WHY I BELIEVE THAT CHRIST IS GOD

[Audie]

I am rather amazed that so many Christians cannot see this. One cannot believe in the Adam and Eve myth and honestly believe that God is love. The New Testament is not much better. The God of Paul is clearly not a God of Love.

Not even a friendly flood?

 

[Colt]

No, there is no "Atheist God". But thank you for the laugh. And there are countless different versions of Christianity. In practically all of them the Christian God is not love.

One God many doctrines. You are ignorant of the rebellious spirit towards God that engulfs you.

 

[SigurdReginson]

As with so many our other heros of the faith,
insulting falsehoods are vital underpinnings
of their worship of the God of !ove.

"Saved" is such a convoluted notion.

" god" decides what it doesn't like and sets the rules.
Then he sends forth his creation,
mdesignrd so it will break his rules.

So to save them from himself, he
arranges to have someone tortured.
To pay himself for...

Yah... At least when Odin sacrificed himself to himself, it was for something he didn't already possess.

 

[Vee]

The fundamental reason why I believe that Christ is God, is that I find that the christian concept of God and of divine love is the highest possible concept. I find that the idea itself that God loves us so much that He chose to assume the human nature and accepted to suffer crucifission in order to save us, expresses such a high concept of God and of divine love that it can comes only from God and it is certainly a truth. This concept is fully convincing for me, it proves itself by itself and makes superfluous any other arguments . I believe that Chirst suffered His Passion to help us to have faith in Him and trust Him, to make us understand that God loves us infinitely, that God is good and mercifull and that God is near to us so that we may totally trust Him and open our heart to Him, be in communion with Him and be saved.
There are other religions teaching that God is love, but the problem is to define what the word “love” means, because by itself it could be only a vague and generic concept.
The christian faith is unique because it gives a very concrete and unique meaning to the concept of divine love: in fact God’s love actualizes in the acceptance of a terrible physical suffering; the God of the christian faith loves us so much that He is willing to suffer a painful death in order to save us. In the christian faith, love is not only a theoretical and vague concept; Christ’s Passion is a clear and concrete realization of the concept of divine love which teaches us what is the true meaning of love. I think that this christian idea of divine love is the highest possible concept of divine love and it is the fundamental reason why I believe that Christ is God.

Hi Marco,
Although I agree with you with regards to Jesus's loving qualities, I can't see how the fact that he's loving, makes him God. What do you think is the connection between those two concepts?
Many people are loving but that doesn't make them gods.
In the bible there are verses where God identifies Jesus as His son, and verses where Jesus identifies God as His father. A father and a son cannot be the same person.
In John 20:17 Jesus says "Stop clinging to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. But go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father and to my God and your God". John 23:31 reinforces that Jesus is God's son and not God himself "But these have been written down so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and because of believing, you may have life by means of his name".

 

[Audie]

One God many doctrines. You are ignorant of the rebellious spirit towards God that engulfs you.

Yup, ignorant and rebellious.

Anything at all you can say to fluff
up your fantasy without making up
insults against people you don't know or
understand?

 

[Subduction Zone]

One God many doctrines. You are ignorant of the rebellious spirit towards God that engulfs you.

LOL!! No, you are ignorant of the indoctrination that drives you. Try to remember the Ninth Commandment.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Since this is not a debate, but appears to be a dabate I will offer a thought on the Theology that Jesus Is God.

Firstly Jesus is not God as Jesus was a flesh body and the Bible tells us the flesh amounts to nothing.

Christ, the station of the Holy Spirit can be seen as God, as it is through the Holy Spirit we come to know God and all we can know of God.

So Jesus was not God, the Holy Spirit is all we can know of God and is the Attributes and yet all that, is not God in Essence.

We can never know the Essence of God.

I can also say I have come to see that Jesus Christ, the Son sacraficed Himself for all humanity, so that all humanity may embrace Baha'u'llah, the Glory of God, the Father.

Truth and Love, is thus relative to our perceptions of life and chosen frames of references.

Regards Tony

 

[Colt]

Yup, ignorant and rebellious.

Anything at all you can say to fluff
up your fantasy without making up
insults against people you don't know or
understand?

I wasn't talking to you, but pointing out Lucifer's spirit of rebellion caught your attention?

 

[Colt]

LOL!! No, you are ignorant of the indoctrination that drives you. Try to remember the Ninth Commandment.

Its not indoctrination in the same way secular so-called science indoctrinates Atheists. True religion has the open mind and is willing to go where both real science and real spirituality leads us.

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

Except our destructive nature.

Do you have what you would consider an overly destructive nature? I mean, I understand that in order to eat anything, we have to "destroy" something, and that in order to keep ourselves as clean as we might like, we're "destroying" things like viruses and bacteria perhaps.

But besides all of that, what destructive activities do you undertake on a daily basis? Or rather, what activities do you engage in with the express intent of destroying something?

If what you're talking about is "everyone else" destroying what you hold dear, some of that might just be a matter of one person finding what you hold dear to be their version of trash to be tossed out. That's not their "destructive nature" at work in an instance like that. It's just that they value things differently than you do.

And if you're talking about things like humans taking advantage of the environment, hurting one another, starting fights and wars and generally mucking things up - what I feel we need to combat that is education, dissemination of knowledge, and more acceptance/tolerance of the more innocuous of ideas contrary to our own, and less acceptance of ideas that are not innocuous. If God exists, He has pretty much proven that He's not going to come to our aid against that type of destruction. Right? I mean - how could you make a case otherwise? Because He promises to whisk us off to some fairytale dreamland when we're done here? A bit late to be saved from others' "destructive nature" in any way meaningful to THIS existence at that point, isn't it?

And besides all of that, I might have pegged you for the type to believe that the human body was of pretty low worth, and that the "soul" was the real prize. And if that's the case, then what's to worry about "destruction" of what ultimately ends up being second-rate trash? Or do you admit that this life is not second-rate? Perhaps you tacitly acknowledge that this life is extremely important? Perhaps aren't entirely sure there is another one coming after this? Perhaps "destruction" here is pretty important? Maybe you're one of those who needs to get your stories straight.

 

[Audie]

I wasn't talking to you, but pointing out Lucifer's spirit of rebellion caught your attention?

Cute.

Lies about me sometimes do

 

[Audie]

I wasn't talking to you, but pointing out Lucifer's spirit of rebellion caught your attention?

Cute.

Lies about me sometimes do

 

[Subduction Zone]

Its not indoctrination in the same way secular so-called science indoctrinates Atheists. True religion has the open mind and is willing to go where both real science and real spirituality leads us.

Yes, I know. Science "indoctrinates" because it works. You were just threatened from shortly after birth.

By the way, it is not "so-called science" and we don't need indoctrination. The scientific method works. This website is just one small example of it.

 

[Colt]

Yes, I know. Science "indoctrinates" because it works. You were just threatened from shortly after birth.

By the way, it is not "so-called science" and we don't need indoctrination. The scientific method works. This website is just one small example of it.

I like real science, it didn't threaten me after birth. That's loopy! Atheistic science is just another religion.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I like real science, it didn't threaten me after birth. That's loopy! Atheistic science is just another religion.

I have a feeling that you do not know what "real science" is. Real science just follows the scientific method. If you don't like that it appears that you do not like reality and I cannot help you with that.

 

[McBell]

Its not indoctrination in the same way secular so-called science indoctrinates Atheists. True religion has the open mind and is willing to go where both real science and real spirituality leads us.

what is the difference between "so-called science" and "real science"?

 

[Colt]

I have a feeling that you do not know what "real science" is. Real science just follows the scientific method. If you don't like that it appears that you do not like reality and I cannot help you with that.

" A mechanistic philosophy of life and the universe cannot be scientific because science recognizes and deals only with materials and facts. Philosophy is inevitably superscientific. Man is a material fact of nature, but his life is a phenomenon which transcends the material levels of nature in that it exhibits the control attributes of mind and the creative qualities of spirit." UB 1955

"Real science" deals with materials and facts. When you go beyond materials and facts and postulate a Godless universe buttressed by such facts then you are no longer a "true scientist", your science has become a philosophy.

What's truly sad is you are ignorant of your own conscious transcendence of the materials and facts that you observe and draw conclusions about. Having made such pronouncements you turn right around and argue that the universe is strictly material and mathematical.

 

[Colt]

what is the difference between "so-called science" and "real science"?

See post 97#

 

[Subduction Zone]

" A mechanistic philosophy of life and the universe cannot be scientific because science recognizes and deals only with materials and facts. Philosophy is inevitably superscientific. Man is a material fact of nature, but his life is a phenomenon which transcends the material levels of nature in that it exhibits the control attributes of mind and the creative qualities of spirit." UB 1955

"Real science" deals with materials and facts. When you go beyond materials and facts and postulate a Godless universe buttressed by such facts then you are no longer a "true scientist", your science has become a philosophy.

What's truly sad is you are ignorant of your own conscious transcendence of the materials and facts that you observe and draw conclusions about. Having made such pronouncements you turn right around and argue that the universe is strictly material and mathematical.

And what makes you think that your unlinked and unnamed source has any validity at all? I can only see desperate Christians quoting that nonsense in a short Google search.

That is a fail, try again.

 

[Subduction Zone]

See post 97#

Yes, a good laugh was had by all. It amounted to an argument from ignorance. Not very convincing.