Poland Stops Providing Ukraine with New Weapons, More Calls in Some EU States to Stop Backing Ukraine

[Estro Felino]

You fail to mention putin in any of this. He was the one who invaded, he's the one who will stop it. putin is likely hoping to maintain a stalemate hoping that somehow Trump can get re-elected. The election is 13 months away, and another two before being sworn in. So that is a long time for Russia to hold on against the majority of the world against him.

Do you have a source that says that the presidential elections are in more than a year?
Because...you know...Ukraine is being tested in the process of joining the EU and not allowing elections every five years is against the EU standards of democracy.

Because most of Europe learned how war is a waste of money TWICE in the 20th century.

Exactly. Bravo.

Only putin is too stupid to realize it is something no one values and wants. The faster putin is defeated the better.

Not with EU money, of course.

Then NATO can vote for Ukraine to join, and putin will have caused the one thing he was trying to prevent.

The topic here is European countries funding weaponry for Ukraine.

 

[Estro Felino]

Putin espouses old school Christian values of
vengeance, oppression, & persecuting gays.

Poland...which is the protagonist in this EU-Zelensky little misunderstanding, belongs to the Visegrad group.
A group totally devoted to Christian Nationalism.

 

[Revoltingest]

Poland...which is the protagonist in this EU-Zelensky little misunderstanding, belongs to the Visegrad group.
A group totally devoted to Christian Nationalism.

Christian Nationalists....ugh.
Imposing some rather unchristian values upon the unwilling.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Do you have a source that says that the presidential elections are in more than a year?

? Have a source? What?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Poland...which is the protagonist in this EU-Zelensky little misunderstanding, belongs to the Visegrad group.
A group totally devoted to Christian Nationalism.

Don't forget your own country that very recently kicked the Italian LGBT community.

 

[F1fan]

Do you have a source that says that the presidential elections are in more than a year?

It's common knowledge that the US elections are in November 2024. I guess your disinformation sources don't cover facts.

Because...you know...Ukraine is being tested in the process of joining the EU and not allowing elections every five years is against the EU standards of democracy.

Ukraine had a reform candidate win with Zelensky, and he is very capable and popular as president. He has shown himself to be honest and ethical, especially in response to Trump's requests for fraud against Biden during the 2020 election campaign. The EU recognizes Zelenzky as an honorable president. Far right wing disinformation will say otherwise, and I suspect you may have been willfully manipulated by their false reports.

Exactly. Bravo.

But Europe also learned that they need to spend on defense due to unstable leaders that are a trend in more and more nations.

The Global Expansion of Authoritarian Rule

Global freedom faces a dire threat. Around the world, the enemies of liberal democracy—a form of self-government in which human rights are recognized and every individual is entitled to equal treatment under law—are accelerating their attacks.

freedomhouse.org

The United Nations and the EU are examples of global cooperation so that there is less need for money wasted on military. But with the rise of authoritarian leadsers, much motivated by poorly inflormed and emotionally manipulated citizens, has caused more instability. If Trump wins (the electoral college, not popular vote which he's never gotten) there is a concern that global instability will increase, and perhaps a global war with sides undetermined at the moment. Citizens feeling more fear will be attracted to authoritarian leaders who appear more aggressive. This won't create peace and stability, but more conflict. It will damage relationships and affect global trade, and economies will suffer.

Not with EU money, of course.

Sorry, putin is being defeated with EU money, among others. How much more will it take as we enter another winter? If it is a mild winter like last year then Eurove won't suffer energy supply problems. If it is severe, well who knows. The EU has come this far, and Russia is being pushed back, so I expect ongoing support against putin. I can't see China getting involved as long as Europe is invested.

The topic here is European countries funding weaponry for Ukraine.

And they will likely maintain support. The USA just committed another $325 million.

Biden Administration Announces Additional Security Assistance for Ukraine

President Biden announced the Defense Department is sending an additional security assistance package to meet Ukraine's critical security and defense needs.

www.defense.gov

 

[Estro Felino]

It's common knowledge that the US elections are in November 2024. I guess your disinformation sources don't cover facts.

I was speaking of Ukraine.
This thread is about Ukraine.
They are in March 2024.

Ukraine had a reform candidate win with Zelensky, and he is very capable and popular as president. He has shown himself to be honest and ethical, especially in response to Trump's requests for fraud against Biden during the 2020 election campaign.

This thread is about the relations between Europe and Ukraine.

The EU recognizes Zelenzky as an honorable president. Far right wing disinformation will say otherwise, and I suspect you may have been willfully manipulated by their false reports.

Why do you think more and more EU countries aren't sending weapons?
They don't want to lose the elections.

Norway and Britain don't count...they are not in the EU. So rule them out.

Sorry, putin is being defeated with EU money, among others.

USA is richer. America can fund Mr Zelenskyy alone.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

USA is richer. America can fund Mr Zelenskyy alone.

Fortunately there are European countries far more dedicated to preventing the malignant, cancerous spead of authoritarian. They remember the failure to act that lead to a very bloody and necessary war after Nazi invasions amd aggression threatened the whole of Europe amd beyond.

 

[Estro Felino]

Fortunately there are European countries far more dedicated to preventing the malignant, cancerous spread of authoritarian.

Yes, there are. UK, for example.

They remember the failure to act that lead to a very bloody and necessary war after Nazi invasions amd aggression threatened the whole of Europe amd beyond.

Yes.

 

[Stevicus]

Rand is an isolationist, always has been. And Josh "runs for his life" Hawley will say anything to get media attention.

Perhaps. However, there are indications that there may be limits on Western aid to Ukraine.

I think the danger is still there. I could see a Korean war scenario happen where as soon as it looks like the north is beat, China gets involved. Keeping pressure on putin will keep China minding their own business.

Maybe, although I've seen speculation about what the Russians or Chinese "might do" or "could do" most of my life. I remember the Domino Theory, fears about Cuba, Central America, Southeast Asia, etc., etc. Most of it turned out to be utter BS, so why should anyone believe it now?

Many of these isolationist voices have a poor vision of how connected the world economy is. Imagine if China gets involved and we cut off trade with China. That would be a disaster for the US economy.

It depends on how one defines the current vision of the world. I don't think the predominant portrayals of the world system as some kind of comic book opera with superheroes and supervillains give us any degree of accuracy. Isolationism implies a fear of the world, although I would identify the same fear among the interventionists.

I can understand what you're saying about the world economy and what could be disastrous for ours. But if we're talking about practical economic concerns and actual U.S. interests, then it seems pertinent to address concerns related to that. Part of that means looking at the world in a more practical and realistic way. That's something that appears conspicuously missing in the overall discussion on this subject (and most subjects, for that matter).

If we're going to do business with the world, then okay. But if we choose to let it become personal, then that may be unwise and could cloud our judgment. Being more detached and objective about it may be better for our national and economic interests.

I don't see this, Democrats are pretty solid on support for Ukraine. It's the republians who have a split in support with the Freedom Caucus wanting to cut support. McCarthy is caught in the middle, which was his miscalculation from the start.

Well, it's been a year and a half since this thing started, and who knows where things will stand next summer? The polls in that article indicated that more than 1/3 of Democrats and more than 2/3 of Republicans do not favor further aid to Ukraine. I wouldn't take it for granted that Democrats have pretty solid support for Ukraine. They, too, are facing significant issues in their home districts, so they may be forced to shift their priorities at some point for reasons of political expediency.

In fact, a lot of countries around the world seem to favor some sort of cease fire or end to the hostilities. The practical move right now is to make a deal, but it's all this zeal and bravado that "we must never yield" and "we must fight to last man," along with a virtual blank check of U.S. support that keeps this thing going. It's easy to say "stand or die" by those who have no intention of actually doing it themselves.

 

[Flankerl]

Just PiS being PiS.

Don't forget your own country that very recently kicked the Italian LGBT community.

It's almost as if someone isn't what someone is claiming to be~~~

 

[Estro Felino]

Don't forget your own country that very recently kicked the Italian LGBT community.

In my country LGBT people can get married with each other.
In most of the Slavic world, LGBT can't even get married.

 

[Estro Felino]

Just PiS being PiS.

Exactly.
And they don't want to lose the elections...since Hungary is the powerful force that dictates the rules.

 

[Kathryn]

 

[Revoltingest]

I recognize Prokofiev's "Lt Kije".

 

[Kathryn]

I recognize Prokofiev's "Lt Kije".

It's an old song but still relevant to me. Do the Russians love their children too?

 

[Estro Felino]

In fact, a lot of countries around the world seem to favor some sort of cease fire or end to the hostilities. The practical move right now is to make a deal, but it's all this zeal and bravado that "we must never yield" and "we must fight to last man," along with a virtual blank check of U.S. support that keeps this thing going. It's easy to say "stand or die" by those who have no intention of actually doing it themselves.

Bravo!
They send others to die.
And stay safe and warm at home.

 

[Revoltingest]

It's an old song but still relevant to me. Do the Russians love their children too?

It suggests that Russians are almost human.

 

[Estro Felino]

Christian Nationalists....ugh.
Imposing some rather unchristian values upon the unwilling.

2024 is a year of elections.
And propaganda works like a charm.

For instance, I guess they are already starting with the anti-NATO propaganda...here.
The EU wants to reconstruct, help, support Ukraine.
The NATO wants to destroy it through a world war.

Whom do you think the Ukrainians or the Poles will vote for?

 

[F1fan]

2024 is a year of elections.
And propaganda works like a charm.

For instance, I guess they are already starting with the anti-NATO propaganda...here.
The EU wants to reconstruct, help, support Ukraine.
The NATO wants to destroy it through a world war.

Looks like you are believing the anti-NATO propaganda.