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Featured The Bible, Not As Original As You'd Think

Discussion in 'Scriptural Debates' started by Skwim, Feb 27, 2019.

  1. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

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    Possibly. The authors of Luke and Matthew both copied large parts of Mark. And the author of Luke states that he is not an eyewitness himself.
     
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  2. robocop (actually)

    robocop (actually) Well-Known Member
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    That would explain our problem with Luke dating Jesus to 6 A.D. He could have relied on oral accounts. One of the witnesses wanted to emphasize the idea that Jesus was born of humble circumstances so Luke was simply misled. I've given police reports where I remembered wrong... makes sense if you ask me.
     
  3. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

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    eyewitnesses are often wrong. Twice I have been in the back of a cop car, neither times was I arrested. The second time an officer gave me a ride home when I was the victim of a hit and run accident. I was walking to a local grocery store when at the last street a car after coming to a full stop decided to take a left turn into me as I crossed. They asked me the name and model and I have them a very accurate statement "It was white". For some reason they have caught him or her.
     
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  4. robocop (actually)

    robocop (actually) Well-Known Member
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    All right, so the Scooby Doo mystery has been solved. Have a nice night.
     
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  5. Prestor John

    Prestor John Well-Known Member

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    The Book of Genesis claimed to be a record of events that occurred many thousands of years before it was written.

    If I were to write a book today about events that happened in WWII, you would claim that it could not be accurate because it wasn't written during the actual war by actual participants of the war?

    Adam existed before the Egyptians. Our oldest written record of Adam did not exist until Moses wrote it in the Book of Genesis.

    Also, I never claimed that the Horus myth would coincide exactly with the story of the Lord Jesus Christ.

    I said that the original story known by Adam had become twisted and distorted over time.
     
  6. sooda

    sooda Well-Known Member

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    The Hebrews borrowed Adam and Eve from the Babylonian myth. They are considered didactic literature. And, the myths of Sumer were written on clay tablets long before the Hebrews.. The Northcoast Canaanites also had writing that predates the Hebrews by 2000 years.
     
    #146 sooda, Mar 3, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2019
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  7. Augustus

    Augustus the Unreasonable

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    Well only a brainwashed apologist could refuse to uncritically accept an argument supported by the apex of scholarly credibility: a picture off the internet.

    Unfortunately New Atheist groupthink tends to be as completely impervious to reason as fundamentalist religious belief is.

    Does X paint religion in a bad light?
    1. If yes then it is self-evidently true and can be uncritically accepted as fact.
    2. If no then it is obviously religious apologetics as everyone knows religion is the cause of all evil and nothing good has ever come of it. As such it can be rejected out of hand even if it is supported by multiple pieces of peer-reviewed academic research written by a respected secular scholars.
     
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  8. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

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    No, but I would claim it was inaccurate if it disagreed with all of the observable evidence. For example if someone claimed that the Nazis fought in dogfights from supersonic zeppelins I would point out how ridiculous that claim is and how it was not supported by any evidence not was it possible.
     
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  9. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

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    Sorry, one cannot support one myth by relying upon another.
     
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  10. Bob the Unbeliever

    Bob the Unbeliever Well-Known Member

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    I did. Claims made without reliable links.
     
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  11. Bob the Unbeliever

    Bob the Unbeliever Well-Known Member

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    What I want to hear? How would YOU know? Are you now, a Mind Reader?

    In fact, Oh Most Sarcastic Of All: I would love for there to be a Magical Super-Being, who watches out for the collective fate of Humanity-- never mind all the salacious pedophilia that is so rampant among God's Self-Proclaimed Spokes Weenies...

    nope. See above. Your hateful projection likely stems from deep within your own self-doubts that all the bs you've been brainwashed with, is in fact, just more bs.

    LMAO! I have no idea what any of that bs means. Word Salad, I guess-- want some vinaigrette with that to go?

    I don't know what an "Augustus" is. I have no clue what a "New Atheists" is, either. Perhaps, since you have Magical Telepathic Insight Into Everyone On the Earth, you could fill us in?
     
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  12. sooda

    sooda Well-Known Member

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    I don't care about Horus.. The story of Adam and Eve was taken from myth of Sumer and it was written down on clay tablets 1500 years before there were any Hebrews.

    Babylonian Origins of the Creation Myth of Adam and Eve

    Nov 21, 2012 · Babylonian Origins of the Creation Myth of Adam and Eve Babylonian Creation Myth. Babylonians had this legend of the Creation and Fall of Man, some 1,500 years or more before the Hebrews heard of it. The cuneiform inscriptions relating to the Babylonian legend of the Creation and Fall of Man, which have been discovered by English archæologists …

    Apocrypha The First Book of Adam and Eve: Babylonian Origins of the Creation Myth of Adam and Eve

    …. are not, however, complete. The portions which relate to the Tree and Serpent have not been found, but Babylonian gem engravings show that these incidents were evidently a part of the original legend. The Tree of Life in the Genesis account appears to correspond with the sacred grove of Anu, which was guarded by a sword turning to all the four points of the compass. representation of this Sacred Tree, with "attendant cherubim," copied from an Assyrian cylinder, may be seen in Mr. George Smith's "Chaldean Account of Genesis." Figure No. 1, which we have taken from the same work, shows the tree of knowledge, fruit, and the serpent. Mr. Smith says of it:
    "One striking and important specimen of early type in the British Museum collection, has two figures sitting one on each side of a tree, holding out their hands to the fruit, while at the back of one (the woman) is scratched a serpent. We know well that in these early sculptures none of these figures were chance devices, but all represented events, or supposed events, and figures in their legends; thus it is evident that a form of the story of the Fall, similar to that of Genesis, was known in early times in Babylonia."
     
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  13. Bob the Unbeliever

    Bob the Unbeliever Well-Known Member

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    It's not a virtue, you know. Much better to dump those ideas that demonstratively do not fit within actual reality.

    Gravity-- even without any understanding of the Theory Of Gravity, will assert it's effects upon a falling body, be it a True Believer or a Hardened Skeptic, with equal indifference.

    Reality won't bend to fit your desired WorldView.

    Science has proven itself, time and again, to ferret out Actual Reality-- often directly against the Desired Worldview of the researchers best hopes and dreams!

    Do you know that the discoverers of the Expanding Universe truly did not want to discover that information? They, each and everyone, believed in a Steady State Universe. That was their Bias.

    But. The scientific method forces people who use it, to set aside their biases, and to examine the facts, the evidence, the collected data-- and see which direction it leads.

    Even if they were rather that it didn't.

    That is why the Scientific Method Works.
     
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  14. MJ Bailey

    MJ Bailey Member

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    Umm where's Muhammad:)
     
  15. 1213

    1213 Well-Known Member

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    Please explain, why do you think it is impossible?

    I think it is possible with God. But if the teaching would not be from God but from humans, why would take invent it, if it is impossible to live by it?
     
  16. robocop (actually)

    robocop (actually) Well-Known Member
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    Yes and I am scientific and objective in that regard I promise. When I see the data telling me something, I listen.

    That's why I didn't believe in the New Testament when Subduction Zone told me about Luke's Nativity story but when we realized that he wasn't an eye witness and there were four gospels for the very reason that they would mess up I was allowed to continue to believe.
     
  17. Audie

    Audie Veteran Member

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    If one does magic, nothing is impossible.

    IF there was a magic flood, though, let us see
    what that means-

    "God" is a mass murderer, of a most ssdistic sort.
    I will leave you to think through 40 days of terrifird
    fathers and mothers trying to save their children.
    Never mind trillions of innocent animals.

    If there was no flood then the floodies are levelling
    some pretty serious calumny at the god they claim
    to respect and worship.

    Flood sign should be everywhere, in many forms but
    there is none. Why? We have hundreds of thousands
    years' ice in Antarctica. No way that survives going
    underwater (ice floats). But there it is.

    That is just a peek at the problems for it being a real
    story, but , if there was a magic flood, god cleaned up all
    All all the evidence, and falsified other evidence to
    make it look as if there was no flood.

    How does this seem to you?
    You dont know any of this?
     
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  18. Musing Bassist

    Musing Bassist Aesthetic Traditionalist

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    I do not need to be a mind reader to know when I am speaking with an ideologue. Your posts so encapsulate the internet atheist stereotype that I sometimes wonder if I should invoke Poe's law.

    No you wouldn't. Because the day your heart stops beating you will be forced to give an account for every single unrepentant sin you have committed since the age of reason. And those men who though their terrible acts have sacrilegiously dragged the priesthood though the reputational mud are in a terrifying position before God. Because without serious lifelong repentance those men (as per Catholic teaching) are facing the very real possibility of eternal damnation. Matthew 7:22-23

    Rocks in glass houses.

    I admit that I can be prone to verbosity when I'm not being careful about it, nevertheless what I posted wasn't particularly complicated. Augustus is the user to whom the previously quoted was addressed. And unlike you he seems to not have had much trouble in understanding what was posted.
     
    #158 Musing Bassist, Mar 3, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2019
  19. Augustus

    Augustus the Unreasonable

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    Fortunately, he has me on ignore so can't see that. It's great when this happens as you can correct their mistakes without having to engage with the witless inanity of any replies :D
     
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  20. Musing Bassist

    Musing Bassist Aesthetic Traditionalist

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    Oh... I see. With that context what he said now makes a modicum of sense.
     
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