So...just what is your reason and purpose for existence?

[s2a]

It has been often (and accurately enough) observed that "science" (as some "godless", obscure, monolithic, and/or unrefined entity unto itself) neither ascribes, nor seeks to attribute, any "reason" or "purpose" for an individualistic and mortal human existence. Humans simply exist - within an ongoing and inexorable cosmos of change, and an incessant progression of consequential events - unto themselves. No rewards. No punishments. No preferences. No bias. The cosmos is (essentially)....indifferent/ambivalent to the existence of ourselves, and of our species.

You may accept the above premise as "true"; or by some faith-based rationale, completely reject such a concept.

If we assume that there is an ascribable or attributable [personalized] "purpose" or "reason" for our own mortal existence (something that "science" does not seek to provide nor define), then what does your faith-based belief "tell" you is your "reason" or "purpose" in existence?

[Note: To simply state that you exist to sate/satisfy/fulfill/exemplify some supernatural entity; or arise to some benignly sentient "spirituality", "force", "destiny", or "Karma", etc., doesn't really specifically answer the question itself.

One example of an incomplete answer might be:
"My reason for existence is to share my gift of healing. I am a medical doctor. I heal the wounds of others, thusly fulfilling an important purpose which defines my reason for existence."
Such a response is lacking because it offers no original foundation for the conclusion. It offers a rationale, but it doesn't answer the originating or unique aspect of the "why" (you are), of the "what" (you are)...or the "wherefrom" such conclusive determinations are sourced.

Jesus was a carpenter before taking on the role of Savior as a full-time venture. Why a carpenter? Did he manifest some particular acumen in his youth in crafting sinless footstools? Did his (foster?) dad have any impact upon that early career course, or was Jesus simply "meant" to be a carpenter? Jesus' (accounted) reason and purpose for existence was eventually detailed and realized, but he really didn't have much say in the matter. Is there really any calling for carpenters in the eternal hereafter? Do job descriptions (or their attendant responsibilities), or self-assignations of religious affiliation, ideological persuasion, or motivational actions/behaviors accurately refect any "true" reasons or purpose in a mortal existence?

Put another way...if science, induction, or logic are somehow invalid (or incabapble) in determining one's own determined reason and purpose for existence...then what source of illogical, irrational, or unscientific information/inspiration do you utilize in obtaining your uniquely "true" purpose and reason for existence? Can such reasons and purposes be realized absent some externalized someone or something, or are they utterly dependent (perhaps unavoidably so) upon an external source of determination?]

So (again)...what is your reason and purpose in existence today...within an infinite cosmos that spans literally billions of years of observable space-time?

Do you feel that your reason and purpose for existence is something you can accountably determine for yourself...or can reason and purpose only be bestowed upon you, by "someone" or "something else"?

If your personal understanding of your own reason and purpose for existence has changed (at least once) in your lifetime, was the catalyst for that change brought about by tragedy or some unpleasant circumstance/consequence...or were you at some pinnacle of goal-set attainment, achievement, or bliss? Did you hear voices in your head? Were you bribed or enticed with a more exciting promise of personal fulfillment, for better or worse?

As contrasting comparison, can/could you outline the specifics of your great-grandparent's reason/purpose for existence? How about their own great-grandparent's? Surely such historically exquisite details and manifestly purposed reasons could affect your own assessments and rationales for a purposed existence today? What was your great-great-great-grandfather's "purpose" in existence? Was his "purpose" realized in some concrete and substantively memorable fashion? If so, how so? If not, why not?
[Feel free to elaborate substantively and accordingly].

If you are a self-professed Christian, whom (of departed familial heredity) could/would you confidently conclude is now writhing in the fiery pits of Hell? Anyone? Alternatively, whom (do you know) has earned a place in Heaven aside God?
Does your genetic heritage have any bearing or impact upon your own "reason" and "purpose" in/of/for existence? Do (or should) the sons, in fact, bear the iniquities of their forefathers?

Do you believe that your personalized choices in faith/belief/unbelief today, have any influential impact upon the sixth generation to follow, hence your departure from this mortal realm? If you can not recall the existent "reason" and/or "purpose" that your fifth or sixth generation-removed ancestors served or fulfilled, then is it reasonable to conclude that your faith-based beliefs today will have any relevant impact whatsoever upon your equally time-removed descendants?

If you live to be 80 years old, your life span equates to (appx.) 0.00000018% of accountable cosmological time. In such terms, Mayflies are virtually statistically equivalent to humans. Whom serves the greater (or more consequential) reason of/for purpose for existence within the cosmos? Man or Mayfly? If Mayflies outlive our species in the long run (and a looong run it will be), does that lessen or bolster our standing before the cosmos? Does it really matter?

If you "know" what your reason and purpose for existence is...(and if you care to) please share, and be specific (within the suggested aforementioned parameters above) when possible. Or if you please, speculate what (you think) your descendants are most likely to recall about your reasoned and purposed existence 300 years from today, or if it even matters whether or not they have any recollection of you (or your reasoned and purposed existence) at all.

If you don't "know", but are "searching" for your "place" in the cosmos, please define what parameters/consequences are essential in order to achieve or satisfy a personal surety and confidence of/in such reason(s) and purpose(s) in that placement. In other words, how will you know when you have arrived at where you want to be, and can you be sure that your destination has been veritably realized as an existentially unequivocal "truth"?

Just wondering...;-)

 

[Opethian]

I exist because I can exist.

 

[Revasser]

Hmm, I'm not entirely sure how in depth you want me to be... but it's hard to really be in depth with my basic answer.

I don't have a prescribed "purpose" and my life has no particular "meaning", except, I suppose, for the animal instinct to keep existing for as long as I can and even that is negotiable. Like everything else, I just "am" and that is more than enough for me. My spirituality/religion doesn't dictate that I must have an overriding "purpose" and certainly doesn't dictate what that must be if I do have one.

I believe people choose and create their own purpose and meaning, if they desire them, or that they can just as well go on without them, as I do, if they don't feel the need to have them.

 

[Atheist_Dave]

I second Revasser, I believe we create our own purpose. I'm too young to know what my purpose is right now, but I know I will always remember how lucky I am. The chances that I would have been born were ridiculously slim, yet I am here. I thank my atheism for motivating me to make the most of my life, and that is what I plan to do. Atheism is like affirming, I owe it everything.

This seems vague, but I am still searching.

 

[d.]

I don't have a prescribed "purpose" and my life has no particular "meaning"

i agree with the fox.

expecting to find 'meaning' or 'purpose' in general existence seems to me like asking water to fetch the newspaper. if that makes sense

though i get the feeling s2a's 'question' isn't really intended as a question but more of a general critique of 'religious thinking', n'est-ce pas?

 

[michel]

Do you feel that your reason and purpose for existence is something you can accountably determine for yourself...or can reason and purpose only be bestowed upon you, by "someone" or "something else"?

If your personal understanding of your own reason and purpose for existence has changed (at least once) in your lifetime, was the catalyst for that change brought about by tragedy or some unpleasant circumstance/consequence...or were you at some pinnacle of goal-set attainment, achievement, or bliss? Did you hear voices in your head? Were you bribed or enticed with a more exciting promise of personal fulfillment, for better or worse?

I believe by someone/thing else

Goal achievement, I suppose you could say. I had no religious beliefs before the age of about 20. I sat down and read, and meditated, looked back at my own circumstances and came to the conclusion that I was 'here' for various purposes.

1. I actually believed I had been born on the wrong planet (or maybe dimension) - because I felt so remote and withdrawn from everyone else. To some extent, I still do.
2. I believe that all physical life is for learning all the lessons necessary to 'be with God'

3. I also believe that I was to have a special purpose in this life, and yet have either 'missed the message' or haven't had it yet.

4. One of the lessons i think I may have been here to learn was to face my life. Having tried to end it four times, and yet having failed, I think someone is trying to tell me something.........:biglaugh:

 

[Mister Emu]

If you are a self-professed Christian, whom (of departed familial heredity) could/would you confidently conclude is now writhing in the fiery pits of Hell? Anyone? Alternatively, whom (do you know) has earned a place in Heaven aside God?

Can't say...

As to why I am here, not sure, but I believe there is such a reason, for now I will stick to loving God and man and wait and see if anything pops up... Maybe my reason has already happened, maybe I missed it, maybe I'll live my whole "0.00000018%" of the timespan of the cosmos wodnering, maybe I'll find it tomorrow? Maybe there is no reason...

 

[BruceDLimber]

Greetings!

It has been often (and accurately enough) observed that "science" (as some "godless", obscure, monolithic, and/or unrefined entity unto itself) neither ascribes, nor seeks to attribute, any "reason" or "purpose" for an individualistic and mortal human existence.

I agree that science doesn't, or at least doesn't beyond the reductionist "a creature's purpose is to breed!"

But the reason that it doesn't is that this is not science's role. Science explains the "how" of things.

Religion, in contrast, has the role of explaining Who and why. And so, it explains (and is eminently qualified to explain) what our purpose is here!

I'm a Baha'i, and I would explain this as follows:

Our purpose here is twofold:

* As individuals, we are to acquire the spiritual virtues we need in both this life and the Next.

* In aggregate, we are to carry forward an ever-advancing, spiritually-based civilization.

And the purpose of religion is to show us HOW to go about this!

Peace,


Bruce

 

[BFD_Zayl]

well, i typed a long and nice reply, but the site server screwed up and killed it, lonmg sotry shot. the reason I exist is to be judged by the gods for the appropiate after life.

 

[Halcyon]

I believe that for God to be infinite and complete that S/he must contain all things and all possibilities. Thus i exist because i must.

 

[Mister_T]

I'm here for God's entertainment. I should have "God's Hackey Sack" tatooed across my butt.

 

[Feathers in Hair]

If we assume that there is an ascribable or attributable [personalized] "purpose" or "reason" for our own mortal existence (something that "science" does not seek to provide nor define), then what does your faith-based belief "tell" you is your "reason" or "purpose" in existence?

My faith doesn't really tell me anything about my reason or purpose for existence. I'm not sure if I would trust it if it did.

I believe, however, that the reason and purpose for my existence in this particular lifetime is to learn how to accept unconditional love. I am also, I hope, a writer, and I feel it is my ultimate calling to heal people through words.



Jesus was a carpenter before taking on the role of Savior as a full-time venture. Why a carpenter? Did he manifest some particular acumen in his youth in crafting sinless footstools? Did his (foster?) dad have any impact upon that early career course, or was Jesus simply "meant" to be a carpenter? Jesus' (accounted) reason and purpose for existence was eventually detailed and realized, but he really didn't have much say in the matter. Is there really any calling for carpenters in the eternal hereafter? Do job descriptions (or their attendant responsibilities), or self-assignations of religious affiliation, ideological persuasion, or motivational actions/behaviors accurately refect any "true" reasons or purpose in a mortal existence?

Put another way...if science, induction, or logic are somehow invalid (or incabapble) in determining one's own determined reason and purpose for existence...then what source of illogical, irrational, or unscientific information/inspiration do you utilize in obtaining your uniquely "true" purpose and reason for existence? Can such reasons and purposes be realized absent some externalized someone or something, or are they utterly dependent (perhaps unavoidably so) upon an external source of determination?]

So (again)...what is your reason and purpose in existence today...within an infinite cosmos that spans literally billions of years of observable space-time?

Do you feel that your reason and purpose for existence is something you can accountably determine for yourself...or can reason and purpose only be bestowed upon you, by "someone" or "something else"?

Again, I wouldn't trust it if it wasn't from within myself.

If your personal understanding of your own reason and purpose for existence has changed (at least once) in your lifetime, was the catalyst for that change brought about by tragedy or some unpleasant circumstance/consequence...or were you at some pinnacle of goal-set attainment, achievement, or bliss? Did you hear voices in your head? Were you bribed or enticed with a more exciting promise of personal fulfillment, for better or worse?

It was in a 'medicine wheel' vision. If one wishes to view that as voices in my head, that's perfectly acceptable.

Do you believe that your personalized choices in faith/belief/unbelief today, have any influential impact upon the sixth generation to follow, hence your departure from this mortal realm? If you can not recall the existent "reason" and/or "purpose" that your fifth or sixth generation-removed ancestors served or fulfilled, then is it reasonable to conclude that your faith-based beliefs today will have any relevant impact whatsoever upon your equally time-removed descendants?

Probably not my specific beliefs, but hopefully (if I have descendants), they will be able to benefit from the ways that my beliefs caused me to interact with the world. (Promoting equality, peace and walking gently on the earth.)

If you "know" what your reason and purpose for existence is...(and if you care to) please share, and be specific (within the suggested aforementioned parameters above) when possible. Or if you please, speculate what (you think) your descendants are most likely to recall about your reasoned and purposed existence 300 years from today, or if it even matters whether or not they have any recollection of you (or your reasoned and purposed existence) at all.

I feel very uncomfortable, because I seem to not be understanding the parameters. I am always content with looking the fool, but I know too well that this can sometimes be seen as being evasive or deliberately obtuse.

 

[Majikthise]

My purpose is to collect as much Star Wars junk as is possible.

 

[s2a]

Opethian said:

I exist because I can exist.

How deep.

Hello mayfly.

Next?

 

[s2a]

Revasser said:

Hmm, I'm not entirely sure how in depth you want me to be... but it's hard to really be in depth with my basic answer.

[I tried to leave the most illuminating aspects of any prospective reply wide open, and absent any truly debilitating constraints.]

First of all, I'd like to say that you are indeed the very first Kemetic I have had the (virtual) opportunity to encounter. Monolatry is certainly not a unique concept (Christianity's "Holy Trinity" concept comes to mind).

Understandably, if Netjer (The One) is considered beyond any and all human comprehension, it would be impossible to (ever?) know/understand Netjer's "will" in assignations of any personalized human purpose or reason in/of/for existence. Would it be fair to assume that your "Parent Name" (perhaps) has knowledge of/for your reason and purpose for existence in watching over you, beyond any compunction or necessity to share such knowledge with you?

I don't have a prescribed "purpose" and my life has no particular "meaning", except, I suppose, for the animal instinct to keep existing for as long as I can and even that is negotiable. Like everything else, I just "am" and that is more than enough for me. My spirituality/religion doesn't dictate that I must have an overriding "purpose" and certainly doesn't dictate what that must be if I do have one.

Interesting (really). Yours is a case wherein I might then ask of a believer, "What is the reason and purpose of your faith in your religion?" If the/a God(s) are beyond human comprehension, and if it/they do not choose to intervene directly in our lives, then of what particular relevance or concern do they merit to worshipping believers?

If you'll forgive my illustration...one might as readily point to a rock upon the ground and proclaim "This is God. No one can understand this rock, or why it is here, but it is God just the same. This rock will not intercede, nor impede, upon your path in life (or existence), yet it is worthy of your respect, admiration, and devoted worship."

I believe people choose and create their own purpose and meaning, if they desire them, or that they can just as well go on without them, as I do, if they don't feel the need to have them.

As do I, but then, I'm an atheist...and can reach the same conclusions absent any need or want of faith-based beliefs in divine entities.

 

[s2a]

Atheist_Dave said:

I second Revasser, I believe we create our own purpose. I'm too young to know what my purpose is right now, but I know I will always remember how lucky I am. The chances that I would have been born were ridiculously slim, yet I am here. I thank my atheism for motivating me to make the most of my life, and that is what I plan to do. Atheism is like affirming, I owe it everything.

This seems vague, but I am still searching.

I concur that atheism is indeed life-affirming, and lends the greatest appreciation of the "here and now".

Best wishes to you in your pursuit of your own determined reason and purpose for existence. One shot. Make the most of it. ;-)

[Note: As an atheist of both many years ofd life experience, and a firm resolution of a reasoned and purposed existence , I'd be open to any inquiries you might present for deliberation/consideration in your ongoing quest.]

 

[s2a]

divine said:

i agree with the fox.

expecting to find 'meaning' or 'purpose' in general existence seems to me like asking water to fetch the newspaper. if that makes sense

Not really, no.

But then, the depths of your philosophical introspections may well humble my own shallow shoals.

though i get the feeling s2a's 'question' isn't really intended as a question but more of a general critique of 'religious thinking', n'est-ce pas?

One could choose to construe such an intent...and it would be disingenuous on my part to say that no elements of personal opinion colored my commentary/observations. But the lent question(s) are quite earnest, and remain intended to invoke thoughtful reply/commentary, with prospectively attendant discussion/debate as may prospectively arise.

If faith-based beliefs and religion establish/reinforce personal motivations and behavior for "the things that people say and do", then it's important to understand the "why" of such motivations and behavior (especially if such beliefs are foundational to an individual's understanding and rationale of their own words and deeds).

At the very least, I do not find it unreasonable to inquire (and seek enhancement/illumination) of believers the "why" of "what" they believe to be (personally, or universally) "true".

Religion and faith-based beliefs are predominate amongst our species (though a significant minority still favor reason and inductive logic over myth, superstition, and supernaturalism), and if reason is to prevail, then introspection and rationale must be plumbed and explored to promote understanding and illumination of causal foundations and rationalizations of extant beliefs that ignore/reject/avoid reasoned (or evidence-burdened) and fact-based explanations/motivations within our own selves, and existence itself.

 

[s2a]

michel said:

I believe by someone/thing else.

I know.

You radically independent-mided person you...;-)

Goal achievement, I suppose you could say. I had no religious beliefs before the age of about 20. I sat down and read, and meditated, looked back at my own circumstances and came to the conclusion that I was 'here' for various purposes.

None of which could have been realized absent a religious (or faith-based) perspective?

1. I actually believed I had been born on the wrong planet (or maybe dimension) - because I felt so remote and withdrawn from everyone else. To some extent, I still do.

Heh. When I was younger, I felt that I should have been born in the 23rd century (especially after Star Trek, and Armstrong's "one small step" upon our Moon). Bloody hell! I was told that there would be flying cars in the 21st century (bubbles from the tailpipe optional)!

So...Where's my flying car? Where's my anti-grav belt? Where's my teleportation device (next to my more expensive time machine)? I was supposed to be vacationing (on holiday) on Mars (or Triton, Europa, etc) by now. I mean...bollocks! I've been robbed of my fantasmagorical expectations!

2. I believe that all physical life is for learning all the lessons necessary to 'be with God'

Such is the essence of many theistic beliefs. All I ask is, "what then"? Is spending an eternity with a God that demands unequivocal and unquestioning worship really all that desirable?

3. I also believe that I was to have a special purpose in this life, and yet have either 'missed the message' or haven't had it yet.

Maybe (and this is just speculation here), your existence is more meaningful to others than to yourself. Maybe you simply help others appreciate their own existence more...and there's nothing wrong with that. Selfless and courageous soldiers do no less in falling upon a live grenade.

4. One of the lessons i think I may have been here to learn was to face my life. Having tried to end it four times, and yet having failed, I think someone is trying to tell me something.........

Thomas Edison once remarked that he discovered 4000 ways how not to make a light bulb. Sometimes, just getting it right once, makes all the failures fall in line within their appropriate place of life experience. ;-)

 

[s2a]

Hello Mister Emu

After I said:

If you are a self-professed Christian, whom (of departed familial heredity) could/would you confidently conclude is now writhing in the fiery pits of Hell? Anyone? Alternatively, whom (do you know) has earned a place in Heaven aside God?

You said:

Can't say...

You can not say, will not say, or simply say that you don't know?

As to why I am here, not sure, but I believe there is such a reason, for now I will stick to loving God and man and wait and see if anything pops up... Maybe my reason has already happened, maybe I missed it, maybe I'll live my whole "0.00000018%" of the timespan of the cosmos wodnering, maybe I'll find it tomorrow? Maybe there is no reason...

Why do you believe that "there is such a reason"? That is, (in essence), the crux of the topical question itself. Must there be a reason for your existence to "matter"?

If indeed you ponder that "Maybe there is no reason...", then what is the point, or reason, or purpose served in a religious adherence, or in faith-based beliefs? If atheists/unbelievers can realize/manifest their own reasons and purpose in existence - and retain hope, optimism, compassion, and love - not only for themselves, but for their very own species...then what personal need or want is left unfulfilled that religion or faith-based beliefs alone can provide?

Again, the thrust of the premise asserts (inquisitorialy) that faith-based beliefs/religion provide that "something extra", that (alledgedly) reason and logic alone can not provide. If your professed beliefs can't provide you answer to your reason and purpose in/of/for existence (You know...THE Questions: "Who am I?"; "Why am I here?"; What happens when I die?" - THE questions that science/logic can't definitively answer), then why retain/adhere/maintain such beliefs?

If faith-based beliefs offer the same level of incertitude as science and reason, then what advantage do faith-based beliefs offer as superior to science and reason?

Science (and atheism) consider "I don't know" a perfectly acceptable answer to any given confounding inquiry regarding the unexplained or undefined.

One may fairly inquire, "Why is there air?"
"Well, without air, we couldn't blow up basketballs."

OK. That makes sense (sort of), but it doesn't explain "why" there isn't air everywhere. Is the only purpose and reason for the existence of air to allow inflation of basketballs? If there are no basketballs, does air then serve no reason or purpose in existence? Must reason and purpose for existence be directly attributable in some way? Does air cease to "matter" or exist, if no definable/ascribable reason or purpose can be attributed to it's existence? Does the galaxy Andromeda serve any ascribable reason or purpose for it's existence? If so, how so. How do faith-based beliefs define or detail another galaxy's existence - in any meaningful or purposeful way - that significantly differs from those proffered by science or reason?

 

[michel]

Now how did I know that my answer would be torn to shreds ?:biglaugh:

Thomas Edison once remarked that he discovered 4000 ways how not to make a light bulb. Sometimes, just getting it right once, makes all the failures fall in line within their appropriate place of life experience. ;-)

Are you advocating the try & try again, of the spider on the tent lining?