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Featured The problem with the nine Satanic statements

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Epic Beard Man, Feb 20, 2019.

  1. Epic Beard Man

    Epic Beard Man Bearded Philosopher

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    During my days off from work I decided to indulge my intellect in purchasing the "Satanic Bible" for purposes of understanding the basic tenants of Satanism. I will just say that my prior knowledge of Satanism derived from my earlier teachings as a Baptist Christian. It's taught that Satanism is demonic, devil worshipping, cat sacrificing religion filled with people who use black lipstick bad hair cuts, black boots and women wearing fish net stockings chanting "Hail Satan!" Fast forward to now my understanding of Satanism is a lot more liberal and undefiled by fundamental Christian stereotypes. Through brief readings I can say I understand a little bit better what Satanism stands for, of course Laveyan Satanism, considering that I am aware there are other schisms in Satanism so to speak, however some Satanists will argue there is no such thing as a schism in Satanism.

    I concede that I'm still ignorant of the religion of Satanism and therefore subject to being wrong, however philosophically thus far my impression of Satanism is liken to anarchists who are against the commercialization of religion and its presupposed diabolical influences to constrain mankind's pleasures. It is those constraints that keep mankind from self-realization and fully enjoying the worldly pleasures which Satan as the archetype represents. What was peculiar to me while reading the prologue I took an interest to the nine Satanic statements:

    1. Satan represents indulgence, instead of abstinence!
    2. Satan represents vital existence, instead of spiritual pipe dreams!
    3. Satan represents undefiled wisdom, instead of hypocritical self-deceit!
    4. Satan represents kindness to those who deserve it, instead of love wasted on ingrates!
    5. Satan represents vengeance, instead of turning the other cheek!
    6. Satan represents responsibility to the responsible, instead of concern for psychic vampires!
    7. Satan represents man as just another animal, sometimes better, more often worse than those that walk on all-fours, who, because of his "divine spiritual and intellectual development," has become the most vicious animal of all!
    8. Satan represents all of the so-called sins, as they all lead to physical, mental, or emotional gratification!
    9. Satan has been the best friend the church has ever had, as he has kept it in business all these years!
    Interesting enough I believe the aforementioned would represent what I thought of earlier concerning the model of anti-religion through "religious anarchy." I believe these nine statements would be any person with grandiose thoughts of the self and self-indulgent, wet dream. The problem that I have is that there are no limitations to behavior, and that sensible indulgence is left unchecked on an animal (man) who left without lawful decree, can be dangerous. the problem that I'm seeing thus far is that this doctrine is creating a foundation of selfish hedonism which more often than not, can potentially lead into a destructive lifestyle.
     
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  2. Mindmaster

    Mindmaster Well-Known Member
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    Yes, and most Satanists would agree that there is a trap. But, we also admit that the limitations or societal norms are ghosts, as it were, and really don't protect anyone. :D

    The problem with absolute freedom is you have the freedom to be the hero or the villain of your life's story. Satanists just admit to that fact and act accordingly, assuming responsibility for it either way. There are certainly no qualms about hedonistic expression of Satanism in general, but there is also the philosophical and intellectual component that goes far beyond this. The TSB was generally written to get you started, but it doesn't delve very deeply into these other aspects.
     
  3. ADigitalArtist

    ADigitalArtist Well-Known Member
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    I do want to comment on the thread as a whole but, as an aside, only a small fraction of Satanic groups use the Satanic Bible. It's more an equivalent to the Book of Mormon than the Christian bible proper.
     
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  4. Saint Frankenstein

    Saint Frankenstein ᛘᛁᛏᚾᛁᚴᚼᛏ᛫ᛋᚢᚾ
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    LaVeyan Satanism is just Ayn Rand's philosophy dressed in spooky shock aesthetics to **** off Christians. It's not very deep. I rather despise LaVey because he is the reason Satanism has a problem with neo-Fascists and neo-Nazis being drawn to it, among other reasons. (Ironically, he was a Jew.) His plagerized ideas are very appealing to narcissists and psychopaths.
     
    #4 Saint Frankenstein, Feb 20, 2019
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  5. robocop (actually)

    robocop (actually) Well-Known Member
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    Some of those statements represent some order and control... like 4 and 6.
     
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  6. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
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    Seems nothing to stop a person from being as destructive as they choose other than dealing with the consequences of their actions.

    As I see it the consequences can be severe enough without bringing a wrathful deity into he picture.

    The fear I guess is that the Satanist doesn't consider the consequences of their action. It's all about self-gratification. However some actions, criminal actions limit your freedom. I think normal folks realize that actions which are likely to limit their freedom is not what anyone is looking for.

    So criminal actions, by the nature of their consequences, is contrary to these tenants.
     
  7. LuisDantas

    LuisDantas Aura of atheification
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    I don't particularly understand Satanism, but those principles seem to me to be a call towards acceptance of personal responsibility.

    There is a constructive place for that.
     
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  8. A Vestigial Mote

    A Vestigial Mote Well-Known Member

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    Have never seen this list before, and I'm glad some others are commenting that this is sort of a kitschy, unofficial "bible". Because, just being honest, it reads like an angsty teenager wrote it. Do people who are trying to be taken seriously actually use the term "psychic vampire?" Also referencing other's views as "spiritual pipe-dreams" seems off. Why mention others views at all? Why not make your own points that stand on their own merit, rather than just imply that others' are "pipe dreams" without providing any substance on the point in this small, list-like format? The last point (#9) is also somewhat like this. Just a sarcastic jab at "the church". Did they not have a supporting constructive point about the belief system itself that could have rounded out the list?
     
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  9. Epic Beard Man

    Epic Beard Man Bearded Philosopher

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    So Satanists do believe in some constraint?

    In that case that draws more of a problem with me. What about individuals like Elliot Rodger who may find gratification at being misogynistic towards women and who in the same instance finds rape to be acceptable? Considering in the literature thus far Satanists believe in consent and the limitation of harm, the two would seemingly be incompatible with absolute freedom. it would appear according to you people can do what they do as long as they take responsibility for it.

    Interesting. So I'm merely scratching the surface.
     
  10. Epic Beard Man

    Epic Beard Man Bearded Philosopher

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    Okay let me ask you. In regards to (4) does an alcoholic still deserve the same kind of compassion as someone who has never taken a drink in their life? Most reasonable people would say yes. (4) is problematic because it leaves it up to the individual to make a generalization about who is considered ingrate and although altruism is indeed at times (I'm even willing to say most times) conditional, it still leaves us open to subjective and selfish thought processes that could indeed crate harm to those who do in fact need help.

    With regards to (6) religionists would hold a similar concept of responsibility, the difference is that transgression of spiritual law is seen as sin, and religious customs in relation demands one acknowledge it and make amends to the Creator (or whatever deities one believes in) for it. As @Mindmaster has indicated, absolute freedom has its issues and responsibility is no different.
     
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  11. Epic Beard Man

    Epic Beard Man Bearded Philosopher

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    Well I believe that was the point and intent of this faith was to grab attention using catch phrases. I don't think the intent was to use philosophical jargon or some form of spiritual attractiveness to the faith. I think ultimately at least from what I see in the prologue alone it was to attract a certain mindset.
     
  12. robocop (actually)

    robocop (actually) Well-Known Member
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    Yep, like the yin yang there are no wrong or right attributes. We're put here on earth to get the right combination.
     
  13. Epic Beard Man

    Epic Beard Man Bearded Philosopher

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    Then what foundation do most Satanists go off of if not the book?
     
  14. Epic Beard Man

    Epic Beard Man Bearded Philosopher

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    @robocop (actually) What is the right combination then (places agnostic cap on)?
     
  15. ADigitalArtist

    ADigitalArtist Well-Known Member
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    Depends on the group. Some of them don't even have an official text (like most pagans, really.)
     
  16. ADigitalArtist

    ADigitalArtist Well-Known Member
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  17. Epic Beard Man

    Epic Beard Man Bearded Philosopher

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    Right and in some writings I was looking over there are Satanists that deny schisms in their system of beliefs so I think even there resides some fractured opinions.
     
  18. ADigitalArtist

    ADigitalArtist Well-Known Member
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    I personally think people who don't believe that there is schism in Satanism have much grounds for that considering there exists Satanists across so differences that they don't even all fit into 'theist' or 'non-theist.'
    Did they just mean schisms within LaVayans?
     
  19. robocop (actually)

    robocop (actually) Well-Known Member
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    Well, greed might be negative but then it could lead to saving your children or being ambitious in business to help the world for instance. We don't know the right combination. That's one thing we're here on Earth for.
     
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  20. Epic Beard Man

    Epic Beard Man Bearded Philosopher

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    I mean Satanism period.
     
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