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white supremecy

Discussion in 'General Debates' started by give me liberty or give m, Jun 17, 2004.

  1. Lightkeeper

    Lightkeeper Well-Known Member

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    I was with you until your last few sentences. You greatly contradicted yourself.
     
  2. Ardhanariswar

    Ardhanariswar I'm back!

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    yes people are equal, every race has thier different qualities

    i only said what i said to make a point that anyone can focus on a *bad* (meaning what is bad in another person's perspective (which could not be bad at all)) trait of a specific race and call thier own race supieror.
    sory for the misunderstanding.

    plus, i would bet a large amount of money that this guy would not be white supremacist if he was not white...
     
  3. dan

    dan Well-Known Member

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    I'd like to share with you all a fact that seems to have escaped your attention: race has nothing to do with genetics. Race is a transitory category that we place on people based on our own bigotry. Race does not exist outside of our racist mind; it is not a scientific fact (or even theory for that matter) it is something that we invented for our own comfort and convenience. The only thing that genetically seperates me from Ghandi, Denzel Washington, Geronimo or Lucy Lui is NOTHING. There is no genetical difference.
     
  4. Ardhanariswar

    Ardhanariswar I'm back!

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    hmm perhaps. but how do you explain that south indians have lower metabolism than europeans?

    perhaps it is what they eat. lol.
     
  5. dan

    dan Well-Known Member

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    It is what they eat. Many things are the result of outside influences. Sickle Cell is a regional disease, not racial. Asians are on average shorter because they eat less protein than we do. Race is a myth. Most of the conclusions y'all are arriving at are the result of generalizations and stereotypes.

    Which "race" is taller on average? African Americans, Asians or Caucasians?

    What demographic is using up most of our welfare? Young inner city families, elderly rural citizens, or immigrants?

    How did every civilization from Adam until Constantine define race? By what government you swore allegiance to. Race was invented by the Catholics as a way to rationalize their bigotry. They invented eugenics and racism. The Holocaust is a direct result of their work, and I can prove it.
     
  6. anders

    anders Well-Known Member

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    The absurdity of the "race" concept is shown already in the nomenclature. I am a fairly typical Swede: tall, rather fair-skinned (at least in wintertime), brown hair, greenish eyes, so Americans would unhesitatingly classify me as a "Caucasian". All my ancestors (in some cases traceable back to the 16th century) were born between 2000 and 2500 km away from the nearest part of the Caucasus, and so was I.
     
  7. dan

    dan Well-Known Member

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    The idea of the supremecy of any race is logical fallacy.
     
  8. Ceridwen018

    Ceridwen018 Well-Known Member

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    I hope I'm not back-tracking too much here, but on the issue of blacks being better athletes, the premise for that is founded on science. Blacks have better muscle tone than any other race, which allows them to build bigger muscles faster and keep them longer. This doesn't automatically make them better athletes, as there is much more to sports than muscles, but it can't hurt.
     
  9. Pah

    Pah Uber all member

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    The article from ReligiousNewsBlog shows a group that is using Christianity to cover it's white surpemecist views.. They will go so far as to "warp" the government of South Carolina and succeed from the United States (again???) if they don't get their way.

    Christian sets sights on S. Carolina
    Item 7775 • Posted: Tue, Jul. 06 2004 • Weblogged by ReligionNewsBlog.com

    http://www.religionnewsblog.com/7775-Christian_sets_sights_on_S._Carolina.html

    Star-Telegram (USA), July 4, 2004
    http://www.dfw.com
    By Jack Douglas Jr., Star-Telegram Staff Writer

    TYLER - In a small tin building on the outskirts of this East Texas town, Cory Burnell has sold cellphones, gourmet coffee and a brand of religion meant to infuse God into government.

    In a soft voice far from the thunderous tones of many Southern preachers, Burnell pledges to lead throngs of Christian conservatives -- 12,000 at a time -- to South Carolina to either change the government or secede from the Union.

    sidebar to the article:
    The plan, Burnell said, is to saturate the state with like-minded voters who would work to replace the U.S. Constitution with the Ten Commandments as the "foundation of law."

    And unless the U.S. government is overhauled and begins prohibiting abortion and same-sex marriage, Burnell vowed to hold a "convention of the people" by 2016 in hopes of causing South Carolina to secede.


    "People are going to call us crazy," Burnell, 28, conceded recently in an interview at his modest office.

    But that, he said, is because "we're so far ahead of the curve."

    "At some point, Christians aren't going to think this is such a radical idea anymore," he said.


    An exodus forms

    Until a month ago, Burnell was an unknown, teaching math to children at a private school, attending a nondenominational church in Tyler, selling cellphones and trying to make a go of a small coffee shop called Jitters.

    Then he announced the formation of ChristianExodus.org, an Internet group that claims to have recruited 600 members nationwide. Three-quarters of those members, Burnell said, have committed to uprooting their families and moving to South Carolina.

    The first wave of Christian transplants is set for 2006.

    As co-founder and president of ChristianExodus, Burnell has been called a "kook" and a "hatemonger," names that he says cause him to wince.

    His critics, he contends, actually hate Christianity.

    While watchdog groups predict that ChristianExodus will fizzle before it can stage a serious religious revolution, it has attracted national attention as one of several groups that want to break from the rest of the country.

    Burnell said his group picked South Carolina over Alabama and Mississippi because it already has a "Christian-leaning electorate" and an accessible seashore.

    "If independence does become necessary, wouldn't it be better if we had a coastal port?" Burnell said.

    Several politicians in South Carolina seemed leery of talking about ChristianExodus and the prospects of their state becoming a sovereign nation under the leadership of Christian crusaders.

    The press secretary for Sen. Fritz Hollings, a Democrat, refused to even give her name when told of the subject, and the spokesman for Republican Sen. Lindsey Graham did not respond to a request to comment.

    Will Folks, however, press secretary for Gov. Mark Sanford, suggested that the group would find South Carolina enticing.

    "We've obviously got a beautiful state that's open to anyone who wants to come and enjoy our quality of life," Folks said.

    "As for seceding from the Union," he added, "we've tried that once already in 1861 and it didn't work out so well for us."


    The game plan

    The first stop on the exodus for Burnell and his family will be California.

    Burnell, his pregnant wife and their young son plan to move there soon to be near his wife's parents. They plan to stay until 2006, when they hope to lead the first 12,000 Christians to South Carolina.

    Thousands more are expected to follow, according to the ChristianExodus Web site, with members joining grassroots political campaigns that will "overwhelmingly affect state elections" by 2014.

    There would then be a call for constitutional reforms to return "proper autonomy to the state," the Web site says.

    Burnell denied assertions made by those who monitor religious zealots that ChristianExodus exhibits similarities to a hate group, promoting a white supremacist cause behind the cloak of a religious movement.

    "You start using language in the Bible, and people are going to call you a hatemonger," he said. "You can't let that deter you."

    Burnell says that he has a foster brother who is black and that, as a youth growing up in California, "I played baseball with black fellows all the time."

    ChristianExodus' Web site also says that it "demands that all races be treated equally as children of God" and that it "will not tolerate any racial hatred or discrimination by its members."

    It also said that, once in South Carolina, "members will work to ensure equal access to and treatment before the law for all God's people, irrespective of color or national origin."

    Burnell, however, acknowledges that he is an active member of the pro-Confederate League of the South, a group that has drawn the attention of the Southern Poverty Law Center in Alabama, which monitors extremist activities.

    In an interview with The State newspaper in Columbia, S.C., Mark Potok, editor of the center's Intelligence Report, said ChristianExodus "should be taken seriously" because its leader, Burnell, associates with the League of the South.

    The center has placed the league on its "hate group" list, Potok told the newspaper.

    In an interview last week, Burnell called the Southern Poverty Law Center a part of the "liberal fringe" and maintained that the watchdog group offered no evidence that the League of the South promotes white supremacy.

    The league's Web site says its policies concerning race "must be free of hatred and malice."

    But it also says "this does not mean ... that white Southerners should give control over their civilisation and its institutions to another race, whether it be native blacks or Hispanic immigrants."

    To do so, the Web site says, would be equivalent to "cultural and ethnic suicide."


    Ole Anthony, a founder and president of the Dallas-based Trinity Foundation, which also monitors religious extremism, predicted that ChristianExodus will not succeed in its ultimate goals.

    Leaders of such movements, Anthony said, "may be sincere, but they're nutty as a fruitcake."

    And while ChristianExodus organizers are calling for a religious revolt through peaceful means, they could still cause harm, Anthony said.

    "They're dangerous to themselves and to their followers [because] there are going to be people who believe this, sell everything and go down" to South Carolina, he said.

    Once they do, Anthony predicted, they will realize that they have "totally disrupted their whole lives and their families in the name of God."

    Burnell said he will surprise his critics, especially as "things get worse."

    By that, Burnell says, he means that "homosexual marriage is coming to every state in the Union" and that federal hate-speech legislation would one day be levied against those who speak in "Biblical terms" against such issues as abortion.

    "If we can make a debate of state sovereignty in a public square," he suggested, "we might just find that we are able to change people's minds."
     
  10. dan

    dan Well-Known Member

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    This is another conclusion drawn without researching fully the claims. "Blacks" were seperated out by the white community and subjected to over 400 years of manual labor. The people we call "blacks" are only better athletes because we isolated them and made them work out for 400 years. If we did it to Irish or Chinese people then science would say, "Oh my gosh, Chinese people have much better muscle structure than anyone else. The Chinese are better athletes!" It has absolutely nothing to do with genetics; only conditioning (that research also only provides an average, not an all-sweeping generalization). Race is not scientific, it is cultural. It is something we invented to make us feel better about ourselves.
     
  11. Ceridwen018

    Ceridwen018 Well-Known Member

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    That makes sense, Dan. Truth be told, I don't know a whole lot about the muscle tone thing--I just read that somewhere.
     
  12. Pah

    Pah Uber all member

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    I don't know where you get four hundred years and I'm not sure of the conditions for about two hundred years or so but I find it offensive to refer to slavery and segregation as "manual labor" and then say they benefited from it.

    If this post is againt ReligiousForum rules, I'll apologize for the remark but not for my feeligs your post engendered.
     
  13. Ardhanariswar

    Ardhanariswar I'm back!

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    uh, there are blacks in africa you know. perhaps its where they live, but theres this fast runner that runs in his country that has a high altitude.

    but when you look there, you see fat black people. they are only fat because they are poor. theres nothing to eat except for fatty junk.
     
  14. Pah

    Pah Uber all member

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    Tallness in African tribes is an environemtal adapatation ocurring in alt least the following tribes.
    Kavirondos
    Krio Fula
    Negroes of Buganda
    Masai

    "Manual labor", indeed!

    I suppose that pygmies were just lazy and didn't live in the forests.
     
  15. Ceridwen018

    Ceridwen018 Well-Known Member

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    Lol, yes, those lazy pygmies!

    Those are good points, pah and Gerani.
     
  16. pegan

    pegan Member

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    Honestly, I've lived in Britain and other parts of Europe. Now, however, I live in the United States, where everyone "breeds" as they please.

    Aren't whites just as capable of "breeding" as blacks and other races?

    I don't know if that was mentioned yet, but just thought I'd add my worth of it.

    ~*Pegan*~
     
  17. tumble_weed

    tumble_weed Member

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    Well I think I want to mention this:

    Rascism was probably invented by the first groups of people to distinguish between other rivaling tribes...sadly today we still have rival tribes...perhaps not in the way they were when the first humans were around...and maybe we dont use clubs and spears....we use bombs and guns now and the tribes are called countries...
     
  18. pegan

    pegan Member

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    Supremacy is not up for a mere human to decide, or a "group" of humans for that matter. Humans, while beautiful and horrible at the same time, can never know everything, let alone all of those things that count.
     
  19. dan

    dan Well-Known Member

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    Not taking responsibility for your feelings is a pretty convenient way to hide from the world.

    I did not use "manual labor" as a euphamism for slavery. Much of Slavery consisted of manual labor.

    On average, "black people" are a good two inches shorter than white people. Tallness in a tribe is a result of regional and dietic influences.

    Argue all you want, but race was invented by the Catholic church in the dark ages. If you think you have proof otherwise you're welcome to share it; but race was determined by nothing more than your political affiliations up until the Catholic church decided that they needed to prove that white people were better than everyone else. They sponsored thousands of scientists in their quest to find the "missing link" between blacks and apes. That would have proven it fot them. That's where that term comes from, by the way. Darwin had nothing to do with any "links." It all comes from a chart that they used to map out the heirarchy of the "Races."

    All the bickering and disagreeing in the world cannot change fact. Race is a false premise we attatch onto ourselves.
     
  20. Pah

    Pah Uber all member

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    Ah, Dan posting what I did it is taking responsibility for the feelings

    The time span you stated included the time of slavery. You seem to think that the manual labor of slavery is what made the difference.

    I'm under the impression that caucasian is shorter than negroid "on average" Do you have anything to back up your claim? (and please report it here - not just reference the book)

    I said that environmental adaptation is the reason - not "manual labor" and you now seem to agree.

    Please, Dan, provide a summary and cite the reference for us.



    Darwin had everything to do with links but focused on species of which race is an attribute in the human species.

    It is hardly a false premise. Forensic medicine can determine what race a skull belongs. http://medlib.med.utah.edu/kw/osteo/forensics/race.html

    Speaking of just blood -
     
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