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Thoughts and actions are results of...
- Thread starter ninerbuff
- Start date
I fully agree. However, we do learn from circunstances, so there is a degree of feedback.
...that's not really what a soul is.
I've never seen a fully satisfying definition of what the soul is, but the best that I can come up with is that it's pure Consciousness, though it's latent in between lives (and even that's not fully satisfying as it doesn't really make much sense.)
Personally, I do (somewhat) believe in a soul, but I don't know what it is or what its properties are or how it relates to the body. The closest that I can say about it is that it's whatever part of us that's eternal. Even then, the Buddhist idea of the Five Aggregates makes more sense.
I agree.
I see some argue that the observations regarding drugs, hormones, injury, disease, and things like that affecting consciousness, thought, personality, and memory are misleading. They've suggested that this just represents damage to the equipment that allows a soul to work in physical form. So in other words it's like sending an audio signal to a broken speaker. One can point out that damaging the speaker in various ways distorts, disrupts, or completely eliminates the sound, but the audio signal is still there. It just can't get through.
I find such explanations unscientific and without justification, though.
Yeah. Trying to prove something is so by use of an analogy doesn't really work. You have to first establish that the thing you're trying to prove actually exists. ^_^
Well, in their defense, the people I've seen primarily utilize such an explanation do not do so to prove the existence of a soul, but instead to defend the possibility of its existence.
In other words, if I assert that the observation that brain damage can affect or eliminate a person's consciousness, thoughts, personality, and memories, and that therefore the soul doesn't exist or is meaningless, then they merely need to show that this does not logically eliminate the possibility. Proving something to be true is a separate issue from showing that something is not necessarily false.
And at that point it gets into non-falsifiability, which religion regularly utilizes.
Ah, I gotcha. "It's not proven false, so there's no reason not to believe it."
If my understanding of logic is correct, it's better to take the neutral stance of something being false, and then trying to determine that it's true, rather than the other way around. I try to do this as much as I can, which is why I have a pantheistic view of God and am rather uncaring when it comes to the soul. Nevertheless, I find that worship of Kali and Shiva helps me somehow, so I don't see any reason to stop.
Neither do I. There isn't anything wrong with worship or even belief, as long as a one remains capable of dealing with the possibility of being mistaken.
In my opinion strong, unshakable belief isn't particularly desirable or useful for religious practice. It may well be detrimental, even.
OneThatGotAway
Servant of Yahweh God Almighty
How do you know that the chemical reactions is not just a by-product of the thoughts in our head? In other words, what scientists are able to detect is the physical reaction of chemical and energy caused by the invisible reactions of thought; which is undetectable by our scientific instruments.
More specifically, without looking at the person's face or hearing the speak: How can scientist tell when a man is being sarcastic, sympathetic, deceitful, fearful, etc. (to name a myriad of thoughts and feelings)? If the source is just chemical reactions, then why do we not see similar behaviorial patterns in plants?
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ninerbuff
godless wonder
Let's say you accidentally put your hand on a hot stove. Reflex (which requires no thought) will cause you to pull it back and then adrenaline releases (fight or flight) well before an emotion like fear sets in.
Also people in depression take anti depressants to raise the chemical release in their brain so they feel "normal". Just trying to get them to think "happy thoughts" doesn't bring them out of depression.
Brainwave activity specific to a person. If measured certain emotions emit brainwave pattern matching it.
http://www.eurojournals.com/ejsr_44_4_14.pdf
Really? How do plants create emotion without a cognitive brain? You need a central nervous system for that.
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What does that prove? And what does that have to do with a "soul"?
ninerbuff
godless wonder
Depends on what your definition of a soul is I guess. Of course there will be many, but I understand it as the very being of what makes each person their own individual self. Of course that is until they get stoned, drunk, high, etc.
Because chemicals can affect thoughts. It's not just a one-way thing.
Well, yes and no.
Anti-depressants help with the chemical imbalances, but the "happy thoughts" are what helps keep that imbalance from happening again.
I was on an anti-depressant once, which did help somewhat, but once I started following my religion, I was able to fully get off of it. Since then, my depressed/not-depressed states have been in more normal fluctuation, and the depressed states are usually taken care by distraction.
openyourmind
Active Member
Hormones affect it, now come one that is part of the body and makes no sense. Drugs and alcohol of course the do the body is a delicate temple designed to work best at a perfect balance. Adding things to it interupts the energy signals of the brain from interacting the way the are trying to. The brain isn't changed and doesn't stop trying to do what is right. It is still in the same form but you screw up the balance and when you wake up if you had to much your body let's you know you screwed up. Yep, God still created perfection and man once again finds a way to ruin it.
ninerbuff
godless wonder
Then you aren't knowledgeble in Endocrinology. Estrogen and testosterone (hormones) greatly affect mood and behavior. You can go ahead a research it yourself so to save some embarrassment of being naive.
Penumbra laid out the normal response.
blackout
Violet.
Depends on what your definition of a soul is I guess. Of course there will be many, but I understand it as the very being of what makes each person their own individual self. Of course that is until they get stoned, drunk, high, etc.
But then they are still their own individual self, stoned, drunk, or high.
People do these things VERY differently.
Uniquely to their own self.
ninerbuff
godless wonder
But wouldn't you say that if their chemical balance is altered, you may see behaviors that aren't usually or EVER displayed by the individual? I've seen people who were so tame get drunk and become very violent, cuss like a street thug and sex crazed, where if they weren't intoxicated are total opposite. So which self is the real self and which one is just a facade?But then they are still their own individual self, stoned, drunk, or high.
People do these things VERY differently.
Uniquely to their own self.