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Featured The Best Argument Against the Non-Existence of God

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by stvdv, Jun 24, 2020.

?
  1. 0: I believe "The Truth" = "That what never changes"

  2. 1: I believe God exists (God defined as "That what never changes")

  3. 2: I believe God exists not

  4. 3: I know God exists (God defined as "That what never changes")

  5. 4: I know God exists not

  6. 5: I believe Bible God exists

  7. 6: I believe Bible God exists not

  8. 7: I know Bible God exists

  9. 8: I know Bible God exists not

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  1. stvdv

    stvdv Veteran Member

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    The Best Argument Against the Non-Existence of God

    Some Advaita definitions I once read:
    1: Truth = that what does not change
    2: God = that what does not change

    Advaita claims that only God exists (as in real), all else is subject to change (maya), hence it is not the Truth

    What are your thoughts/definitions on this (can be any (non)faith of course)
     
    #1 stvdv, Jun 24, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2020
  2. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
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    Sorry, I believe the truth is constantly changing. If we consider the Universe is the truth, is reality, the Universe is in constant motion.

    Instead of believing in some universal hidden truth, I'd rather accept the truth that is before me. A truth that is gone before we can even think about capturing it.

    God does not exist for me now. However, I don't know the truth of the future.
     
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  3. shivsomashekhar

    shivsomashekhar Active Member

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    stvdv,

    If God alone is true, what about you and me? Is a non-existent entity chatting with another non-existent entity?

    It is true that your pains are real, your passions are real. It is also true that you cannot feel my pains and I cannot feel yours. So, diversity is real and therefore, true.
     
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  4. Ponder This

    Ponder This Well-Known Member

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    Do lies change? If it was a lie today, is it still a lie tomorrow?
     
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  5. sun rise

    sun rise "This is the Hour of God"
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    God is both ever changing and never changing - beyond the play of opposites and within the play of opposites.
     
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  6. stvdv

    stvdv Veteran Member

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    :)I like that.

    Most of the time God does not exist for me, because I am not constantly aware of God. Sometimes God grants experiences
    Whenever the universe "whispers something in my heart" or "shows something in my 3rd eye", this I call God's Gifts

    Note:
    *) My Master explained that "Voice of Conscience (that all humans have, but many neglect) is the voice of God"
    *) The more I follow my Conscience, the more I experience this "God connection" (has been my experience)
     
  7. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    How did you connect truth and god?
     
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  8. George-ananda

    George-ananda Advaita Vedanta, Theosophy, Spiritualism
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    I'm Advaita.

    The Best Argument Against the Non-Existence of God
    are the teachings of the Vedic seers and rishis and other mystics who I objectively believed have plumbed the deepest into the ultimate nature of reality.

    And the best teachers of that tradition tell us to not even take their word for it but to experience it for ourselves and we will experience Truth. Of course that level of insight is not likely to come right away in my novice meditation efforts so I hold the existence of God to be the strongest theory out there,.
     
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  9. stvdv

    stvdv Veteran Member

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    The Advaita truth only becomes reality when we achieve Self-Realization. Till then we live in Duality and see this as Real/Truth

    Once I met a Yogi. He broke 13 bones in a car accident. The doctor needed to put a pin in his knee.
    Yogi did not want anesthesia because his pain level changed due to meditation
    So for him hammering a pin in his knee did not hurt.
    This taught me that pain experience is real, but it is also relative to our spiritual level of awareness
    Same with spiritual experience. Most live in Duality, very few in non-Duality (being Self-Realized)

    You need to be very spiritual connected to actually feel the pain of others. That takes empathy to a whole different level.
    My Master is there. I am not there yet.

    That is the Dualistic view. I prefer to focus on the non-Dualistic Teaching.

    A real Master can Grant you this Advaita experience; then you have at least experienced what your goal is
    Most people think they do not need a Guru/Master/Teacher. But I am glad my Guru accepted me as student
     
  10. stvdv

    stvdv Veteran Member

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    For 1 person something is a lie, but for another person it's not a lie. I do not know if there is a Universal lie.
     
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  11. stvdv

    stvdv Veteran Member

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    I also read "God is bigger than the biggest and smaller than the smallest"
    Talking about extreme examples of change:D
     
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  12. stvdv

    stvdv Veteran Member

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    I am not Self-Realized, so I leave such difficult questions to the experts;)
     
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  13. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    Hmm. No idea as an opinion?

    Don't know who qualifies as an expert when I'm sure experts are asking similar questions as students. (aka. They're not god, right?)
     
  14. stvdv

    stvdv Veteran Member

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    I agree with this.
    My Master said "A real Master can Grant you this experience"
    We are lucky to have these wonderful scriptures with insights from seers, rishis and other mystics who have experienced it
     
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  15. exchemist

    exchemist Veteran Member

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    Yes. A lie is a deliberate untruth. It is a matter of intent. The intent does not change after the fact.
     
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  16. stvdv

    stvdv Veteran Member

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    I still have quite a creative mind, so plenty of opinions. But the Masters advise us to "still the mind" as the way "to know"

    aka. They're not god, right?
    My Master addressed the gathering as:
    "Atma Swarupalara"(Embodiments of the Divine) or
    "Prema Swarupalara"(Embodiments of Divine Love)

    So, I guess they are "embodiments of God", right?
     
  17. 'mud

    'mud ~~ Life is Stuff ~~
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    Truth...that was occurring before creation ?
    And not to be changed ?
    Or what ?
     
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  18. stvdv

    stvdv Veteran Member

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    :)

    Suppose someone asks me "what is your weight?", and I answer 60 kg, while my weight is 50 kg, that is a blatant lie
    But then I eat a lot of food for a few weeks, and my weight goes up to 60 kg
    So, I got rid of my lie, right?

    :) Thank you, that is a useful distinction.

    Suppose someone asks me "how old are you?". I always forget my age, but luckily I remember the year I was born, so I can calculate my age. So, I answer "This body is 56 years old"
    1: if I miscalculated, then you do not considered this a lie
    2: If I deliberately answer 5 years younger, because of vanity, then you do considered this a lie
     
  19. stvdv

    stvdv Veteran Member

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    Yes, once we start thinking about this, we get interesting "stuff";)
     
  20. 'mud

    'mud ~~ Life is Stuff ~~
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    pretense and imagination, rolling down a hill
    and the pale of truth presided them wherewith
     
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