view of what a conservative is going on here. Can you two give us an idea of what you mean by "conservative"?

I thought the OP made clear that I was talking about the Conservative Movement in America, not about everyone who calls themselves a Conservative.

So far as I understand it, members of the Conservative Movement in America include "the John Birch society, the Religious Right, the Koch brothers, Rupert Murdoch, Roger Ailes, Pete Peterson, etc."

Historically, the Conservative Movement has pulled the Republican Party to the Right. For instance, Eisenhower was considered a Conservative during his day, but would be a liberal if his beliefs were stacked up next to beliefs typical of today's Movement Conservatives. And, according to many people, even Ronald Reagan would be considered too left wing for today's Conservative Movement.