What do you do with magick?

[blackout]

In my case it actually works just as well to substitute the Word "as if" for magic.

I "as if" (or 'assume the existential'stance' of) connections, or... leading relationships.
(intellectual, imaginative) Mind/Spirit(emotional mind) <<>>Physical/Body
or ............................The Heavens............and...........The earth.
As above, below. As below, above.
Esoteric/Exoteric, or inside>out, outside>in.
Inner reality>><<Outer reality.

 

[blackout]

In my case it actually works just as well to substitute the Word "as if" for magic.

I "as if" (or 'assume The existential'Stance' of) connections, or... leading relationships.
(intellectual, imaginative) Mind/Spirit(emotional mind) <<>>Physical/Body
or ............................The Heavens............and...........The earth.
As above, below. As below, above.
Esoteric/Exoteric, or inside>out, outside>in.
Inner reality>><<Outer reality.

It is this living... breathing... relationship between the inner and outer world,
the Self and the Surroundings of the Self,
or the Image'in'ation and the Physical,
that gives rise to 'magical' (or 'as if'') initiation and change.
inner to outer AND outer to inner.
Breathe in, breathe out. Breathe out, breathe in.

Sometimes we want to change something on the outside,
but it's not working.
No matter how we try, we just can't budge it.
It may be though that a leading change on the inside
is what is necessary (first)
to bring about the desired, mirrored change on the outside.

It can work the very same way in reverse.

We reflect on things.
Inner things, outer things.
We explore their many facets.
Look at them from many angles.
We imagine, or IMAGE... See things in them
as we are in'spired.
We focus to See in them our Own reflection.
We begin to See new things in our Own Self.
We reflect these NEW I'm'ages and Ideas back out.
We "Word" things, and re-Word them.
We Present, and Re'Present them.
We enter into our own My'thologies.
We Speak, Spell, Craft, Cast, Symbolize, I'conize
our IDEAS to BEing.
We put on "cloaks" and "veils",
we wear 'masks', for different occasions
in order to become "something",
or take on a new role.
We act out/act on our Will (inner desire).
We Become, Reflect, Initiate our I'deas,
Step up, and out 'in faith' ('as if')
with I'Mage'in'ative force of focus
and In'tell'I'gent creativity
and our surroundings change as we do.

Then we observe the surrounding changes,
reflect on them,
and do it all again.

Breathe.

It's like harmony leading melody,
or melody leading harmony.
The natural tendency is just there.
They move and change in tandem.

 

[flame93]

I'd prefer being psychotic then an athiest Thelemite. Or maybe just different kinds of magicians do different kinds of magic, much as they interpret Crowley.

Why? I'm atheistic Thelemite and things make lot of sense to me. If you discard all dungeons and dragons surrounding Crowley and Thelema you can find very nice modern philosophy of life.

 

[Orias]

I wonder why Crowley is the center piece for the definition of magic.

Well I know why, but I still question!

 

[Iti oj]

i use magic to improve myself to help others and to make society better

 

[Mindmaster]

I wonder why Crowley is the center piece for the definition of magic.

Well I know why, but I still question!

Mostly because none before him needed to define it -- people simply believed in it prior to his time.

Crowley's work wasn't popular at all at the time he wrote it and mostly became that way only due to modern authors cross-referencing it in their bibliography. That being said Crowley was also a massive plagiarist most of his material was copied nearly verbatim from older books and republished. Sure, he understood enough to edit it but he actually came up with very little original work -- probably less than 25% of his work is actually his. No occultist never will make it so far with doing so little work ever again -- merely printing previous works will not get you into the new age magicians club anymore. All of this 'Crowley rules' mentality is completely recent 1960's+ a lot of his texts were nearly lost, but resurrected by students selling books and orders whom needed him to make them bank and legitimize their modern writings.

Strangely, though I do consider myself a Satanist I find that I use magic more for the most unselfish of reasons. Devotion to myself, Satan, others within my personal pantheon or understanding. Generally, nothing as trifling as mundane concerns which I can get with my own two legs and effort. I may ask for assistance after having problems, but I do not ask the forces that be for silly things out of respect. I've had a few occasions to use it in a combative sense -- one where my son was seeing a young Wiccan girl and her mom started cursing our family when he broke it off with her because she was slutting it up with several boys besides him. She felt she was justified because we were 'evil' (they were aware we were Satanic... basically); I seen it coming anyway and redirected the entire force of her work right back to her and put a little topspin on it. Her and her family were forced to move to I-Da-Ho.. funny coincidence isn't it?

There is a time for everything under the Sun. If you respect the forces you work with they will be there when the need arises, but I don't bother them with whining about silly daily things. Most people are focused on simple mundane tasks, and I wouldn't see much use to the magic processes for them. I am looking for a greater understanding of the universe and creation and I am not seeking to 'pimp my life' as in the scheme of things it is largely irrelevant.

 

[Sylvan]

There is a time for everything under the Sun. If you respect the forces you work with they will be there when the need arises, but I don't bother them with whining about silly daily things. Most people are focused on simple mundane tasks, and I wouldn't see much use to the magic processes for them. I am looking for a greater understanding of the universe and creation and I am not seeking to 'pimp my life' as in the scheme of things it is largely irrelevant.

This is the correct attitude. When its time for you to get put in a situation and deal with it by means of sorcery, then you have the means at your disposal. And developing those means is the fun part really. If you want to 'pimp your life' focus on doing one thing at a time or you may get overwhelmed.

 

[Adramelek]

I primarily use Magic(k) for Gnosis, for Self-knowledge and Self-Transformation, to affect and to understanding all things within and without. I really see no need to conjure neither curse nor kindness from my god Set, for by the Magic of His own Essence within me, that is the Black Flame, He will see through my eyes, and the strength that is His will be mine, and against the Will of Set no creature or force of the Universe may stand.

Xeper.
/Adramelek\

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

i use magic to improve myself to help others and to make society better

But what's the method? What's the mechanism?

I know people who do the things you describe by what I would consider "non-magical" means, like studying hard in school, volunteering with charities, and being nicr to people. What do you do to accpmplish those goals that people who don't use magic don't do?

 

[Caladan]

Did anyone bring the notion of Magic as a psychological vehicle and that Magicians don't really expect to levitate or strike people with thunder bolts but instead aim for personal transformation?
Several prominent writers on magic have said that magic in the west is what yoga is to the east; a method and techniques intended for personal growth. Breathing techniques, visualization, meditation, esoteric knowledge, mantras and other methods all aiming at inner alchemy rather than actually changing lead into gold.
I think my best advice Penguin if you want to understand historical magic is to read about it's historical uses, magic was an essential part of ancient cultures and had several later revivals. Read how the ancient Egyptians used magic, or how it was used in Classical times. At large in several periods and cultures magic was used in line with cultural norms and even part of religion.

 

[Orias]

And on another note, magic can simply, yet vaguely, be defined as influence.

The metaphorical turning lead into gold can be taken anyway, like for self growth or sentiment in value towards an object or a developing of its attachment towards existence.

Adramalek summed it up pretty well I might also add.

Everyone uses magic, even if they don't know it or accept it.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

So does that mean the difference is only terminology? Is it that you don't think you have any more abilities than think I have, but you call what you do "magic" and I don't?

 

[Orias]

So does that mean the difference is only terminology?

I'd say the entire perception is.

It is harder to understand magic with more...conventional methods.

Is it that you don't think you have any more abilities than think I have, but you call what you do "magic" and I don't?

Not at all, we all possess the same potentials.

 

[jasonwill2]

I see a lot of left hand path people here... are we allowed to post in here? if so, I think I can very directly answer Penguin's question as he wants to know the limits of magic in terms of objective effects that are external events by nature.

 

[Sylvan]

Anyone who believes in magic is allowed to post in here. Say your piece.

 

[Me Myself]

I would love to read the more ritualistic side of things.

It's not that I wish to devalue at all your statements of anything that is carrying out a will is magic, but I do am curious and if you'd like to share, I do would like to now which kind of rituals or chants, spells or any others do you do that people who don't regularly believe n magick or are aware they use it don't.

Blah my words came out convulted, but do you know what I mean? I would also be curious about frecuency if you cared to share. Example: "I do a compassion spell for all my family every sunday, takes about 5 minutes, do it with candles, I feel nice after doing it" or "I do prosperity spells when I am low on cash, burn a buck chant som words and it always works"

IDK, something like that .

 

[Adramelek]

Blah my words came out convulted, but do you know what I mean? I would also be curious about frecuency if you cared to share. Example: "I do a compassion spell for all my family every sunday, takes about 5 minutes, do it with candles, I feel nice after doing it" or "I do prosperity spells when I am low on cash, burn a buck chant som words and it always works"

IDK, something like that .

I would say MM that you may have a Magician within you calling out to me unleashed.

Xeper.
/Adramelek\

 

[Sylvan]

I would love to read the more ritualistic side of things.Example: "I do a compassion spell for all my family every sunday, takes about 5 minutes, do it with candles, I feel nice after doing it" or "I do prosperity spells when I am low on cash, burn a buck chant som words and it always works"

I often do candle burning with plain colored seven-day candles, or shorter homemade beeswax ones. For instance for money I make a green candle and put a lodestone in it, which I will have consecrated with oil and certain words. I might do a more complex procedure to it if I felt the need. Sigils could be drawn and empowered to put under it, for example, or it could be surrounded by fresh herbs appropriate to the purpose or pinches added of special fine-ground powders of dried herbs, colored flowers, dusts, etc... that I will have made batches of in particular times or seasons. This candle will then be lit at a planetary hour appropriate to the purpose.. for money it would be Jupiter. Or if I needed something to move Mercury, or if I needed to attract something Venus, and this will all be affected by what day of the week it is. Then I pitch it out at some appropriate time later, or leave it to burn all the way down. Working a job where returns can vary greatly according to mostly uncontrollable circumstances (not for much longer), I have had a lot of opportunities to test things out.

Now this doesn't cover what I'm really in the game for. The knowledge of self and spirit contact. To that end I may be found sneaking into graveyards or out to wilderness after midnight and finding particularly powerful trees. Before such trees I will do some procedures and consult spirits with which I have a relationship. And usually smoke some cigars*.

*Which I find disgusting, btw, but its not so bad at the time.

 

[jasonwill2]

ok then, I can answer Penguin's question =D

Basically the up-most limits of magic doesn't exist in theory, but speaking from a practical viewpoint, magic can:

Kill people in subtle ways
Make people be filled with lust
or generally help or hinder people
Since the mind is much easier to affect than physical things, most magic is centered around people and events, which is done through either mundane or supernatural manipulation of the other person's mind.

So the most drastic thing that magic could probably do is something like make someone very prone to physical death, though no one really agrees on the mechanisms of this, I suspect is more has to do with sending a signal from your mind to theirs through various or unknown means. This "signal" is more like a suggestion to their subconcious mind, and when the time is right perhaps their subconcious mind will fulful this suggestion and cause the individual to act in a way that is fitting. In a death case, it may be that the suggestion is to die, and so the mind unwittingly either has the body attack itself, or make the person do something dangerous without conciously meaning to.

This suggestion could either be transmitted via body language without the magican's knowing after casting the ritual, or by a more physic kind of means. I don't know though. most of my magic I use on myself, it seems that distance is a major factor from my personal experience in terms of magic, as the farther away something is the harder it is to use magic on it.

 

[Gentoo]

I use magick to do whatever I need to do.. I did some magick in order to keep a long-term position at work (that it wouldn't be given to someone else once the week was up), and it worked; I stayed in that position until the rightful employee came back. I've been doing some more, but more subtle, for this long-term position, and I was just asked to stay on until the end of the school year..