Sexual abuse in Mormon church

[idea]

I don't see how these cases undermine anything.

I don't know everything, but I have yet to see God promise that nothing bad will ever happen or that having His Priesthood takes away a man's desire for sin.

I mean, Cain had the Priesthood and look what he did with it.

Also, God allowed His Only Son to be mocked, beaten and hung on a cross.

God allows bad things to happen so the wicked can receive HIs righteous judgment.

God may not act in the way you expect.

there are promises about what we should have been able to expect from leaders in the church...

That doesn't mean He is not still leading the affairs of the Church.

the church is only as strong as its members, apparently not so strong right now.

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

I'm glad I misunderstood the tone of your post, and I apologize for my error.

It's fine. No worries

 

[Prestor John]

there are promises about what we should have been able to expect from leaders in the church...

Really? What promises are those?

the church is only as strong as its members, apparently not so strong right now.

That's silly.

First off, judging the whole of the Church because of the actions of a few is absurd.

Second, the Church of the Firstborn is eternal and has always existed and will always exist.

It existed before the Restoration and would continue to exist even if every member of the Church was to waste away and die at this very moment.

You're trying to dismiss the tide by judging a squirt gun.

 

[dianaiad]

I was referring to your quote here:

A person always bears responsibility for their actions. Yes, things influence (including addictions), but a person still has a choice and bears responsibility for those choices.

Not always, Jane.

I think that, in certain cases of mental illness, that 'free will' is pretty much toast.

On the other hand, those cases tend to be fairly obvious.

 

[Sunstone]

Mod Post: Thread moved to general religious debates.​

 

[idea]

Really? What promises are those?

First off, judging the whole of the Church because of the actions of a few is absurd.

.

Judging the church leadership and policies for how it reacted to the actions of a few is not absurd. Victim shaming, using tithing money to settle out of court for so many cases, perpetuating leadership callings for known sex addicts - any decent organization would protect and support the victims, the LDS church silenced victims, and protected the abusers.

Commentary: An open letter to the LDS Patriarchy

The new policies:
Ministering with Strengthened Melchizedek Priesthood Quorums and Relief Societies
came about after public pressure, good to see the issues are partially being dealt with.

 

[Prestor John]

Judging the church leadership and policies for how it reacted to the actions of a few is not absurd. Victim shaming, using tithing money to settle out of court for so many cases, perpetuating leadership callings for known sex addicts - any decent organization would protect and support the victims, the LDS church silenced victims, and protected the abusers.

Commentary: An open letter to the LDS Patriarchy

The new policies:
Ministering with Strengthened Melchizedek Priesthood Quorums and Relief Societies
came about after public pressure, good to see the issues are partially being dealt with.

Yet, you have yet to prove anything you have claimed and those new policies have nothing to do with what you are complaining about.

You haven't given anyone a reason to be concerned about Church leadership.

 

[idea]

Yet, you have yet to prove anything you have claimed and those new policies have nothing to do with what you are complaining about.

You haven't given anyone a reason to be concerned about Church leadership.

This is the problem - people expect s to be saints - well, they are not. Do all callings come from g-d? Does everyone tell the truth in their temple interviews? I left the church - not just over a few bad apples, but also over how those bad-apples were - year after year after year - given callings over children, reported then ignored, elevated to being a high priest, put in the bishopric...

Here is one list of convicted cases for you:
Mormon abuse cases - Wikipedia

• In 2001, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church) paid a three million dollar settlement to Jeremiah Scott, after Scott filed a lawsuit in 1998 against the church for what his attorney described as an attempted cover-up of sexual abuse Scott suffered from church member Franklin Curtis.[1] The LDS Church denied legal liability in the case, and said it was settling the lawsuit based on "litigation economics" alone.[1]
• 
  
• In September 2008, LDS Church bishop Timothy McCleve pleaded guilty to sexually molesting children from his ward.[2] He was sentenced in December 2008 to one-to-15 year prison terms for the abuse.[3]
• 
  
• In March 2010, former LDS Church bishop Lon Kennard, Sr. was charged with 43 felony counts of sex abuse and sexual exploitation of children, and was imprisoned in Wasatch County, Utah. In November 2011, Kennard was sentenced to three terms of five-years-to-life in prison to be served consecutively, after pleading guilty to three first-degree felony counts of aggravated sex abuse of a child for sexually abusing his daughters.[4][5]
• 
  
• In December 2013, LDS Church bishop Todd Michael Edwards was sentenced to three years in prison for molesting two teenage girls who attended his congregation in Menifee, California. Edwards received two concurrent sentences of three years in prison for two felony counts of sexual battery and sexual penetration with a foreign object. A felony charge of witness intimidation was dismissed as part of a plea bargain with prosecutors after Edwards pleaded guilty.[6]
• 
  
• In January 2014, two men filed a lawsuit in the U.S. state of Hawaii against the LDS Church, alleging that they were sexually abused as children on a church-owned pineapple farm in Maui from 1986 through 1988.[7]
• 
  
• In January 2014, former LDS Church bishop Michael Wayne Coleman was arrested and charged with luring a minor for sexual exploitation after a forensic examination of his laptop and cellphone revealed sexually graphic conversations and an exchange of nude photographs with a teenaged student in Brazil.[8]
• 
  
• On August 15, 2017, MormonLeaks published a three-hundred and sixteen (316) page document which contained confirmed and alleged instances of child sexual abuse between 1959 and 2017.[9]
• 
  
• On October 30, 2017, an Australian court sentenced Darran Scott to 10 years in prison for sexually abusing boys, some of whom he met as a Mormon leader.[10]

I am currently involved with another case, a bishopric member who videotaped abusing children, it is still going through the courts.

The lesson? Do not put your trust in the arms of flesh - call someone a high priest, a bishop, a president - apostles etc. it does not mean anything.

19 The weak things of the world shall come forth and break down the mighty and strong ones, that man should not counsel his fellow man, neither trust in the arm of flesh.

Do you trust in the arm of flesh?

11 For there is no respect of persons with God.

Do you respect some people - from their title - above others?

 

[Prestor John]

This is the problem - people expect s to be saints - well, they are not. Do all callings come from g-d? Does everyone tell the truth in their temple interviews? I left the church - not just over a few bad apples, but also over how those bad-apples were - year after year after year - given callings over children, reported then ignored, elevated to being a high priest, put in the bishopric...

Here is one list of convicted cases for you:
Mormon abuse cases - Wikipedia

• In 2001, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church) paid a three million dollar settlement to Jeremiah Scott, after Scott filed a lawsuit in 1998 against the church for what his attorney described as an attempted cover-up of sexual abuse Scott suffered from church member Franklin Curtis.[1] The LDS Church denied legal liability in the case, and said it was settling the lawsuit based on "litigation economics" alone.[1]
• 
  
• In September 2008, LDS Church bishop Timothy McCleve pleaded guilty to sexually molesting children from his ward.[2] He was sentenced in December 2008 to one-to-15 year prison terms for the abuse.[3]
• 
  
• In March 2010, former LDS Church bishop Lon Kennard, Sr. was charged with 43 felony counts of sex abuse and sexual exploitation of children, and was imprisoned in Wasatch County, Utah. In November 2011, Kennard was sentenced to three terms of five-years-to-life in prison to be served consecutively, after pleading guilty to three first-degree felony counts of aggravated sex abuse of a child for sexually abusing his daughters.[4][5]
• 
  
• In December 2013, LDS Church bishop Todd Michael Edwards was sentenced to three years in prison for molesting two teenage girls who attended his congregation in Menifee, California. Edwards received two concurrent sentences of three years in prison for two felony counts of sexual battery and sexual penetration with a foreign object. A felony charge of witness intimidation was dismissed as part of a plea bargain with prosecutors after Edwards pleaded guilty.[6]
• 
  
• In January 2014, two men filed a lawsuit in the U.S. state of Hawaii against the LDS Church, alleging that they were sexually abused as children on a church-owned pineapple farm in Maui from 1986 through 1988.[7]
• 
  
• In January 2014, former LDS Church bishop Michael Wayne Coleman was arrested and charged with luring a minor for sexual exploitation after a forensic examination of his laptop and cellphone revealed sexually graphic conversations and an exchange of nude photographs with a teenaged student in Brazil.[8]
• 
  
• On August 15, 2017, MormonLeaks published a three-hundred and sixteen (316) page document which contained confirmed and alleged instances of child sexual abuse between 1959 and 2017.[9]
• 
  
• On October 30, 2017, an Australian court sentenced Darran Scott to 10 years in prison for sexually abusing boys, some of whom he met as a Mormon leader.[10]

I am currently involved with another case, a bishopric member who videotaped abusing children, it is still going through the courts.

The lesson? Do not put your trust in the arms of flesh - call someone a high priest, a bishop, a president - apostles etc. it does not mean anything.

19 The weak things of the world shall come forth and break down the mighty and strong ones, that man should not counsel his fellow man, neither trust in the arm of flesh.

Do you trust in the arm of flesh?

11 For there is no respect of persons with God.

Do you respect some people - from their title - above others?

Repeating this stuff still doesn't give anyone any reason to doubt the truth within and the authority given to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints.

No one is perfect and no one is free from sin, that does not mean the Church is any less true.

 

[idea]

Repeating this stuff still doesn't give anyone any reason to doubt the truth within and the authority given to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints.

No one is perfect and no one is free from sin, that does not mean the Church is any less true.

Authority figure molests your kid but... there is no reason to question authority?

No one is perfect - I will agree with that. No authority figure is perfect - I think G-d makes us doubt authority to force us to stand on our own two feet.

You want to become a G-d? Have to learn how to stand on your own two feet - to become your own authority figure - for that.

I do not want to become a G-d... nor do I want to become like the Christian G-d as I know that to be... I just want to be "with" others, not in front of them, not ruling over them... "with"... that is what I want. Just honesty, and togetherness.