So why doesn't god heal amputees?

[Jayhawker Soule]

If God did heal an amputee, no atheist would acknowledge that He had anything to do with it. For this reason, I'm baffled as to why an atheist would ask this question in the first place.

That seems unfair, Katzpur. Do you truly believe that we are all so dishonest? Do you believe that of me?

 

[Tiberius]

There is a documented case of a woman who had her leg amputated and it has since began to regrow slowly so there are X-rays to prove the short regrowth, which she expects to continue unil whe has a completely new lower leg and foot.

I will provide a link later because I'm still at work...

God works slowly sometimes so we can document the healing...

Still at work? I'm waiting for the link please.

 

[Katzpur]

That seems unfair, Katzpur. Do you truly believe that we are all so dishonest? Do you believe that of me?

Obviously, I shouldn't have generalized.

I started a thread sometime ago in which I described a similar hypothesis. It was on the atheism subforum and I didn't contribute more than two or three posts because it really wasn't my intention debate the topic. At any rate, I described an experiment involving two large control groups of seriously ill individuals. Every one of the people in one of the control groups was completely healed within a short period of time, presumably as a result of God having answered the prayers of many who pleaded with Him on their behalf. Every one of the people in the other group, for whom no prayers were said, died within the same brief period. I asked the atheists on RF if they would be willing to attribute this "miracle" to God. In other words, I wanted to know if it would make them reconsider their lack of belief in a Higher Power. The vast, vast majority (if not all) who responded to my question said that they would conclude that God had nothing to do with it. In their collective opinion, there would have had to be another explanation for this supposed miraculous healing. Perhaps that will explain why I said what I did.

I don't recall your posting on that thread, Jay. If you'd like, I can try to find it for you.

 

[Inky]

I described an experiment involving two large control groups of seriously ill individuals. Every one of the people in one of the control groups was completely healed within a short period of time, presumably as a result of God having answered the prayers of many who pleaded with Him on their behalf. Every one of the people in the other group, for whom no prayers were said, died within the same brief period.

Who did that study, and do you have a link to it? I've seen several studies starting out the same way, and all of them have turned out that both groups died or healed equally, except one in which the group that was prayed for did worse. That was back when I was a psych major so I threw out the files, but I can try and look something up online.

 

[Katzpur]

Who did that study, and do you have a link to it?

It wasn't a real study. It was a hypothetical study born out of my own imaginings. I don't think it would even be possible to actually do such a study, at least not with the rigid controls I outlined. But here is a link to the thread in case you're interested in posting: Atheists Only: Would this be proof?

 

[Inky]

Thanks Katzpur, my mistake.

As far as the thread title...I'd say God doesn't heal amputees for the same reason S/he allows them to get hurt in the first place, and that I don't have an easily explained reason for why that is.

 

[gnomon]

If God did heal an amputee, no atheist would acknowledge that He had anything to do with it. For this reason, I'm baffled as to why an atheist would ask this question in the first place.

The question is asked because thousands of people spend millions of dollars on people like Peter Popoff and Benny Hinn because they believe that God heals the sick and infirm. Anything from cancer, arthritis and bad acne. Yet, for some reason, never an amputated limb, or probably even a broken limb for that matter.

It is a rather reasonable question to ask why regenerative miracles do not seem to occur, which would be easily verifiable, yet claims of alleviation or regression from various ailments and diseases do occur, which are "miracles" which cannot be empirically verified beyond chance. Or more often is the case with the two men I mentioned, fraudulent.

 

[Sonic247]

I wonder if when Jesus healed the guys ear that Peter cut of if it grew back or just the skin around it closed up... Benny Hinn, what a joke. Jim Jones is another, over 900 people died, I saw pictures it wasn't pretty, and he shot himself in the head.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I started a thread sometime ago in which I described a similar hypothesis. It was on the atheism subforum and I didn't contribute more than two or three posts because it really wasn't my intention debate the topic. At any rate, I described an experiment involving two large control groups of seriously ill individuals. Every one of the people in one of the control groups was completely healed within a short period of time, presumably as a result of God having answered the prayers of many who pleaded with Him on their behalf. Every one of the people in the other group, for whom no prayers were said, died within the same brief period. I asked the atheists on RF if they would be willing to attribute this "miracle" to God. In other words, I wanted to know if it would make them reconsider their lack of belief in a Higher Power. The vast, vast majority (if not all) who responded to my question said that they would conclude that God had nothing to do with it. In their collective opinion, there would have had to be another explanation for this supposed miraculous healing. Perhaps that will explain why I said what I did.

I don't recall your posting on that thread, Jay. If you'd like, I can try to find it for you.

Please.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

It wasn't a real study. It was a hypothetical study born out of my own imaginings. I don't think it would even be possible to actually do such a study, at least not with the rigid controls I outlined. But here is a link to the thread in case you're interested in posting: Atheists Only: Would this be proof?

And here is another ...

DURHAM, N.C. – Distant prayer and the bedside use of music, imagery and touch (MIT therapy) did not have a significant effect upon the primary clinical outcome observed in patients undergoing certain heart procedures, researchers at Duke Clinical Research Institute (DCRI), Duke University Medical Center, the Durham Veterans Affairs Medical Center (VAMC) and seven other leading academic medical institutions across the U.S. have found. Therapeutic effects were noted, however, among secondary measures such as emotional distress of patients, re-hospitalization and death rates.

- see dukemed news

That said, the intrinsic value of the question posed in the OP is that it greatly lessens the import of rigid controls and the carefully nuanced interpretation of results. I can't help but get the feeling that you find the question unfair precisely because it is effective.

 

[Scuba Pete]

I find it particularly unfair is that it misses the real purpose of Christianity. It's NOT to regrow limbs, help you over that bad cold or to protect you from a car accident. In fact, those are clear abuses of a relationship with God. People who preach this kind of quackery are above all to be mocked. They are just as bad as those who use Christianity to get rich or as some sort of fire insurance!

You might as well ask why a disbelief in God does not help you to heal amputees.

 

[Katzpur]

And here is another ...That said, the intrinsic value of the question posed in the OP is that it greatly lessens the import of rigid controls and the carefully nuanced interpretation of results.

I can go along with that.

I can't help but get the feeling that you find the question unfair precisely because it is effective.

I didn't find it particularly unfair. I was offended by the patronizing tone of the OP more than anything else. Specifically, the question, "Does God have a grudge against cripples?" was tacky and in poor taste.

By the way, here is the thread I was referring to: Atheists Only: Would this be proof?

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I didn't find it particularly unfair. I was offended by the patronizing tone of the OP more than anything else. Specifically, the question, "Does God have a grudge against cripples?" was tacky and in poor taste.

By the way, here is the thread I was referring to: Atheists Only: Would this be proof?

Let's say we had a group of 500,000 people, all of whom were terminally ill and none of whom were in any way religious. They could be either agnostic or atheist, I suppose, but they definitely would not be the kind of people who would ever pray, asking that God heal them, nor would they solicit the prayers of others on their behalf. Let's assume that they were all close to death and resigned to the fact that the end was near. Now, let's say that these people were split into two groups of 250,000 each. The prayers of all Christians, Muslims and Jews throughout the world were offered up to God, pleading with Him to heal the dying individuals within the first of these two groups. No one, however would pray for anyone in the second group. Within a relatively short period of time (let's say two weeks), every single one of the 250,000 individuals for whom prayers were offered were "miraculously" healed. Without a single exception, all of them were as healthy as they'd been at any time in their lives. On the other hand, during this same period of time, every last one of the 250,000 who had not had anyone pray for them (and had not prayed for themselves) died, as had been expected.

Would these results, if they were exactly as I described them, possibly cause you to re-think you lack of belief in God?

Absolutely, although I would find such a deity revolting. Had all 500,000 been "miraculously" healed, I would thank God for the intercession and the object lesson.

 

[Scuba Pete]

Absolutely, although I would find such a deity revolting. Had all 500,000 been "miraculously" healed, I would thank God for the intercession and the object lesson.

Really... this is the story behind the "Good Samaritan". The one you help is your neighbor and we know that God is no respecter of persons.

As great as physical suffering is, God is here to resolve a different kind of suffering.

Matthew 13:13 This is why I speak to them in parables:
"Though seeing, they do not see;
though hearing, they do not hear or understand. 14 In them is fulfilled the prophecy of Isaiah:
" 'You will be ever hearing but never understanding;
you will be ever seeing but never perceiving.
15 For this people's heart has become calloused;
they hardly hear with their ears,
and they have closed their eyes.
Otherwise they might see with their eyes,
hear with their ears,
understand with their hearts
and turn, and I would heal them.' -NIV

 

[may]

Considering the numerous amount of times that people have lost arms or legs, and only the few times that have been shown on here that people have even partially regrown that limb, both in the Bible, and today, how effective would god be measured this manner?

One of my mother's friends lost a limb in a car accident. God did not give her a limb, but she did get a prosthetic limb. It seems if I have an accident, I had best rely on humans rather than God.

yes that would be the case for all of us if we lost a limb, because the true God is not doing physical healing at the momment , but that is for a future time , and then this verse will be fullfilled ISAIAH 33;24
And no resident will say: "I am sick." The people that are dwelling in [the land] will be those pardoned for their error.
(Revelation 21:4) And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former things have passed away."
At that time the eyes of the blind ones will be opened, and the very ears of the deaf ones will be unstopped. At that time the lame one will climb up just as a stag does, and the tongue of the speechless one will cry out in gladness. For in the wilderness waters will have burst out, and torrents in the desert plain. ISAIAH 35;5-6

 

[uumckk16]

Because those miracles are in the Bible, which I believe to be inspired by God.

Sorry, I see that as circular logic. You believe in miracles that happened thousands of years ago without need of proof because you believe in miracles that happened thousands of years ago (a.k.a. the authors of the Bible being inspired by God). That's cool and all if that's what you believe, it's just pretty circular IMHO.

 

[lilithu]

Christians give him him credit for healing pretty much most thing that we have cure for, but never has he just spontaneously healed an amputees missing limb i the same manner. why is that? does he have a grudge against cripples in general? they are not worthy?

Interesting question. It assumes that there is something "wrong" with being an amputee that needs to be "healed." I'm sure there are amputees who feel that way, but I am also sure that there are amputees who do not. A blind woman in my church was quite insulted when some other religious group claimed that practicing their religion would heal her blindness. For her, there is nothing "wrong" with the way she is. She is not in need of "healing."

darn it, the title should read "why doesnt god heal amputees'........i hate myself.......

If you hate yourself over a typo, maybe there are other things you should be attending to rather than criticizing Christianity.

 

[Quiddity]

Interesting question. It assumes that there is something "wrong" with being an amputee that needs to be "healed." I'm sure there are amputees who feel that way, but I am also sure that there are amputees who do not. A blind woman in my church was quite insulted when some other religious group claimed that practicing their religion would heal her blindness. For her, there is nothing "wrong" with the way she is. She is not in need of "healing.

I gotta admit that I never really understood this. I went to the only elementary school in our county that bused kids with all sorts of handicaps. Many of which I played with during recess. It tore my heart to see many of them in that way and I couldn't help but show it. I never once thought they would prefer to stay that way, until I told my friend one time that Timmy (who was on a wheel chair) wanted to play basketball with us and probably wished he could run along with us. His response to me had me pondering all day. He said "I wish I could dunk and sometimes I wished I had black hair and other times I wish my nose wasn't too small"

That did it for me.

 

[CLantara]

Sorry for ressurecting this post but it relates directly as to why I just joined this forum.
In Mattew 21;21 it states...that if you believe you will receive whatever you ask in prayer".

So why has there never been one recorded case in the history of medicine where an amputees missing limb has been regenerated, a broken spinal cord repaired, a thalidomide sufferer cured etc etc? I'm pretty sure that devout believers have prayed fervently for God to cure them of these physical impairments but He ALWAYS ignores them. If the Gospel is indeed "gospel" then why does he not act on Matthew21:21?