WHY I BELIEVE THAT CHRIST IS GOD

[Unveiled Artist]

You are totally wrong; in fact I have not reported any personal experience, but rational arguments which are not vague at all. I have many personal experiences supporting my faith in Christ, but I am not talking about them because everybody can lie about personal experiences; on the contrary, rational arguments are something people can examine and understand.

But I was asking you questions about your experiences compared to others. Unless your personal experiences can't be trusted?

Your OP is not objective and they may be rational for you but they don't present any arguments to discuss.

I'm not sure how I'm wrong with asking questions?

 

[pearl]

The fundamental reason why I believe that Christ is God

We usually clarify Christ's divinity as God 'the Son', as only God the father is God when the term is used by itself.

Christ’s Passion is a clear and concrete realization of the concept of divine love which teaches us what is the true meaning of love. I think that this christian idea of divine love is the highest possible concept of divine love and it is the fundamental reason why I believe that Christ is God.

God in solidarity with his beloved creatures.

 

[mmarco]

Your OP is not objective and they may be rational for you but they don't present any arguments to discuss.

I disagree; I think I have provided objective arguments which distinguish the christian faith from any other religion, arguments that can be discussed.

 

[Audie]

Ha. Got me. I did say that.

However, the list of things he didn't say is exactly relevant.

I disagree; I think I have provided objective arguments which distinguish the christian faith from any other religion, arguments that can be discussed.

No argument. Of course its different.
All religions are different from eachother.

And most of them are the one true one.

This is not profound.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

[QUOTE="Unveiled Artist, post: 7019517, member: 55631"

Your OP is not objective and they may be rational for you but they don't present any arguments to discuss.

I disagree; I think I have provided objective arguments which distinguish the christian faith from any other religion, arguments that can be discussed.[/QUOTE]

They don't. Can you name a religion that is wrong based on your experience with that religion and proving against the validity of historical evidence that supports them?

Saying that Christianity is unique because I said so (because..) doesn't show how you came to that conclusion outside of your personal opinion.

 

[Colt]

The existence and the goodness of God is the most fundamental truth and I do not think we can deduce such truth from some other truth, because this would mean that we believe more in the other truth than in God. I believe in God because the certainty of His existence is in me and I feel His Presence, expecially during prayer. Nevertheless, I think there are solid rational arguments which confirms my beliefs.
Since I am a physicist, I would like to explain a couple of arguments based on a rational analysis of our scientific knowledges.

All what science shows about the physical reality is that it manifests itself as a realization of some specific abstract mathematical models (what we call “the laws of physics”); in fact, the subatomic components of matters (quantum particles and fields) are actually only abtract mathematical concepts. On the other hand, mathematical models are only constructions of the rational thought and a mathematical model can exist only as a thought in a thinking mind conceiving it; this implies that matter (and the physical reality) is not the foundation of reality, but its existence depends on a more fundamental reality i.e. consciousness: contrary to the basic hypothesis of materialism, consciousness is a more fundamental reality than matter.

Therefore the existence of this mathematically structured universe implies the existence of a conscious and intelligent God, conceiving it as a mathematical model. In other words, the universe can be only the manifestation of a mathematical theory existing in the mind of a personal God.
I think that atheism does not account for such fundamental scientific information about the physical reality and denies, without any rational arguments, the only rational explanation.

There is another argument from physics that I find strongly convincing; according to our scientific knowledges, all chemical and biological processes (including cerebral processes) are caused by the electromagnetic interaction between subatomic particles such as electrons and protons. Quantum mechanics accounts for such interactions, as well as for the properties of subatomic particles. The point is that there is no trace of consciousness, sensations, emotions, etc. in the laws of quantum mechanics (as well as in all the laws of physcis). Consciousness is irriducible to the laws of physics, while all cerebral processes are. This is for me the most convincing rational argument against materialism (which identifies cerebral processes as the origin of consciousness) and in favour of the existence of the soul, as the unphysical and trascendent principle necessary for the existence of our consciousness. Since our soul cannot have a physical origin, it can only be created directly by God. The existence of God is a necessary condition for the existence of our soul, as well as for the existence of us as conscious beings.

God consciousness is a gift, its inexplicable. I concede that there is no logic path that can be retraced to convince an unbeliever because I never followed such a path to arrive at belief to begin with. After all, what would undeniable "proof" of the existence of a Universal Absolute look like to the terribly limited mind of a finite who is not spirit born? That's why when we try to use logic --->to belief with non-believers we end up tangled in the weeds.

 

[Audie]

God consciousness is a gift, its inexplicable. I concede that there is no logic path that can be retraced to convince an unbeliever because I never followed such a path to arrive at belief to begin with. After all, what would undeniable "proof" of the existence of a Universal Absolute look like to the terribly limited mind of a finite Atheist? Thats why when you try to use logic to belief with non-believers we end up tangled in the weeds.

Oh right, atheists are stupid.
Your pal there says irrational ,before presenting his evidence - free assertions.

But you are right that no logic ( nor
anything else ) will prove God, no more than it will the unevidened assertions you make.

Inability to prove God should not be an issue for
the godies, as proof obviates faith, as noted elsewhere.

 

[mmarco]

No argument. Of course its different.
All religions are different from eachother.

My intention was to point out what is unique in Christianity and what represents the most important and fundamental difference between Christianity and the other religions.

 

[Audie]

My intention was to point out what is unique in Christianity and what represents the most important and fundamental difference between Christianity and the other religions.

You used a lot of words to say what we
all know.
Do you have some actual point to make
here?

 

[mmarco]

You used a lot of words to say what we
all know.
Do you have some actual point to make
here?

I think I have already made some actual points, even if you are going to deny it.

 

[Audie]

I think I have already made some actual points, even if you are going to deny it.

You made and asserted points, sure.

By "point" I rather obviously mean an ovrrall
point, ie reason for this mix of obvious
to all, self evident stuff and assertion of
"facts" like the existence of a soul that
are just hollow assertions.

Is there some point to all this other than
slipping it in that atheists are too stupid
to understand your so called logic?

 

[Wrangler]

By the way, Jesus never said He is not God

In fact, Jesus said he was not God in talking about his God. This is why I know Jesus is not God: the trinity is not in the Bible. God is depicted as singular and not trinitarian in nature 1,000’s of time. Not one time is God incarnate prophesied.

The Bible clearly says that God raised Jesus from the dead. The resurrected Jesus repeatedly talks about his God. See John 20:17 and Revelations 3.

There is only one God and that is Jesus’ God. (And there is no 3rd person. There is God and his Servant, the Anointed One who was given all authority by God after obeying God’s will to the cross.)

 

[Colt]

Oh right, atheists are stupid.
Your pal there says irrational ,before presenting his evidence - free assertions.

But you are right that no logic ( nor
anything else ) will prove God, no more than it will the unevidened assertions you make.

Inability to prove God should not be an issue for
the godies, as proof obviates faith, as noted elsewhere.

Sensitive? I didn't say Atheist are stupid, I said that there isn't a logic path to retrace for their benefit. Atheist demand proof when they already know that subjective reality cant be proven. So when no proof is forthcoming they use that as proof for a Godless universe. It's similar to trying to explain color to a blind person.

If you are ever born again of spirit then and only then will you understand what we are talking about.

 

[Audie]

In fact, Jesus said he was not God in talking about his God. This is why I know Jesus is not God: the trinity is not in the Bible. God is depicted as singular and not trinitarian in nature 1,000’s of time. Not one time is God incarnate prophesied.

The Bible clearly says that God raised Jesus from the dead. The resurrected Jesus repeatedly talks about his God. See John 20:17 and Revelations 3.

There is only one God and that is Jesus’ God. (And there is no 3rd person. There is God and his Servant, the Anointed One who was given all authority by God after obeying God’s will to the cross.)

Oh now you are just being irrational.
I heard about that.

 

[Audie]

Sensitive? I didn't say Atheist are stupid, I said that there isn't a logic path to retrace for their benefit. Atheist demand proof when they already know that subjective reality cant be proven. So when no proof is forthcoming they use that as proof for a Godless universe. It's similar to trying to explain color to a blind person.

If you are ever born again of spirit then and only then will you understand what we are talking about.

Oh right, insult then say I'm too sensitive.
Typical abuser pattern, actually.

You didn't say "stupid"in so many words but you and I both know what you mean so don't try being cute.

To remove any doubt, you say it again
with this garbage about how atheist (sic)
demand proof, and then try to prove godless universe.

Only an idiot would do that.

And then you give analogy indicating mental
deficiency, and go on to say you've deeper knowledge than is accessible to me.

Disingenuous in the extreme.

This Christian logic and love proves a mighty
thin veneer.

 

[dybmh]

the christian concept of God and of divine love is the highest possible concept.

Why does God require belief in Christ for salvation? Wouldn't the highest possible divine love include everyone without condition?

 

[Colt]

Oh right, insult then say I'm too sensitive.
Typical abuser pattern, actually.

You didn't say "stupid"in so many words but you and I both know what you mean so don't try being cute.

To remove any doubt, you say it again
with this garbage about how atheist (sic)
demand proof, and then try to prove godless universe.

Only an idiot would do that.

And then you give analogy indicating mental
deficiency, and go on to say you've deeper knowledge than is accessible to me.

Disingenuous in the extreme.

This Christian logic and love proves a mighty
thin veneer.

In search of being offended today? When you are that sensitive its because truth has been spoken and you don't like it.

Neither love nor spirituality is "logical" to a materialist.

 

[Sunstone]

So you believe yourself but don't believe jesus.

Maybe he's Jesus' top scientific advisor?
I'm sure there's a rational explanation in
this somewhere. We only need the sort
of person willing to dig deep enough for
it.

 

[Audie]

Maybe he's Jesus' top scientific advisor?
I'm sure there's a rational explanation in
this somewhere. We only need the sort
of person willing to dig deep enough for
it.

I heard there was logic, rationality.
One can but confident its forthcoming,
for lo, those of an indwelling Holy Spirit
would not practice to deceive.

 

[Audie]

In search of being offended today? When you are that sensitive its because truth has been spoken and you don't like it.

Neither love nor spirituality is "logical" to a materialist.

Like you even have the capacity to
offend me.

Or are speaking some " truth".

But never mind, we' ve your measure. No need to double down on it.