Palestianian atheist arrested

[Autodidact]

And why should they be a protected class?

Protected from what? Discrimination? Not sure what you're getting at here.

It sounds like you're trying to draw an equivalent between people who advocate against gay rights and people who advocate against Islam. But no one here is suggesting that the former group be locked up or killed, so what is the relevance?

 

[Autodidact]

If Muslims are going to strive for anything, then it's not going to be for your values but God willing for Islam and establishment of Islamic Shari'a. There is hope, isA.

Which includes suppression of free speech, correct?

 

[Autodidact]

Wow. I don't think I could compartmentalize my thoughts & emotions like that. But my male brain is less sophisticated than yours.

You can't grasp the concept of disagreeing with someone, but defending their right to express their opinion? I don't find it that complicated. Anyone else?

 

[Meow Mix]

If Muslims are going to strive for anything, then it's not going to be for your values but God willing for Islam and establishment of Islamic Shari'a. There is hope, isA.

And that's good as long as it's not violating people's rights.

If it IS violating rights, as this man's rights have been violated, then may it swiftly vanish from earth so that no one else would be oppressed unjustly. Unjust systems that oppress people need to go the way of the dodo bird.

 

[beenie]

Are you sure that can be done? I wonder if the extreme reactions to criticism of islam stems from a suspicion on the part of the reacters that islam cannot be supported by reason.

Why else would all these people be so upset to find that someone disagrees with them?

We have to learn that we cannot make ourselves (Muslims) robots (ie, we all think alike, no free thought, etc)...we certainly can't expect non-Muslims to believe as we do.

However, we CAN and SHOULD prove the critics wrong by setting a good example to the world by not persecuting/calling for the death of a loud-mouth atheist. Muslims in general are very passionate people and hold Islam very close to their hearts; any insult is seen as a stab at a close family member (just a way to relate it). However, violently acting out is not the answer, as has been shown over and over again.

 

[Meow Mix]

Wow. I don't think I could compartmentalize my thoughts & emotions like that. But my male brain is less sophisticated than yours.

Actually I'm pretty sure male brains are more sophisticated, I think females have more connective tissue while males have more gray matter... it all ends up the same though, but it might be why women do more things like gossip. Or that could just be an ingrained cultural thing. Who knows?

Do you honestly think you couldn't protect the rights of someone you disagreed with, though? I bet you could, while we disagree a lot you've never come off as an oppressor to me.

 

[Magic Man]

Maybe we should tell the people offended by other kinds of hate --like homophobia-- to do the same. Grow a backbone, LGBT!

/sarcasm

The difference is homophobia is the cause of discrimination against the LGBT community. As soon as there is discrimination caused by blaspheming, that would be a suitable comparison. (And I mean, actual discrimination, not the bogus "war on Christmas" "discrimination".)

 

[Magic Man]

Does anyone else get the impression Pete is just a bot that pulls out a word or two from a post and responds with the stock comment in response? It seems like most of his posts don't actually address what the post he's responding to actually said at all.

 

[IslamDude]

Unless you value freedom and truth more.

But of course. If freedom of speech becomes more valuable than preservation of life itself then do whatever the heck you want.

And you know this how?

Precisely my point.

Saying "Brainwashed! Brainwashed!" is merely an unsubstantiated assertion.

 

[Meow Mix]

But of course. If freedom of speech becomes more valuable than preservation of life itself then do whatever the heck you want

But the point is that freedom of speech shouldn't carry the cost of death or imprisonment by primitive, insecure little men as is what happened in Palestine.

 

[IslamDude]

Well it may be considered that, but it's not. It's just hurling insults at a figure that some people consider sacred and holy.

You of course don't consider them so, we do. They are sacred and holy to us. That is a fact.

He was jailed for breaking a law against "insulting the divine essence." In your view, is it right to jail people for this offense?

Of course not. Also that's besides the point. Saying someone was jailed for arguing or disagreeing with something is completely different to saying that person was jailed for insulting religious wholly figure to almost 2 billion people. Intentional misrepresentation of the truth to the public in such a manner is considered propaganda. If it's unintentional, then it's still propaganja.

Nuff said.

 

[Meow Mix]

You of course don't consider them so, we do. They are sacred and holy to us. That is a fact.

Of course not. Also that's besides the point. Saying someone was jailed for arguing or disagreeing with something is completely different to saying that person was jailed for insulting religious wholly figure to almost 2 billion people. Intentional misrepresentation of the truth to the public in such a manner is considered propaganda. If it's unintentional, then it's still propaganja.

Nuff said.

But no one should be jailed for giving an opinion about a religious holy figure to even 100 billion people.

Freedom of speech is not a popularity contest. It's either free or it's not.

Consider my example with Martin Luther King, Jr. MLK is a hero to many in the US. Many people think he was wholly just and would never have done something like participate in something like a threesome.

If someone argues with evidence that MLK did indeed participate in a threesome, should they be jailed for simply voicing their opinion on a matter that many people hold dear? OF COURSE NOT.

Nor should someone be jailed for expressing an opinion of Mohammed that you are 2 billion people disagree with. That's ridiculous and barbaric to jail people for expressing an opinion.

From the quote I provided, he wasn't even saying anything vitriolic. He was trying to make a point, it wasn't just hate-mongering. There is NO reason why he should have been jailed or faced ANY repurcussions from the law at all. NONE.

That someone's freedom of speech should depend on how well-liked their opinion is or not is the most egregious "reasoning" I've ever heard to oppress someone.

 

[IslamDude]

But the point is that freedom of speech shouldn't carry the cost of death or imprisonment by primitive, insecure little men as is what happened in Palestine.

Of course it shouldn't.

Though still, If freedom of speech becomes more valuable than preservation of life itself then do whatever the heck you want.

If I see a guy with an AK47 in Kingston Jamaica his hand and then I start criticizing the way he's dressing, he shouldn't kill me for voicing my opinion. Heck even if I insulted his mother, he doesn't have the right to kill me, but be sure there's a 99.9% chance he will.

So... if freedom of speech becomes more valuable than preservation of life itself then do whatever the heck you want, which was my response to a person speaking of where a person values their views and beliefs over their life.

Honestly though, I doubt this is very common at all. After all, the guy in the OP did his stuff anonymously.

 

[IslamDude]

But no one should be jailed for giving an opinion about a religious holy figure to even 100 billion people.

Freedom of speech is not a popularity contest. It's either free or it's not.

Consider my example with Martin Luther King, Jr. MLK is a hero to many in the US. Many people think he was wholly just and would never have done something like participate in something like a threesome.

If someone argues with evidence that MLK did indeed participate in a threesome, should they be jailed for simply voicing their opinion on a matter that many people hold dear? OF COURSE NOT.

Nor should someone be jailed for expressing an opinion of Mohammed that you are 2 billion people disagree with. That's ridiculous and barbaric to jail people for expressing an opinion.

From the quote I provided, he wasn't even saying anything vitriolic. He was trying to make a point, it wasn't just hate-mongering. There is NO reason why he should have been jailed or faced ANY repurcussions from the law at all. NONE.

That someone's freedom of speech should depend on how well-liked their opinion is or not is the most egregious "reasoning" I've ever heard to oppress someone.

Which is why I said "Of course not" when asked if he should be jailed. Not sure what you're getting at here.

 

[Meow Mix]

Of course it shouldn't.

Though still, If freedom of speech becomes more valuable than preservation of life itself then do whatever the heck you want.

If I see a guy with an AK47 in Kingston Jamaica his hand and then I start criticizing the way he's dressing, he shouldn't kill me for voicing my opinion. Heck even if I insulted his mother, he doesn't have the right to kill me, but be sure there's a 99.9% chance he will.

So... if freedom of speech becomes more valuable than preservation of life itself then do whatever the heck you want, which was my response to a person speaking of where a person values their views and beliefs over their life.

Honestly though, I doubt this is very common at all. After all, the guy in the OP did his stuff anonymously.

Ok, I see what you're saying. Yeah, it's not always prudent to do it. But how else was this poor Palestinian man to engage in the basic human right and pleasure of relating his ideas to others?

He found an optional and anonymous medium, but they tracked him down anyway like a pack of slobbering rabid dogs. That's what everyone is so outraged about: they care so much about oppressing that they actually spent the resources to have people SPY on him and then report him to authorities so they could RUIN HIS LIFE over a few pages of him merely expressing his opinion.

I thought on this guy a lot last night. I'm 27, he's only a year younger than me. But now his whole life is ruined, at least as he knew it -- all because he had the misfortune of being born in a barbaric hellhole stuck in the 2nd century BC. Giving these cavemen the internet and expecting them to act civilized with it is laughable.

I'm not calling Muslims cavemen, just anyone that oppresses as these have. China has cavemen that censor things, America apparently jailed some people without cause, these are all barbaric primitives that the world would be better without (meaning, if they get themselves educated... not the darker alternative )

 

[Meow Mix]

Which is why I said "Of course not" when asked if he should be jailed. Not sure what you're getting at here.

You seemed to insinuate there were exceptions if someone is talking about a beloved figure to 2 billion people, as if that's different from someone talking about some other subject.

 

[.lava]

But the point is that freedom of speech shouldn't carry the cost of death or imprisonment by primitive, insecure little men as is what happened in Palestine.

if you dislike our primitive insecure Muslim men, go stick with your rapist, torturer, killer gunmen and leave us alone with our domestic issues

.

 

[Autodidact]

He was jailed for breaking a law against "insulting the divine essence." In your view, is it right to jail people for this offense?

Of course not.

What do you say, Pete, .lava and others? Do you agree with IslamDude (and Abibi) that "of course" no one should be jailed for talking bad about Muhammed, or not?

 

[.lava]

Which includes suppression of free speech, correct?

attacking us is free speech to you

.

 

[Autodidact]

if you dislike our primitive insecure Muslim men, go stick with your rapist, torturer, killer gunmen and leave us alone with our domestic issues

.

There are no Muslim rapists, torturers or killer gunmen? That's news to me.

I believe that Meow was careful to make it clear she is insulting opponents of free speech, not necessarily Muslims. Or are you saying those are the same thing?

Are you Palestinian? If not, how did this become your domestic issue?

Is there something wrong with extending my compassion to people who live in Palestine?