Which one is a Cult? A or B?

[Dogknox20]

But He was Thomas's God and Lord.
The Bible tells us that the Father our one God and that Jesus is our on Lord.
If that means that Jesus cannot be God does it mean that the Father cannot be Lord, even though the scriptures tell us that YHWH is the Lord.

Hello.. Brian2, I hope all is well

God is perfect "God is love" to love perfectly he needs another.. Love of self is not love it is selfishness!
For God to be perfect he needs another other then himself to Love! ...

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4

 

[YoursTrue]

But He was Thomas's God and Lord.
The Bible tells us that the Father our one God and that Jesus is our on Lord.
If that means that Jesus cannot be God does it mean that the Father cannot be Lord, even though the scriptures tell us that YHWH is the Lord.

Again, the word, or term 'God,' (or god) can take on different contexts.

 

[YoursTrue]

The flesh was weak and prayed to the Spirit for strength. Once again not two separate persons, but flesh and Spirit. The Spirit was God (called the Father) and the flesh was called the Son.

I guess you figured his flesh was not too weak when he walked on water? Or maybe ou think God comes and goes in Jesus when he was on the earth. I guess. Anyway - have a good night, I think we're rounding our discussion up.

 

[Dogknox20]

Again, the word, or term 'God,' (or god) can take on different contexts.

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Elizbeth is a Jew.. Jews believe in "One (1) God!
41 When Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the baby leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit. 42 In a loud voice she exclaimed: “Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the child you will bear! 43 But why am I so favored, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?

Mother of "My Lord" can only means "Mother of my God"!

 

[YoursTrue]

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Elizbeth is a Jew.. Jews believe in "One (1) God!
41 When Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the baby leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit. 42 In a loud voice she exclaimed: “Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the child you will bear! 43 But why am I so favored, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?

Mother of "My Lord" can only means "Mother of my God"!

See, again -- in the context of how the word is used, it can be applied differently in different circumstances.

 

[YoursTrue]

.
Elizbeth is a Jew.. Jews believe in "One (1) God!
41 When Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the baby leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit. 42 In a loud voice she exclaimed: “Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the child you will bear! 43 But why am I so favored, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?

Mother of "My Lord" can only means "Mother of my God"!

Remember, by the way, Psalm 82, which Jesus quoted.

 

[Brian2]

Again, the word, or term 'God,' (or god) can take on different contexts.

What is the context for Thomas when he calls Jesus his God?

 

[Brian2]

Hello.. Brian2, I hope all is well

God is perfect "God is love" to love perfectly he needs another.. Love of self is not love it is selfishness!
For God to be perfect he needs another other then himself to Love! ...

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4

Yes God is a God of relationship and love and has spent eternity in relationship and love.

 

[Brian2]

You still are not answering the question of how a man could raise himself up from the dead.

I doubt that a JW could answer that. For a start they believe Jesus was not raised bodily. Secondly they do not realise that at the death of the body the soul remains alive.

And for the third or fourth time - How can he say he was before Abraham, when he had not been born until after Abraham was already dead?

How is it that Jesus could say: John 17: 5And now, Father, glorify Me in Your presence with the glory I had with You before the world existed.

 

[Brian2]

I don't think that is what that verse means. I know that is commonly taught but it is an inaccurate translation. You can't have a God with God without having more than one God.

You can have God with His Son with and in Him from eternity however and the 2 having the same nature and sharing the same life which the Son gets from His Father.................that is why He is call the Son and the Father is called the Father.

 

[Dogknox20]

See, again -- in the context of how the word is used, it can be applied differently in different circumstances.

.
Hello YoursTrue I hope all is well with you..
Your words can be applied differently in different circumstances
I ask... Give some examples!

In Luke 1.. The word "Lord" is always used to mean "God"!
16 He will bring back many of the people of Israel to the Lord their God. 17 And he will go on before the Lord, in the spirit...—to make ready a people prepared for the Lord.”
25 “The Lord has done this for me,” she said. ...
28 The angel went to her and said, “Greetings, you who are highly favored! The Lord is with you.”
38 “I am the Lord’s servant,” Mary answered.
43 But why am I so favored, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?
46 And Mary said:
“My soul glorifies the Lord
etc
etc
NOT....
YoursTrue not one verse in Luke 1 can "Lord" mean anything other the God!

YoursTrue Give some examples.. If you can!

 

[Dogknox20]

Yes God is a God of relationship and love and has spent eternity in relationship and love.

.
I reply.. God can not be perfect by loving himself! To have PERFECT Love; you MUST give of yourself to another! THUS...

Brian2 thus there is "The Word" the second person to the trinity!
In the beginning there was "The Word" the word was God!

 

[Dogknox20]

Remember, by the way, Psalm 82, which Jesus quoted.

By Psalm 82 you mean God is telling man there are other gods?! Small "g"!
In Luke 1 every time the word Lord is written it has a Large "L"!

YoursTrue Again I point out the word "Lord" is used many times in Luke 1; every time it is written it means "God"! Large "G"!

 

[YoursTrue]

By Psalm 82 you mean God is telling man there are other gods?! Small "g"!
In Luke 1 every time the word Lord is written it has a Large "L"!

YoursTrue Again I point out the word "Lord" is used many times in Luke 1; every time it is written it means "God"! Large "G"!

You also do realize that when the scrolls were written and passed on for centuries there was no punctuation or differentiation between lower and upper case?

 

[YoursTrue]

I doubt that a JW could answer that. For a start they believe Jesus was not raised bodily. Secondly they do not realise that at the death of the body the soul remains alive.



How is it that Jesus could say: John 17: 5And now, Father, glorify Me in Your presence with the glory I had with You before the world existed.

Before we get into that, may I ask if you believe angels that were seen were humans? Or did they look like, and act like humans?

 

[Dogknox20]

You also do realize that when the scrolls were written and passed on for centuries there was no punctuation or differentiation between lower and upper case?

YoursTrue Yes you are right..... There was no bible until the Holy Catholic Church made it! The Church came before the bible... Even then there was NO pages numbers or verse numbers until later!
We must assume way back when there was a different word for small 'g' god then large "G" God! I am NOT a scripture scholar; I have relied on the expertise of the many bible translations around all but the New World Translation I refer to!

All things considered.... The word "Lord" in Luke 1 means God.. Large "G"! Of the many verses (below) only two (2) have a word I don't understand..** Adonai & Hashem I must assume they mean God or Lord!
KJ21 And Mary said, “Behold the handmaid of the Lord; be it unto me according to thy word.” And the angel departed from her.
ASV And Mary said, Behold, the handmaid of the Lord; be it unto me according to thy word. And the angel departed from her.
AMP Then Mary said, “Behold, I am the servant of the Lord; may it be done to me according to your word.” And the angel left her.
AMPC Then Mary said, Behold, I am the handmaiden of the Lord; let it be done to me according to what you have said. And the angel left her.
BRG And Mary said, Behold the handmaid of the Lord; be it unto me according to thy word. And the angel departed from her.
CSB “See, I am the Lord’s servant,” said Mary. “May it happen to me as you have said.” Then the angel left her.
CEB Then Mary said, “I am the Lord’s servant. Let it be with me just as you have said.” Then the angel left her.
CJB Miryam said, “I am the servant of ** Adonai; may it happen to me as you have said.” Then the angel left her.
CEV Mary said, “I am the Lord’s servant! Let it happen as you have said.” And the angel left her.
DARBY And Mary said, Behold the bondmaid of [the] Lord; be it to me according to thy word. And the angel departed from her.
DLNT And Mary said, “Behold the slave of the Lord. May it be done to me according to your word”. And the angel departed from her.
DRA And Mary said: Behold the handmaid of the Lord; be it done to me according to thy word. And the angel departed from her.
ERV Mary said, “I am the Lord’s servant. Let this thing you have said happen to me!” Then the angel went away.
EHV Then Mary said, “See, I am the Lord’s servant. May it happen to me as you have said.” Then the angel left her.
ESV And Mary said, “Behold, I am the servant of the Lord; let it be to me according to your word.” And the angel departed from her.
ESVUK And Mary said, “Behold, I am the servant of the Lord; let it be to me according to your word.” And the angel departed from her.
EXB Mary said, “[L Look; T Behold] I am the ·servant [bondservant; T handmaid] of the Lord. Let this happen to me ·as you say [according to your word]!” Then the angel ·went away [left her].
GNV Then Mary said, Behold the servant of the Lord: be it unto me according to thy word. So the Angel departed from her.
GW Mary answered, “I am the Lord’s servant. Let everything you’ve said happen to me.” Then the angel left her.
GNT “I am the Lord's servant,” said Mary; “may it happen to me as you have said.” And the angel left her.
HCSB “I am the Lord’s slave,” said Mary. “May it be done to me according to your word.” Then the angel left her.
ICB Mary said, “I am the servant girl of the Lord. Let this happen to me as you say!” Then the angel went away.
ISV Then Mary said, “Truly I am the Lord’s servant. Let everything you have said happen to me.” Then the angel left her.
PHILLIP Sn “I belong to the Lord, body and soul,” replied Mary, “let it happen as you say.” And at this the angel left her.
JUB Then Mary said, Behold the handmaid of the Lord; be it unto me according to thy word. And the angel departed from her.
KJV And Mary said, Behold the handmaid of the Lord; be it unto me according to thy word. And the angel departed from her.
AKJV And Mary said, Behold the handmaid of the Lord; be it unto me according to thy word. And the angel departed from her.
LEB So Mary said, “Behold, the Lord’s female slave! May it happen to me according to your word.” And the angel departed from her.
TLB Mary said, “I am the Lord’s servant, and I am willing to do whatever he wants. May everything you said come true.” And then the angel disappeared.
MSG “And did you know that your cousin Elizabeth conceived a son, old as she is? Everyone called her barren, and here she is six months pregnant! Nothing, you see, is impossible with God.” And Mary said, Yes, I see it all now: I’m the Lord’s maid, ready to serve. Let it be with me just as you say. Then the angel left her.
MEV Mary said, “I am the servant of the Lord. May it be unto me according to your word.” Then the angel departed from her.
MOUNCE So Mary said, “Behold, the maidservant of the Lord! Let it happen to me according to · your word.” Then the angel departed from her.
NOG Mary answered, “I am the Lord’s servant. Let everything you’ve said happen to me.” Then the angel left her.
NABRE Mary said, “Behold, I am the handmaid of the Lord. May it be done to me according to your word.” Then the angel departed from her.
NASB And Mary said, “Behold, the Lord’s bond-servant; may it be done to me according to your word.” And the angel departed from her.
NASB1995 And Mary said, “Behold, the bond slave of the Lord; may it be done to me according to your word.” And the angel departed from her.
NCB Then Mary said, “Behold, I am the servant of the Lord. Let it be done to me according to your word.” After this, the angel departed from her.
NCV Mary said, “I am the servant of the Lord. Let this happen to me as you say!” Then the angel went away.
NET So Mary said, “Yes, I am a servant of the Lord; let this happen to me according to your word.” Then the angel departed from her.
NIRV “I serve the Lord,” Mary answered. “May it happen to me just as you said it would.” Then the angel left her.

 

[Dogknox20]

You also do realize that when the scrolls were written and passed on for centuries there was no punctuation or differentiation between lower and upper case?

NIV
“I am the Lord’s servant,” Mary answered. “May your word to me be fulfilled.” Then the angel left her.
NIVUK
‘I am the Lord’s servant,’ Mary answered. ‘May your word to me be fulfilled.’ Then the angel left her.
NKJV
Then Mary said, “Behold the maidservant of the Lord! Let it be to me according to your word.” And the angel departed from her.
NLV
Then Mary said, “I am willing to be used of the Lord. Let it happen to me as you have said.” Then the angel went away from her.
NLT
Mary responded, “I am the Lord’s servant. May everything you have said about me come true.” And then the angel left her.
NMB
And Mary said, Behold the handmaiden of the Lord! Be it unto me even as you have said. And the angel departed from her.
NRSV
Then Mary said, “Here am I, the servant of the Lord; let it be with me according to your word.” Then the angel departed from her.
NRSVA
Then Mary said, ‘Here am I, the servant of the Lord; let it be with me according to your word.’ Then the angel departed from her.
NRSVACE
Then Mary said, ‘Here am I, the servant of the Lord; let it be with me according to your word.’ Then the angel departed from her.
NRSVCE
Then Mary said, “Here am I, the servant of the Lord; let it be with me according to your word.” Then the angel departed from her.
NTE
‘Here I am,’ said Mary; ‘I’m the Lord’s servant-girl. Let it happen to me as you’ve said.’ Then the angel left her.
OJB
And Miryam said, Hinei! I am the shifcha of Hashem. May it be done to me according to your dvar. And the malach departed from her.
TPT
Then Mary responded, saying, “Yes! I will be a mother for the Lord! As his servant, I accept whatever he has for me. May everything you have told me come to pass.” And the angel left her.
RGT
Then Mary said, “Behold the servant of the Lord. May it be to me according to your word.” So, the angel departed from her.
RSV
And Mary said, “Behold, I am the handmaid of the Lord; let it be to me according to your word.” And the angel departed from her.
RSVCE
And Mary said, “Behold, I am the handmaid of the Lord; let it be to me according to your word.” And the angel departed from her.
TLV
So Miriam said, “Behold, the servant of Adonai. Let it be done to me according to your word.” And the angel left her.
VOICE
Mary (deciding in her heart): Here I am, the Lord’s humble servant. As you have said, let it be done to me. And the heavenly messenger was gone.
WEB
Mary said, “Behold, the servant of the Lord; let it be done to me according to your word.” Then the angel departed from her.
WE
Mary said, `I am the Lord's servant. Let it be as you have said.' Then the angel left her.
WYC
And Mary said, Lo! the handmaid of the Lord; be it done to me after thy word. And the angel departed from her.
YLT
And Mary said, `Lo, the maid-servant of the Lord; let it be to me according to thy saying,' and the messenger went away from her

 

[Dogknox20]

Before we get into that, may I ask if you believe angels that were seen were humans? Or did they look like, and act like humans?

The witch brought Samuel back from the dead! Saul was searching for advice!
1 Samuel 28:14 “What does he look like?” he asked.
“An old man wearing a robe is coming up,” she said.
Then Saul knew it was Samuel, and he bowed down and prostrated himself with his face to the ground.

15 Samuel said to Saul, “Why have you disturbed me by bringing me up?”
“I am in great distress,” Saul said. “The Philistines are fighting against me, and God has departed from me. He no longer answers me, either by prophets or by dreams. So I have called on you to tell me what to do.”

Hebrews 1:5
For to which of the angels did God ever say,
“You are my Son;
today I have become your Father”?
Or again,
“I will be his Father,
and he will be my Son”?

"YoursTrue The answer to the question is, of course, “none.”

LOGIC ALONE.. If God never called an angel his Son, then Michael—who is an angel—cannot be the Son.

The fact that Michael is an archangel does not change anything, as he is still an angel by nature. An archangel is simply a “higher order” of angel, but an angel nonetheless; “arch-” simply means “ruling” or “high ranking.”

 

[Brian2]

.
I reply.. God can not be perfect by loving himself! To have PERFECT Love; you MUST give of yourself to another! THUS...

Brian2 thus there is "The Word" the second person to the trinity!
In the beginning there was "The Word" the word was God!

Sounds right

 

[Brian2]

Before we get into that, may I ask if you believe angels that were seen were humans? Or did they look like, and act like humans?

They have the nature of a servant of God just as humans have but were not humans because they are not descendants of Adam.
This however does not mean that Jesus foofed a body up to appear to His disciples in. An idea like that denies the scriptures that tell us that Jesus rose bodily.
John 2:19 Jesus answered them, “Destroy this temple, and I will raise it again in three days.”
20 They replied, “It has taken forty-six years to build this temple, and you are going to raise it in three days?” 21 But the temple he had spoken of was his body. 22 After he was raised from the dead, his disciples recalled what he had said. Then they believed the scripture and the words that Jesus had spoken.
Matt 28:5 The angel said to the women, “Do not be afraid, for I know that you are looking for Jesus, who was crucified. 6 He is not here; he has risen, just as he said. Come and see the place where he lay.