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On what issues are you unwavering?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Curious George, Dec 9, 2018.

  1. Curious George

    Curious George Veteran Member

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    Are there any issues on which you could not accept an alternative view?

    I do not mean those issues with which you disagree or do not like the outcome. I mean issues which you steadfastly believe are wrong and immoral.

    What are those beliefs?
     
  2. Axe Elf

    Axe Elf Prophet

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    I cannot accept an alternate view on almost any issue--if I could, then it wouldn't be an alternate view, it would be MY view.

    I can accept that there are some issues in which there is legitimate room for a difference of opinion, but I think we all feel that we have arrived at the best opinion for ourselves in those issues too. If we didn't, we'd be changing our opinions.

    And then there are some issues for which alternate views are simply incorrect--like that the Earth is (roughly) spherical--where I can't even allow for the possibility that someone else could legitimately come to a different conclusion.

    EDIT: Upon reflection, I suppose I should say that the only alternate views that I could even possibly accept are those which I have not yet heard or considered--because I'm always open to new evidence. But for those views and opinions which I have already considered and rejected for one reason or another, I'm not really open to accepting them.
     
    #2 Axe Elf, Dec 9, 2018
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2018
  3. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
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    Keeping in mind that we are only a short distance above pond scum, I always feel there is lots to learn so try to be ready to party along those lines. God or an organized intelligence is a certainty. Jesus the Christ comes after that. The rest is negotiable. There are certain respectful. criteria to observe if one expects to be guided by God. For those who violate God's rules I try not to get in the way.
     
  4. Curious George

    Curious George Veteran Member

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    I am interested in the latter. The issues that you cannot even allow for the possibility that someone could legitimately come to a different conclusion. But I am interested in what issues that people hold to on moral grounds. For instance, the civil rights movement saw Martin Luther King Jr talk of unjust laws this echoing a sentiment expressed by Jefferson years earlier. I would not be surprised to fimd the quote even further back throughout history as the sentiment is simple, powerful, and natural.

    I am wondering where, and upon what, people draw lines.

    I am not sure if these words will serve to clarify or muddy my OP, but if you can elaborate accordingly , I would appreciate it.
     
  5. Curious George

    Curious George Veteran Member

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    So the belief in the Christian God and Jesus are the only issues on which you could not accept an alternative view?
     
  6. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon Veteran Member
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    My unwavering support of science to interpret and understand the nature of our physical existence. The knowledge is, of course subject to change over time as new discoveries and knowledge is revealed.
     
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  7. David T

    David T Well-Known Member
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    The Size of my hands damn it.
     
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  8. Evangelicalhumanist

    Evangelicalhumanist "Truth" isn't a thing...
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    None, a humanist who doesn't even worship humans
    That, of course, and...

    Personal liberty for each human to live as they see fit, within the context of each human granting that same right to others (that is, if I would not grant you that right, then it seems I should forfeit my own). That is the essential core of Humanism, to me.
     
  9. LuisDantas

    LuisDantas Aura of atheification
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    Tricky question. Maybe I am unusual in this sense, but it takes a modicum of sympathy for me to acknowledge a stance as worth of being called wrong. I tend to forget all about the issues that I truly disapprove of.

    Still, there are easily several. Out of the top of my mind:


    Trickle down economics.

    Divine right claims, including theocratic systems.

    Nationalism in any way, shape or form.

    Blood relationship privilege.

    Opposition to same sex marriage (or to LGBTQ+ rights generally).
     
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  10. MonkeyFire

    MonkeyFire Well-Known Member

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    Belief in life.
     
  11. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
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    Religion was created so I could order MY life to please God, not so I could force anyone to follow me.
     
  12. Curious George

    Curious George Veteran Member

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    But would you be okay with legalized slavery? What legalized canabilism? Surely your belief in God is not the only thing on which you are unwavering.

    I think we all have a list of issues which are a consequence of our core beliefs, and are too numerous to name. Still, we should be able to articulate some issues if not the principles on which those issues are based.
     
  13. Curious George

    Curious George Veteran Member

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    Could you elaborate?
     
  14. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
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    Curious that you should ask that. Upon some reflection, there are certain moral issues that seem to be implanted in me by my culture, though America has a poor record on discrimination and slavery. And, it was actually Africans who captured Africans and sold them to slavers. I don't know the history well, but apparently Europe stopped slavery and then England did some 65 (?) years before America did. I was recently looking at a YouTube Video where the speaker asserted that slavery was not the actual cause of the Civil War. It is likely that I will not have answers for all your questions.
     
  15. Curious George

    Curious George Veteran Member

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    Interesting, but do you have any answers?

    Can you think of any issue for which you could not accept society accepting?
     
  16. Axe Elf

    Axe Elf Prophet

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    I thought I was already pretty clear; I'm not sure I can elaborate. The issues for which I cannot even allow for the possibility that someone could legitimately come to a different conclusion are largely matters of (what I would call) fact; not opinions--of which issues that people hold to on moral grounds are a subset. Opinions about morality are not objective facts, so there is always room for someone to legitimately come to a different conclusion than mine.
     
  17. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
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    Often I don't abide by American cultural norms. I'm frustrated that Evolution and Theology are not taught side by side in a reasonable, conciliatory way. So many, on either side are so absolutist that it is sickening, and to me simply indicates a lack of intelligence. It is sad that truthfulness is not more important, with people on both sides of any issue are willing to disassemble so as to completely obscure the truth.
     
  18. Curious George

    Curious George Veteran Member

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    But you would be able to accept any moral opinion? There are not subjects for which you would fight tooth and nail to oppose?
     
  19. Axe Elf

    Axe Elf Prophet

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    Like I said, unless they were opinions I had not heard or considered before, I would not accept them as my own--I think I have already developed the best belief system that I could for myself from among the opinions I have already evaluated. But I can't imagine "fighting tooth and nail" to oppose someone else from reaching their own legitimate opinion.

    For that matter, I don't fight tooth and nail to oppose someone from simply being incorrect on matters of fact, either. If they are unresponsive to evidence and reason, I merely dismiss them as a fool. Dismissing others as fools is almost a required skill to cultivate if you are to spend much time on these forums without going insane from their incessant prattling of nonsense.
     
  20. Curious George

    Curious George Veteran Member

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    I suppose the idea is that society accepts one view and you are left disagreeing. If this was a relatively mundane issue most would still accept it. However, certain issues I would assume are totally unacceptable for others. While I imagine there are plenty our there that would not really fight for, or against, anything, i am surprised to hear that you are one.
     
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