Telling someone they are doomed ( spiritually)

[TagliatelliMonster]

Spreading the word can be done without harming others by telling them they are wrong.

Sure. But that's not what your OP is about. Your OP is about how it's "playing god". But if all you do is simply repeat what is supposed to be god's own words, then how is that "playing god"?

Because in that case, certain people being doomed by default, is part of "the word", is it not?

When it comes to what example the bible say it is meant for those who follow the teaching. So if a person is not a Christian he is not following Gods words.

And by doing so, that person is excluded from entering christian heaven (if christianity is true and accurate)

For muslims the word of God is in the Quran so when a non muslim is not following the word in the Quran yes then they do not follow Allah's words.
But it is not a human beings right to judge others. Only God can do that.

And god does so in the quran.
So when you tell an unbeliever that he is doomed, you are just repeating what god said in the quran.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

I have accepted both Allah and Muhammad and Islam teaching speak to muslims not to others, so it is my duty as a muslim to be as good as i can.

It does say that if I as a muslim do evil I will go to hell too.
I have no need to judge others and think i am better then anybody else. All i want is to practice my belief.

Sure and I get that.

But your OP wasn't about that. In your OP you asked if it is playing god and in fact not a reason for yourself to be send to hell.
Clearly that wouldn't be the case, if all you are doing is simply repeating what god said himself.... Right?

 

[Spirit of Light]

Sure. But that's not what your OP is about. Your OP is about how it's "playing god". But if all you do is simply repeat what is supposed to be god's own words, then how is that "playing god"?

Because in that case, certain people being doomed by default, is part of "the word", is it not?



And by doing so, that person is excluded from entering christian heaven (if christianity is true and accurate)



And god does so in the quran.
So when you tell an unbeliever that he is doomed, you are just repeating what god said in the quran.

The OP is not about me, or what my view is.
The OP was created because of someone was speaking about how they saw that others of coourse was wrong in their belief because of they had a different religion.

My OP is about when someone telling other religions people that their belief is wrong, then they them self is doing wrong, because they put them self in Gods "shoes" and judge orhers based on their own understand of Gods thoughts.

I been there my self, so i know how wrong it is to do that.

 

[Spirit of Light]

Sure. But that's not what your OP is about. Your OP is about how it's "playing god". But if all you do is simply repeat what is supposed to be god's own words, then how is that "playing god"?

Because in that case, certain people being doomed by default, is part of "the word", is it not?



And by doing so, that person is excluded from entering christian heaven (if christianity is true and accurate)



And god does so in the quran.
So when you tell an unbeliever that he is doomed, you are just repeating what god said in the quran.

If you noticed, i do not get angry, frustrated or call atheists bad things anymore, i have no reason to do it, i found what i truly believe in, so if you or others want to disbelieve, go Ahead, it does not bother me one bit.

What others believe or disbelieve is non of my business

 

[Father Heathen]

If you tell someone " you have the wrong faith or belief, you are doomed"
Would that not be to put you self in Gods place and pretend you know that someone else is so bad as a human being that this person will be doomed to hell when time is up?

Can that statement in it self send the person who judge others, be what lead themselves to go to that very place of hell instead?

But isn't that exactly what the authors of "holy texts" did?

 

[Spirit of Light]

But isn't that exactly what the authors of "holy texts" did?

The way i belive it was done is that those who did become spiritual teachers like Jesus or Muhammad did infact get their wisdom from God, they got the right teachings to teach to those who wanted to listen and learn.
So in my understanding, the part you qouted me on, does not meant the spiritual teachers. Because they would never tell someone "you believe in the wrong teaching"
It means the followers later on, would not be able to remove their own ego, and they would mock others because their own lack of understanding of the teaching.

 

[MNoBody]

If you tell someone " you have the wrong faith or belief, you are doomed"
Would that not be to put you self in Gods place and pretend you know that someone else is so bad as a human being that this person will be doomed to hell when time is up?

Can that statement in it self send the person who judge others, be what lead themselves to go to that very place of hell instead?

yes, [to the first, and figuratively for the latter question]
as if a fallible mortal, any mortal, really knows what is in store....
all we humans have are really strong suspicions which then folks asssssume they know something about, AS IF.
The more they insist they know, the more dubious they seem.
Which then one has to accept such reports, just on the report of it, since these offer no demonstration,
indeed, the material does not seem to permit such operations.
edit-[notwithstanding all that, humans are pretty much doomed, to keep repeating their core programming over and over again....at least, this is what observing the flow of "history" strongly suggests.
but who knows? Them? Us? Him? Her? You?.
place yer bets, since one has to find out for themselves.]

 

[Brickjectivity]

If you tell someone " you have the wrong faith or belief, you are doomed"
Would that not be to put you self in Gods place and pretend you know that someone else is so bad as a human being that this person will be doomed to hell when time is up?

Can that statement in it self send the person who judge others, be what lead themselves to go to that very place of hell instead?

If I say 'Doomed' I may not mean it in a religious way, because the English language has shifted since the KJV Bible was published. I may intend to say that a group is doomed to fail or to disappear and not that it is to burn in hell. 'Doomed' is not a common modern term. It is archaic, and so people don't use it. In the KJV Bible this term 'Doomed' refers to Judas, who is doomed. Even in the case of Judas what it means is debated, because some (Like you Sunnis) believe in a fiery hell afterlife and that he is doomed to burn. Others believe he is doomed in a different sense. The main thing is that the modern usage of 'Doom' is undefined in vernacular. For example: if you say a political candidate is doomed then you're saying they won't get elected. You aren't saying they will go to hell.

Jesus treats the subject of the OP but doesn't use the term 'Doomed'. He uses the term 'Fool'. (Mat 5:22 KJV) "22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire." So Jesus is firstly against uncaused anger, secondly against angry words like 'Raca'. I suppose in modern parlance it would like saying "I hate you" or something like that. Thirdly he forbids saying "Thou fool," which is similar if not the same as your OP question "You are doomed!"

The way I interpret his statement is that if we are this dismissive of another person it means there is something wrong with us and have utterly failed.

 

[Nakosis]

If you tell someone " you have the wrong faith or belief, you are doomed"
Would that not be to put you self in Gods place and pretend you know that someone else is so bad as a human being that this person will be doomed to hell when time is up?

Can that statement in it self send the person who judge others, be what lead themselves to go to that very place of hell instead?

I wouldn't do this and if anyone did so to me. I'd consider the source.

I do find it a bit annoying when people assume to know the mind/thoughts of God.

 

[Nimos]

I like your reply

The thing i noticed in Islam teching is that I am not saved just by accepting Allah and Muhammad, it is a constant practice of becoming better as a human being, and if i was to judge 8thers before my self ( meaning, telling them how wrong they are) it is actually I that would be wrong. Not them.
Because if i cant live up to the rules in Islam my self, how can i tell others they are doomed, to me it would seal my own faith. So Nope, i am not going to tell others they have a wrong faith or religion , its just not how i understand thecteaching of Islam

Just wondering.
But have you thought about how you are going to handle hell? Meaning that some you might love could end up there, while you ain't?

 

[pearl]

But this was just one parish priest, many years ago, speculating.

And since we all live on this side of death, no one knows.

 

[Spirit of Light]

Just wondering.
But have you thought about how you are going to handle hell? Meaning that some you might love could end up there, while you ain't?

If Allah choses to send someone down to hell of the people i know in this life, that is between Allah and that person.
If the person do not believe in Allah, or has lived a very bad life while believing in Allah, it is still between them. Not me, i am only responsable for my own action, words and thoughts.

If i live really badly my self, and end up in hell, that will be my problem, because i was judged by my action, speech and thoughts.

 

[sun rise]

if you are talking Judaism, Christianity or Islam, it is made pretty clear in the scriptures what will happen to those of wrong faith.

Judaism and Islam have a positive interfaith view. Traditional Christian's don't.

Jewish views on religious pluralism - Wikipedia

An Islamic Perspective on Religious Pluralism | HuffPost

Who knows? I have had both hell and purgatory explained to me as being sort of self-inflicted, by a sinful person being confronted with their shortcomings and either gradually expressing contrition and resolving it, or being too far gone and filled with permanent self-hate. But this was just one parish priest, many years ago, speculating.

C. S. Lewis in the "Great Divorce" had much the same attitude.

But of course, this presupposes a certain view of what hell really is.

In the bible for example, there are quite a few passages that make it clear that if you don't believe in its message, you are by default doomed and locked out of heaven.

You can prove anything you want to prove in the Bible by selective quoting. I could site the two 'greatest' commandments as proof that God puts love above everything else and that anyone with love for God and love for humanity has nothing to fear.

 

[Nova2216]

If you tell someone " you have the wrong faith or belief, you are doomed"
Would that not be to put you self in Gods place and pretend you know that someone else is so bad as a human being that this person will be doomed to hell when time is up?

Can that statement in it self send the person who judge others, be what lead themselves to go to that very place of hell instead?

Joh 7:24 Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.

Lu 17:3 Take heed to yourselves: If thy brother trespass against thee, rebuke him; and if he repent, forgive him.

Ga 6:1 ¶ Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness; considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted. 2 Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ.

Eph 5:11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.

Mt 18:15 ¶ Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother. 16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established. 17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.


The answer to your question in light of these scriptures is - NO.


Php 2:5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:

 

[Spirit of Light]

Joh 7:24 Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.

Lu 17:3 Take heed to yourselves: If thy brother trespass against thee, rebuke him; and if he repent, forgive him.

Ga 6:1 ¶ Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness; considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted. 2 Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ.

Eph 5:11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.

Mt 18:15 ¶ Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother. 16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.


The answer to your question in light of these scriptures is - NO.


Php 2:5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:

So if i understand you correctly, a Christian person can tell others they are wrong, or do you mean only christians to christians?
Example 1: if you noticed a fellow Christian person do something wrong according to the bible, you can correct him, if you know a better answer.

Example 2: If you as a Christian person get in discussion with a person from a different religion, you can directly tell him/her that their religion is wrong?

Example 3: you should avoid commenting on other peoples way of practicing their religion.

 

[Nova2216]

So if i understand you correctly, a Christian person can tell others they are wrong, or do you mean only christians to christians?
Example 1: if you noticed a fellow Christian person do something wrong according to the bible, you can correct him, if you know a better answer.

Example 2: If you as a Christian person get in discussion with a person from a different religion, you can directly tell him/her that their religion is wrong?

Example 3: you should avoid commenting on other peoples way of practicing their religion.

2Ti 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine. 3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; 4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

I like your reply

The thing i noticed in Islam teching is that I am not saved just by accepting Allah and Muhammad, it is a constant practice of becoming better as a human being, and if i was to judge 8thers before my self ( meaning, telling them how wrong they are) it is actually I that would be wrong. Not them.
Because if i cant live up to the rules in Islam my self, how can i tell others they are doomed, to me it would seal my own faith. So Nope, i am not going to tell others they have a wrong faith or religion , its just not how i understand thecteaching of Islam

Can I ask, Piggy backing on @Nimos reply, how do you feel that those who do not follow Allah would be at a disadvantage in the afterlife?

Is there a universalist (all saved) view in islam in your opinion that all will be with Allah regardless their religion thereafter?

If only those who believe in Allah (follow him in practice) will benefit in the afterlife, how do you reconcile those you love who will never believe?

 

[metis]

If you tell someone " you have the wrong faith or belief, you are doomed"
Would that not be to put you self in Gods place and pretend you know that someone else is so bad as a human being that this person will be doomed to hell when time is up?

Absolutely it does, and it is both unethical and illogical imo.

To the latter, the scriptures in all religions are subjective, thus not objective, so it's always wise not to believe every word we may read or even believe in every single teaching one may find within. IOW, we need to use our own brain as well.

And scriptural inerrancy is really quite nonsensical as we often see what theologians call "variations" on the same narratives.

 

[Spirit of Light]

Can I ask, Piggy backing on @Nimos reply, how do you feel that those who do not follow Allah would be at a disadvantage in the afterlife?

Is there a universalist (all saved) view in islam in your opinion that all will be with Allah regardless their religion thereafter?

If only those who believe in Allah (follow him in practice) will benefit in the afterlife, how do you reconcile those you love who will never believe?

I can not speak for those who are not muslims, nor can i speak for other muslims.
If someone who are muslim do follow Allah's word as intended and practice every day, i believe they will go to paradise that was created for muslims.

If someone is an Atheist i do not know if Allah would do either bless them or punish them, but i would think that if an atheist live a very morally good life and does not harm anyone, they are not going to hell, but maybe i am wrong about that.

If a person follow a different religion then Islam i will think Allah would judge them out from how morally good they were in the religion they followed. Personally i do not think people from other religions go to hell.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

If you tell someone " you have the wrong faith or belief, you are doomed"
Would that not be to put you self in Gods place and pretend you know that someone else is so bad as a human being that this person will be doomed to hell when time is up?

Can that statement in it self send the person who judge others, be what lead themselves to go to that very place of hell instead?

I see what God has offered is available. Our response to what is given, is our own judgement.

I see we will get to judge ourselves, against what was given to us, when we awake in our new reality.

That is why we are advised to bring oursleves to account each day.

Regards Tony