Why do they look so different?

[calm]

Ham had 2 children, Mizraim (Egypt) and Cush (Ethiopia). Both brothers must have looked similar, because they have the same father and mother. Now my question is, why do the Ethiopians look so different from today's Egyptians? Why are the Ethiopians black but the modern Egyptians white and that although the Egyptians live in a place where it is on average hotter than in Ethiopia? Has Ham fathered a black and a white son at the same time? Or are today's Egyptians actually the children of Abraham from the tribe of Ishmael?(so semites) But where then are the descendants of ancient Egypt?

Can anyone here give a Biblical answer without any DNA tests or the like?

 

[ChristineM]

My guess is the bible authors didnt have a clue what they were talking about.

 

[dybmh]

Is there a larger point you would like make regarding ethnicity?

 

[calm]

My guess is the bible authors didnt have a clue what they were talking about.

I guess that the Egyptians of today are actually the chilren of Ishmael, and they emigrated to Egypt sometime. So they are not really Hamites, but Semites.

I don't know what happened to the ancient Egyptians, but I would like to know.

 

[ChristineM]

I guess that the Egyptians of today are actually the chilren of Ishmael, and they emigrated to Egypt sometime. So they are not really Hamites, but Semites.

I don't know what happened to the ancient Egyptians, but I would like to know.

Well you limit your options denying DNA tests in the answer. Any other answer is just guesswork

 

[calm]

Is there a larger point you would like make regarding ethnicity?

I only wonder, when all Ham's children are black, why the Egyptians are white and look like the people in the East.

And besides, the Egyptians live in a place where it is on average hotter than in many places of Africa where black people live.

 

[crossfire]

I only wonder, when all Ham's children are black, why the Egyptians are white and look like the people in the East.

And besides, the Egyptians live in a place where it is on average hotter than in many places of Africa where black people live.

The Canaanites weren't black, were they? They were Hamites, according to the bible. They also seemed to intermarry with the other people of the region quite a bit.

 

[crossfire]

Ham had 2 children, Mizraim (Egypt) and Cush (Ethiopia). Both brothers must have looked similar, because they have the same father and mother. Now my question is, why do the Ethiopians look so different from today's Egyptians? Why are the Ethiopians black but the modern Egyptians white and that although the Egyptians live in a place where it is on average hotter than in Ethiopia? Has Ham fathered a black and a white son at the same time? Or are today's Egyptians actually the children of Abraham from the tribe of Ishmael?(so semites) But where then are the descendants of ancient Egypt?

Can anyone here give a Biblical answer without any DNA tests or the like?

Actually, the bible mentions 4 sons of Ham:

Genesis 10:6-19

6 Ham’s sons: Cush, Mizraim, Put, and Canaan. 7 Cush’s sons: Seba, Havilah, Sabtah, Raamah, and Sabteca. And Raamah’s sons: Sheba and Dedan.

8 Cush fathered Nimrod, who was the first powerful man on earth. 9 He was a powerful hunter in the sight of the Lord. That is why it is said, “Like Nimrod, a powerful hunter in the sight of the Lord.” 10 His kingdom started with Babylon, Erech, Accad, and Calneh, in the land of Shinar. 11 From that land he went to Assyria and built Nineveh, Rehoboth-ir, Calah, 12 and Resen, between Nineveh and the great city Calah.

13 Mizraim fathered Ludim, Anamim, Lehabim, Naphtuhim, 14 Pathrusim, Casluhim (the Philistines came from them), and Caphtorim.

15 Canaan fathered Sidon his firstborn, then Heth, 16 the Jebusites, the Amorites, the Girga****es, 17 the Hivites, the Arkites, the Sinites, 18 the Arvadites, the Zemarites, and the Hamathites. Afterward the Canaanite clans scattered. 19 The Canaanite border went from Sidon going toward Gerar as far as Gaza, and going toward Sodom, Gomorrah, Admah, and Zeboiim as far as Lasha.

20 These are Ham’s sons, by their clans, according to their languages, in their own lands and their nations.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

My guess is the bible authors didnt have a clue what they were talking about.

Could it be that you're projecting? Or is it simply shallowness?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I don't know what happened to the ancient Egyptians, but I would like to know.

The Copts are the indigenous Egyptians. Their language is descended from ancient Egyptian. They face a lot of persecution and violence in their own homeland.

 

[Brickjectivity]

Ham had 2 children, Mizraim (Egypt) and Cush (Ethiopia). Both brothers must have looked similar, because they have the same father and mother. Now my question is, why do the Ethiopians look so different from today's Egyptians? Why are the Ethiopians black but the modern Egyptians white and that although the Egyptians live in a place where it is on average hotter than in Ethiopia? Has Ham fathered a black and a white son at the same time? Or are today's Egyptians actually the children of Abraham from the tribe of Ishmael?(so semites) But where then are the descendants of ancient Egypt?

Can anyone here give a Biblical answer without any DNA tests or the like?

Yes. Genesis 30:39 has the answer. According to this the color of creatures depends upon their surroundings when they mate. That kind of makes sense, too, doesn't it and seems to extend to other qualities such as tolerances for temperatures. Of course we are not talking about scientific observations just generalizing the principle in Genesis 30:39. I don't follow this generalization personally, but it is what Genesis provides to explain for color differentiation. I am not of the opinion that Genesis functions in the Scientific realm. Genesis does, however, provide its explanation for this.

 

[ChristineM]

Could it be that you're projecting? Or is it simply shallowness?

Not really, i guess that tribesmen some 3000 years ago had little idea of ethnicity and migration patterns outside their own little playing field.

But perhaps you have a different take on life in the bronze age

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Not really, i guess that tribesmen some 3000 years ago had little idea of ethnicity and migration patterns outside their own little playing field.

But perhaps you have a different take on life in the bronze age

At least a far less condescending one, but I'll let you return to your own little playing field.

 

[Howard Is]

Genesis 30:39 has the answer. According to this the color of creatures depends upon their surroundings when they mate.

Well that inspires trust in the word of god. Not.

Surely that is very good evidence that this text was written by someone with no clue ?

 

[dybmh]

I only wonder, when all Ham's children are black, why the Egyptians are white and look like the people in the East.

And besides, the Egyptians live in a place where it is on average hotter than in many places of Africa where black people live.

Generally speaking, I find this in very poor taste. Even if what you are saying above is true, why focus on it?

 

[shunyadragon]

Ham had 2 children, Mizraim (Egypt) and Cush (Ethiopia). Both brothers must have looked similar, because they have the same father and mother. Now my question is, why do the Ethiopians look so different from today's Egyptians? Why are the Ethiopians black but the modern Egyptians white and that although the Egyptians live in a place where it is on average hotter than in Ethiopia? Has Ham fathered a black and a white son at the same time? Or are today's Egyptians actually the children of Abraham from the tribe of Ishmael?(so semites) But where then are the descendants of ancient Egypt?

Can anyone here give a Biblical answer without any DNA tests or the like?

. . . because this Biblical record is not meaningful concerning the history of humanity.

 

[shunyadragon]

I only wonder, when all Ham's children are black, why the Egyptians are white and look like the people in the East.

And besides, the Egyptians live in a place where it is on average hotter than in many places of Africa where black people live.

The evolution of the races and ethnicity is hundreds of thousands to millions of years with the migration of our ancestral humans out of Africa.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

I guess that the Egyptians of today are actually the chilren of Ishmael, and they emigrated to Egypt sometime. So they are not really Hamites, but Semites.

I don't know what happened to the ancient Egyptians, but I would like to know.

You say you'd like to know, but I don't actually think you'd like any answer that wasn't at least in part Biblical.

And unfortunately, there isn't one of those...

 

[Brickjectivity]

Well that inspires trust in the word of god. Not.

Surely that is very good evidence that this text was written by someone with no clue ?

Faith in God is not generically based in literal arguments about Genesis but is only based there by some groups. There is no forward or author's note telling us what the book is for, but it certainly wasn't written with English in mind or as a text to teach complete strangers about Judaism or about God. We're all just trying to reverse engineer it to guess at what people where trying to use it for three thousand years ago. I'm getting pretty good at it, but some people might disagree with me about that. I'm halfway decent -- almost Leave it to Beaver decent. That is overstating my expertise, but I mean I'm not the worst.

The question is about Genesis, and Genesis is the source for the story of Shem, Ham and Japheth. Genesis contains the geneologies in question. Therefore if Genesis says that locations where animals mate changes how their offspring look then it provides a literary consistent answer for why people in hot climates are darker than people in cold climates in Genesis. Obviously they mate in hot climates and somehow become darker as a result, or they mate near dark objects or at night. The text is not specific as to the exact trigger which changes the color. Many people feel it is the dye.

I suppose it really matters to some people that this does not supply a Scientific basis for beliefs in God, but its not actually relevant to most theologians. Its a side issue having to do with literal interpretations of Genesis and is only relevant in that context.

 

[74x12]

Ham had 2 children, Mizraim (Egypt) and Cush (Ethiopia). Both brothers must have looked similar, because they have the same father and mother. Now my question is, why do the Ethiopians look so different from today's Egyptians? Why are the Ethiopians black but the modern Egyptians white and that although the Egyptians live in a place where it is on average hotter than in Ethiopia? Has Ham fathered a black and a white son at the same time? Or are today's Egyptians actually the children of Abraham from the tribe of Ishmael?(so semites) But where then are the descendants of ancient Egypt?

Can anyone here give a Biblical answer without any DNA tests or the like?

It was Cush who inherited the dark skin. That's why his name literally means black in Hebrew.