Overcoming same-sex attraction

[Agnostic75]

Since you keep spamming the thread, here is my explanation:
Alma 30*

That does not provide a "yes" or "no" answer to my question, but I do not need an answer from you since the correct answer is quite obviously "yes." Otherwise, God would not be able to provide additional evidence that would cause more people to love and accept him if they were aware of it, which would be an absurd claim.

Yes, I was off-topic, but I can start a new thread on that issue if you wish.

 

[nekoboy]

Are you proposing that homosexuality is as undesirable at zoophilia, and necrophilia?

Some openly gay Congressmen are gay. If they were openly zoophiles, or necrophiles, they would not have had any chance of being elected.

Are you not aware that trying to practice celibacy for life would cause many homosexuals great physicial and emotional distress, and that reparative therapy works best by far for religiously motivated people?

First of all, I never said that homosexuality is as undesireable, I was merely stating that if homosexuality almost impossible to get rid of, then every single sexual deviation known to man is.

Also, homosexuals die earlier deaths (due to disease) than smokers typically do. Tell me, does letting a person enter into a lifestyle that will KILL HIM QUICKER THAN A COUPLE OF CIGARETTES A DAY without telling him the consequences of his actions sound like LOVE AND TOLERANCE?

Second of all, if a homosexual wants to have a civil union, there is nothing I can do to stop him. I won't support his decision, however. And I won't support gay marriage, either.

 

[Wannabe Yogi]

Guys, if you disagree with me, I will do my best to respect your views. If you decide to support gay marriage, that is your decision. You will not have my support, however.

I cannot support your view. I see it as wrong and unethical. I do believe that at some point those who believe as you do will keep it to themselves. It will be seen as bad and not welcome in polite society. Still people have the right to their own beliefs. If you believe that its wrong to be gay then don't engage in gay behaviors. Thats great as far as I am concerned. If your church is against Gay Marriege then they should not marry Gays. Just like rich guys who don't want to play golf with Jews, keep them out of their club. As long as you keep your dirt in your personal life and don't plan to push it on others I am fine with it.

 

[Agnostic75]

And besides, even though homosexuals (usually) don't hurt others, they are certainly hurting themselves.

Did you know that smoking is physically, mentally, and spiritually healthier than homosexuality?

AIDS 50 Times Higher In Gay/Bi-Men Than Other Groups | RH Reality Check
High Infection Rates Continue Among Gay Men
AIDS Rate 50 Times Higher in Homosexual Men: Center for Disease Control | LifeSiteNews.com

You have gotten to one of my specialties, which is debating scientific evidence regarding whether or not homosexuality if healthy. I will reply to your arguments when I get some more time, but for now I will say that the following organizations have offered a good deal of support for homosexuals:

American Psychiatric Association
American Psychological Association
American Academy of Pediatrics
American Medical Association
American Academy of Family Physicians
American Anthropological Association
American Sociological Association

 

[waitasec]

I suppress my own tendencies toward vorarephilia, and yet I am quite happy with the decision.

Also, I see too many examples of the pagan philosophy here, as described in Mainspring of human progress. Basically, the pagan philosophy is that man has no free will, he is a slave to his environment and instincts.

 

[waitasec]

First of all, I never said that homosexuality is as undesireable, I was merely stating that if homosexuality almost impossible to get rid of, then every single sexual deviation known to man is.

Also, homosexuals die earlier deaths (due to disease) than smokers typically do. Tell me, does letting a person enter into a lifestyle that will KILL HIM QUICKER THAN A COUPLE OF CIGARETTES A DAY without telling him the consequences sound like LOVE AND TOLERANCE? Honestly, we should get rid of darwinism, because if darwinism is true, homosexuality would not exist.

Second of all, if a homosexual wants to have a civil union, there is nothing I can do to stop him. I won't support his decision, however. And I won't support gay marriage, either.

if it's there it's there.
face it...it looks so much better than this :ignore:
don'tcha think?

 

[Agnostic75]

Edit: Deletion of duplicate post.

 

[nekoboy]

face it...it looks so much better than this :ignore:
don'tcha think?

Same to you.


Personally, I believe that putting a lifestyle that kills people more quickly than smoking, drug use, obesity, etc on a pedestal is unethical. Face it, we talk about love and tolerance, but the only thing that does is let more homosexuals die, often horribly and painfully. That does not sound like love and tolerance to me.
http://www.traditioninaction.org/HotTopics/a02rStatistcs.html

[FONT=arial,helvetica]Homosexuals aren't discriminated against in employment, so why should they be a protected class?

• The average yearly income of a homosexual is $55,430.00 (most of which is disposable because no children to take care of!). The average of the general population is $32,144.00. The average of blacks is $12,166.00 (24).

• 59.6% of homosexuals are college graduates. 18.0% of the general population are college graduates (24). Too bad they aren't smart enough to listen to God. "Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools" (Romans 1:22).

• 49.0% of homosexuals hold professional/managerial positions. 15.9% of the general population hold such positions (24).

[/FONT]

 

[Agnostic75]

Edit: Deletion of duplicate post.

 

[Agnostic75]

And besides, even though homosexuals (usually) don't hurt others, they are certainly hurting themselves.

Did you know that smoking is physically, mentally, and spiritually healthier than homosexuality?

AIDS 50 Times Higher In Gay/Bi-Men Than Other Groups | RH Reality Check
High Infection Rates Continue Among Gay Men
AIDS Rate 50 Times Higher in Homosexual Men: Center for Disease Control | LifeSiteNews.com

You have gotten to one of my specialties, which is debating scientific evidence regarding whether or not homosexuality if healthy. I will reply to your arguments when I get some more time, but for now I will say that the following organizations have offered a good deal of support for homosexuals:


American Psychiatric Association
American Psychological Association
American Academy of Pediatrics
American Medical Association
American Academy of Family Physicians
American Anthropological Association
American Sociological Association

I will also say that even though gay men have higher percentages of AIDS than heterosexual men do, the majority of gay men do not have AIDS. In addition, lesbians have much lower percentages of AIDS than gay men do.

Many gay men, and many lesbians, outlive many heterosexuals, and live past 65 years of age.

 

[Darkness]

Why would we ever desire to overcome such sublime beauty:

 

[Shadow Wolf]

And besides, even though homosexuals (usually) don't hurt others, they are certainly hurting themselves. Did you know that smoking is physically, mentally, and spiritually healthier than homosexuality?

It is only a mere coincidence homosexual men have a higher incident rate of HIV, and this is because the anus is a very suitable environment for the virus. But of course plenty of heterosexual couples regularly practice anal intercourse so even still it is not a "gay disease." And this "spiritual health" is not a scientific term, and has no merit and weight when discussing real science and evidence.

@ Gjallarhorn: Look bud, It was a sarcastic way to show that the argument "I was born that way" is not a very good argument, especially when it concerns actions and tendencies not accepted by society.

The APA website is a good place to start to finding articles that support that yes they are indeed born that way. And even if not inherently born that way, there are also a number of studies that show environmental factors. So it remains that born that way or not, our sexual orientation is not something we get to pick.

First of all, I never said that homosexuality is as undesireable, I was merely stating that if homosexuality almost impossible to get rid of, then every single sexual deviation known to man is.

The funny thing about sexual deviance, is that it is so caught up in cultural definitions that it can't exist unless a culture labels something as taboo. Another interesting thing about sexuality is what is considered attractive and sexual is culturally defined as well. And by using the term deviant, you are entering the realm of a word that is highly debated because what really is deviant? We can agree on non-consensual sex, but other than that what one culture says is dead sexy another finds absolutely repulsive or possibly even taboo.

Personally, I believe that putting a lifestyle that kills people more quickly than smoking, drug use, obesity, etc is unethical. Face it, we talk about love and tolerance, but the only thing that does is let more homosexuals die. That does not sound like love and tolerance to me.

Not only is that not true, there are plenty of life styles that do put people at a very high risk of severe injury and death. Our society cheers on as a person is tackled by a 300+ pound linebacker, but hardly anyone stops to think of the extreme physical damage, worn out and damaged joints, and what can often be a reduced lifespan because of the abuse that football players endure because we pay them more than what they are economically worth to endure the abuse. And other forms of abusive entertainment include martial arts, boxing, and professional wrestling especially we pay money to cheer on as another human body is being put through voluntarily what most people wouldn't even consider.
Again when you want to say there is something wrong with the "homosexual lifestyle" the same things you want to accuse it of there are examples that are far more urgent yet they are ignored.
And your sources are a blog and two .com URLs. Those do not count as academic sources. Agnostic provided you with a very good list of sources to check for what is unbiased research concerning homosexuality.

 

[Agnostic75]

.......I never said that homosexuality is as undesireable, I was merely stating that if homosexuality is almost impossible to get rid of, then every single sexual deviation known to man is.

A good deal of evidence shows that homosexual desires and actions, and pedophilic desires and actions, are difficult to get rid of. How does that help this thread get anywhere?

Please define "sexual deviation." Would you call a 170 IQ a deviation from the norm?
Obviously, all deviations are not necessarily undesirable.

Personally, I believe that putting a lifestyle that kills people more quickly than smoking, drug use, obesity, etc is unethical. Face it, we talk about love and tolerance, but the only thing that does is let more homosexuals die. That does not sound like love and tolerance to me.

Many heterosexuals eat lots of greasy foods, smoke cigarettes, abuse drugs, are obese, waste thousands, tens of thousands, or hundreds of thousands of dollars on medical insurance and health care, and die before they are 50 years old. In your opinion, are those people unethical? If so, then being unethical is not a matter of ones' sexual preference.

What options have you provided for homosexuals that generally work well?

The majority of homosexuals do not have AIDS.

Lesbians have AIDS much less frequently than gay men do.

Interpreting statistics is often tricky. For example, hypothetically, if 100 heterosexuals, and 100 homosexuals, were studied regarding alcohol abuse, and 25% of homosexuals abused alcohol and 10% of heterosexuals abused alcohol, the 25% figure can easily be misleading. Only about 15 of those homosexuals abused alcohol "because" they are homosexuals, not 25 since about 10 of those 25 homosexuals would have abused alcohol even if they were heterosexuals. So, a better comparison would be 15% - 10%, not 25% - 10%.

And what about the 75% of homosexuals who did not abuse alcohol?

Logically, physical health, and character, are best judged on an individual basis, not on a collective basis.

From a scientific perspective, no intelligent case can be made against homosexual behavior, but an intelligent case can be made against unsafe sex, eating lots of greasy foods, abusing alcohol, abusing drugs, and smoking cigarettes regardless of a person's sexual preference.

 

[waitasec]

Same to you.


Personally, I believe that putting a lifestyle that kills people more quickly than smoking, drug use, obesity, etc on a pedestal is unethical. Face it, we talk about love and tolerance, but the only thing that does is let more homosexuals die, often horribly and painfully. That does not sound like love and tolerance to me.
Statistics on homosexuals - 1978 to 1994

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nothing but absolute unsupported biased tripe

 

[waitasec]

Same to you.

how do you think AIDS got started in the 1st place?

 

[Agnostic75]

Does letting a person enter into a lifestyle that will KILL HIM QUICKER THAN A COUPLE OF CIGARETTES A DAY without telling him the consequences of his actions sound like LOVE AND TOLERANCE?

Many homsoexuals live past 70 years of age, especially those who practice safe sex, eat healthy foods, do not smoke cigarettes, do not abuse alcohol or drugs, and get enough excercise. Why should those homosexuals give up homosexuality, especially since that could lead to serious physical and emotional problems? C

Celibacy is very difficult for many people, and even some supporters of reparative therapy have admitted that it works best by far for religiously motivated people, and even then only 30% or less of the time.

 

[Satyamavejayanti]

If its a natural urge, not even God can change it.

 

[Father Heathen]

It isn't, but like homosexuals; zoophiles, necrophiles, and the like have those tendencies, and it is beyond their control. Usually.

What tendencies do homosexuals get that heterosexuals don't?

 

[Agnostic75]

Interpreting statistics is often tricky. For example, hypothetically, if 100 heterosexuals, and 100 homosexuals, were studied regarding alcohol abuse, and 25% of homosexuals abused alcohol, and 10% of heterosexuals abused alcohol, the 25% figure can easily be misleading. Only about 15 of those homosexuals abused alcohol "because" they are homosexuals, not 25 since about 10 of those 25 homosexuals would have abused alcohol even if they were heterosexuals. So, a better comparison would be 15% - 10%, not 25% - 10%.

Here is another example of how interpreting statistics is often tricky. Let's say that we have a group of 100 heterosexuals, and another group of 100 homosexuals. If 1 heterosexual abused alcohol, and 10 homosexuals abused alcohol, homosexuals abused alcohol 10 times more than heterosexuals do, or 1000% more, but 90, or 90% of homosexuals did not abuse alcohol. Therefore, it is quite important to also consider the “general population” of homosexuals, not just the distressed groups of homosexuals. Opponents of homosexuality usually fail to address the general population of homosexuals since that would make their statistics less impressive, and often with deliberate deception.

 

[Father Heathen]

Also, homosexuals die earlier deaths (due to disease) than smokers typically do. Tell me, does letting a person enter into a lifestyle that will KILL HIM QUICKER THAN A COUPLE OF CIGARETTES A DAY without telling him the consequences of his actions sound like LOVE AND TOLERANCE?

If you're referring to AIDS, that is spread among gays and straits alike through promiscuity and unprotected sex. And merely being gay doesn't magically make one promiscuous and irresponsible. Besides, religious fundamentalism is a billion times more dangerous and unhealthy than homosexuality. Can you overcome yours?

Also, you do realize that the furry fandom is largely LGBT friendly, right?