The Lust for power?

[Laika]

The phrase "lust for power" struck me as a bit odd, especially when I realised that "lust" should be taken literally. So, a couple of questions thinking about it:

Why is the desire for power a "lust"?

What is it about power (and violence) that is actually sexual or sexually arousing?

And do you think that the pursuit of power is morally right if you say that pleasure is the measure of "good"?

Is the lust for power something to be ashamed of?

 

[YmirGF]

I'd argue that the use of lust in this instance is not meant literally, but rather, figuratively, as the drive for power is often an indefatigable force that is rarely thwarted. Sexual lust, when unbridled, could be similar as an all consuming fixation. Where are you getting the info that it is meant literally?

 

[sun rise]

Lust can broadly be defined as "desire". So lust for power is a strong desire for power. "lust for life" is thus a strong desire to live a fully satisfying life.

 

[Laika]

I'd argue that the use of lust in this instance is not meant literally, but rather, figuratively, as the drive for power is often an indefatigable force that is rarely thwarted. Sexual lust, when unbridled, could be similar as an all consuming fixation. Where are you getting the info that it is meant literally?

Personal Experience, particularly in the context of exploring BDSM. Its a rather new, dark and unexpected set of emotions, so wondering how best to take responsibility for it. Its confusing as its probably natural but also widely viewed as immoral or taboo.

It helps explain the "power corrupts" quote though: if I'd thought to connect power and sex I can well imagine how people can get that "high" off it to disregard their professed moral principles. Sex doesn't fit neatly in morality, so if power is sexual, its going to defy moral principles as well.

 

[Augustus]

Why is the desire for power a "lust"?

In animals, dominant males often have higher levels of testosterone. There have been studies that show females in positions of power also experience higher testosterone levels.

Humans are animals, so...

 

[Jumi]

Why is the desire for power a "lust"?

Check the etymology of the word, the common meaning of word lust in English has changed while the expression has stayed the same.

What is it about power (and violence) that is actually sexual or sexually arousing?

I don't know, never found it in myself.

And do you think that the pursuit of power is morally right if you say that pleasure is the measure of "good"?

Pleasure is not a measure of good, so I can't answer this.

Is the lust for power something to be ashamed of?

There's nothing to be ashamed of, if done with consideration for self and others.

 

[Brickjectivity]

Life is precarious, and there is such a thing as social standing. It comes with many pleasant gifts and fears, so it creates a pecking order. Its easy to start thinking of it as a tournament. All it takes is a desire from many to maintain their social standing, to retain 'What is mine'; and that equates to thirst for power. At some point there will be scarcity somewhere in the various levels of society, and someone will feel a threat.

 

[Laika]

Life is precarious, and there is such a thing as social standing. It comes with many pleasant gifts and fears, so it creates a pecking order. Its easy to start thinking of it as a tournament. All it takes is a desire from many to maintain their social standing, to retain 'What is mine'; and that equates to thirst for power. At some point there will be scarcity somewhere in the various levels of society, and someone will feel a threat.

So you're saying that the desire for power is linked to social standing, self-worth and how people are valued by others then?

 

[Brickjectivity]

So you're saying that the desire for power is linked to social standing, self-worth and how people are valued by others then?

I think that personality types and abnormal psychology are a part of it, but yes. Normal psychology creates social pressure to become powerful. We can manipulate despots however, and they can become philanthropic about their power. George Washington is an example of a powerful person who gives up his power, and lots of good things come from that. He doesn't ever give up his ill gotten wealth and dies surrounded by servants. His power is used against despotism which in his case destroys itself. The lust is simply not there for him, because he is satisfied, not concerned with his standing anymore.

 

[Stevicus]

Personal Experience, particularly in the context of exploring BDSM. Its a rather new, dark and unexpected set of emotions, so wondering how best to take responsibility for it. Its confusing as its probably natural but also widely viewed as immoral or taboo.

It helps explain the "power corrupts" quote though: if I'd thought to connect power and sex I can well imagine how people can get that "high" off it to disregard their professed moral principles. Sex doesn't fit neatly in morality, so if power is sexual, its going to defy moral principles as well.

Here's one view on the subject:

 

[metis]

For all practical purposes, we are hairless apes, more similar to chimps than any of the others, and chimps have this drift towards social dominance that's manifested through strength and sometimes hoarding.

Jane Goodall tried an experiment once by introducing an overload of bananas to one band of chimps, and the fight and hoarding was so bad that she had to stop the experiment early because of the fighting and hoarding that ensued that included the more dominant males stealing bananas even from children.

Hmmm, why does Donald Trump and the Republicans come to mind?

 

[David T]

The phrase "lust for power" struck me as a bit odd, especially when I realised that "lust" should be taken literally. So, a couple of questions thinking about it:

Why is the desire for power a "lust"?

What is it about power (and violence) that is actually sexual or sexually arousing?

And do you think that the pursuit of power is morally right if you say that pleasure is the measure of "good"?

Is the lust for power something to be ashamed of?

The music group Bush in the old song "everything zen" sings a verse " no sex in your violence". A very very sexless violence. Lust to power. Insanity.

A very very sexy beautiful type of violence. A salmon after living it's entire life cycle. Sane.

 

[socharlie]

The phrase "lust for power" struck me as a bit odd, especially when I realised that "lust" should be taken literally. So, a couple of questions thinking about it:

Why is the desire for power a "lust"?

What is it about power (and violence) that is actually sexual or sexually arousing?

And do you think that the pursuit of power is morally right if you say that pleasure is the measure of "good"?

Is the lust for power something to be ashamed of?

we really do not know that on small scale (e.g,. family, work place) but o grand scale it usually turns ugly...

 

[ajay0]

Desire perhaps is too euphemistic a word compared to lust, which has more negative connotations. Hence the probable reason the phrase ' lust for power' is used rather than desire or gluttony or passion for power.

 

[PureX]

The phrase "lust for power" struck me as a bit odd, especially when I realised that "lust" should be taken literally. So, a couple of questions thinking about it:

Why is the desire for power a "lust"?

What is it about power (and violence) that is actually sexual or sexually arousing?

And do you think that the pursuit of power is morally right if you say that pleasure is the measure of "good"?

Is the lust for power something to be ashamed of?

'Power' is about subjugation, and control. We humans survive and thrive by our ability to recognize the mechanisms of our environment, and manipulate them to our own advantage. Thus, we often seek to subjugate and control each others, as we are part of each other's environment, too. And the advantage we seek is not just that of opportunity, and security, and self-will, but it's also the advantage of sex. The spreading of ourselves through the environment through the physical conjoining with others. This is one of the fundamental advantages we seek, in life, too. And so sexual interaction becomes a natural expression of power. And of control. And of opportunity. And of self-will.

It's all 'hard-wired' into us through our genes. It's the "way of the human animal".

 

[Nakosis]

The phrase "lust for power" struck me as a bit odd, especially when I realised that "lust" should be taken literally. So, a couple of questions thinking about it:

Why is the desire for power a "lust"?

What is it about power (and violence) that is actually sexual or sexually arousing?

And do you think that the pursuit of power is morally right if you say that pleasure is the measure of "good"?

Is the lust for power something to be ashamed of?

I never had a lust for power myself, so I suspect the lust for power comes from a fear of being powerless. At some point in your life you felt completely powerless. Like you were sexually assaulted as a kid or you saw your mom sexually assaulted. You were beaten by your parents. You had no control over what happened to your body your mind. You were in a really bad situation, others had complete control over it and there was nothing you could do to change it.

So you don't want to identify with that helpless person. You want to be the person that was in control. Even if that control came from anger or rage. It is still better to be the person in power, however that power is obtained than the victim of that control.

That's why I suspect boys who've seen their mothers beaten are apt to beat their own wives. They are trying to compensate for the feeling of being powerless in that situation they experienced as a child. They don't even know why really. Just a need to identify with the person in power and not the powerless.

I think the pleasure comes from not being the victim of someone else's control.

We are all screwed by our desires originating from our subconscious mind. The normal I think is to give into these desires. If power over others gives you pleasure, it's very hard to deny yourself that pleasure.

I've my own problems, desires which are probably not all that mentally healthy. It's hard for me to judge someone else on this.

However I've always been very anti-authoritarian. I hated bullies to the point were I would covertly attack them, do what I could to make their life miserable if I saw someone bullying others, even as young as 10.

I suppose I got some pleasure out of the power to control the life of bullies. "It's morally ok to bully bullies".

I had to stop though because I had at one point totally wrecked someone's life to the point of a nervous breakdown. I had become the monster I thought I was fighting against.

I see power as bullying other folks. The desire to control someone else's life.

Now I just seek power over my own life. I resist any attempt to control my life and I don't seek power over the lives of others.

 

[Laika]

I never had a lust for power myself, so I suspect the lust for power comes from a fear of being powerless. At some point in your life you felt completely powerless. Like you were sexually assaulted as a kid or you saw your mom sexually assaulted. You were beaten by your parents. You had no control over what happened to your body your mind. You were in a really bad situation, others had complete control over it and there was nothing you could do to change it.

So you don't want to identify with that helpless person. You want to be the person that was in control. Even if that control came from anger or rage. It is still better to be the person in power, however that power is obtained than the victim of that control.

That's why I suspect boys who've seen their mothers beaten are apt to beat their own wives. They are trying to compensate for the feeling of being powerless in that situation they experienced as a child. They don't even know why really. Just a need to identify with the person in power and not the powerless.

I think the pleasure comes from not being the victim of someone else's control.

We are all screwed by our desires originating from our subconscious mind. The normal I think is to give into these desires. If power over others gives you pleasure, it's very hard to deny yourself that pleasure.

I've my own problems, desires which are probably not all that mentally healthy. It's hard for me to judge someone else on this.

However I've always been very anti-authoritarian. I hated bullies to the point were I would covertly attack them, do what I could to make their life miserable if I saw someone bullying others, even as young as 10.

I suppose I got some pleasure out of the power to control the life of bullies. "It's morally ok to bully bullies".

I had to stop though because I had at one point totally wrecked someone's life to the point of a nervous breakdown. I had become the monster I thought I was fighting against.

I see power as bullying other folks. The desire to control someone else's life.

Now I just seek power over my own life. I resist any attempt to control my life and I don't seek power over the lives of others.

I have my share of vulnerabilities to deal with and a lust for power is not an entirely irrational response. It's just a little dark and conflicts with my "nice guy" people pleasing persona that's all. There are people in much worse situations but there is only so much you can accept it out of your control before it really eats away at you. It's something to be aware of, respect and explore more than anything else. Being honest that its there is what matters.

 

[AlphaAlex115]

The phrase "lust for power" struck me as a bit odd, especially when I realised that "lust" should be taken literally. So, a couple of questions thinking about it:

Why is the desire for power a "lust"?

What is it about power (and violence) that is actually sexual or sexually arousing?

And do you think that the pursuit of power is morally right if you say that pleasure is the measure of "good"?

Is the lust for power something to be ashamed of?

what do all of those words mean and how do they differentiate from each other.

i swear language is useless. words refer to more words.

what is lust? what is power? plus enlighten me by referring to more language which refers to yet more language, and so it goes.