Only the ones you can express as an integer divided by another integer.
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What is 'Real'?
- Thread starter Rival
- Start date
Those are the rational numbers. Real numbers include irrational numbers that are not complex.
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
An inescapable experience.
A delusion may be inescapable. That doesn't make it real.
Yikes! I see it *exactly* the opposite way. Desire is a huge *barrier* to understanding: we tend to fall into confirmation bias and ignore contrary evidence. Whenever I really *want* something to be true, I try extra hard to be skeptical of it for exactly this reason.
As I see it, desire is the path to self-delusion, not to 'ultimate reality'.
RestlessSoul
Well-Known Member
Because I couldn’t possibly answer the OP in a few words (or at all, really), allow me to recommend this book. It really is a cracking read, and accessible to the lay reader ( though I appreciate you probably don’t have much time for reading outside your coursework) ...
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
I never claimed it was. It's a molecule composed of hydrogen and oxygen, neither of which is immutable either.
So, how does immutability enter this picture?I never claimed it was. It's a molecule composed of hydrogen and oxygen, neither of which is immutable either.
There is nothing in pragmatic reality that's immutable.
Which is why it is said that we live in the domain of Maya?
Yes.
Fair enough. Reminds me of some Buddhist teachings.
But I must say that it is not very helpful in finding out what should be treated as real for everyday purposes.
I completely understand that perspective, but it has been quite helpful for me to understand the nature of being.
wellwisher
Well-Known Member
Real is what exists apart from time. Science for example, never reaches steady state, since technology and theory constantly advances, and new data and perspective appears that can alter how we see what is real. Only time will tell what is the final reality. But for today we accept what is real by what we can perceive.
In the short term, what appears to be real, may not be real in another point in time; past or future. Real is like a time line that is the same today as the future, but it may not appear so, in any point of time.
A good example is glass, which appears to be solid. But if you allow it to age, over time, it will flow downward, due to gravity, since it was never a solid, but a very dense fluid. From the future, we can see the fluid nature of glass, and one may not understand how they ever thought it was solid. However, solid appeared to true at that point in time, since it past the tests. It took a timeline to the future to manifest.
I couldn't disagree more.
My definition for real is that which exists some place at some time and which is able to interact with other things also existing somewhere at some time. This applies not just to objects, processes, and relationships, but also includes ideas whether these ideas have an associated real referent or are just creations of the imagination.
Reality is the collection of such real objects, processes, and relationships
The ideas of wolves and werewolves are both real, because they exist in heads wherever those heads are and can interact with outer world through the brain and body as well as being modified by other real things. In the case of wolves, the real idea corresponds to a real referent that might cause the idea of the wolf to change as one experiences a wolf, whereas in the case of werewolves, there is no external referent to experience or interact with, but the idea can lead to changes in reality - maybe another werewolf movie - and reality can lead to a modification of the idea of a werewolf - maybe following seeing the movie.
To be real is to exist, and to exist means to exist in time somewhere and be able to interact with other things that exist. Existence is a quality real things possess.
By that reckoning, anything said to exist outside of time also exists nowhere and also cannot interact with reality and does not deserve to be called real. That includes all fictitious characters and locations, but not the ideas about them. The latter are real even if their referents aren't.
setarcos
The hopeful or the hopeless?
What is real? Seems your asking for descriptions of what the term can be applied to.
I think it would be more prudent to define your term first then see what it can be applied to.
I have real feelings.
There are real numbers on the number line.
I really feel depressed but nobody really cares.
I have a real good idea.
Bigfoot is real.
My experience is real. My delusions are real to me.
Atoms are real. Energy is real. Distances are real. Time is real.
My self awareness is real.
Nothing is real.
How do we define the term real so that all these sentences can be true? What do all these things have in common that makes them real?
I think it would be more prudent to define your term first then see what it can be applied to.
I have real feelings.
There are real numbers on the number line.
I really feel depressed but nobody really cares.
I have a real good idea.
Bigfoot is real.
My experience is real. My delusions are real to me.
Atoms are real. Energy is real. Distances are real. Time is real.
My self awareness is real.
Nothing is real.
How do we define the term real so that all these sentences can be true? What do all these things have in common that makes them real?
setarcos
The hopeful or the hopeless?
In consideration that time is a struggle to pin down within science and without, what do you mean by "in" time? As apposed to what? And how are you defining that "what"?
What do you mean by outside of time? Is that your phrase for non-existence? If so then wouldn't you agree that some things which don't currently exist in time but will eventually have been born out of nothing?
Are you saying ideas are not real? That they don't exist in time? Can a fictitious character really exist apart from the idea that birthed it? Are either of these things not capable of effecting reality?
In which case, the term 'real' seems to be meaningless.
Often, 'real' is used as a counter to 'imaginary'. So 'real' things are those that don't exist purely in our imaginations. They aren't just 'in our heads'.
The difficulty comes when we realize that our ideas have physical (and real) correlates. So, it may very well be possible to say 'that person is thinking of a unicorn' by looking at a very detailed brain scan over time.
In a similar way, a virtual reality program has 'real' physical correlates in the electronics even though the 'world' it relates is not real at all.