Non-believer go to hell, who's fault?

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Title.

Edit: If you think anyone is at fault, explanation is welcome.

I don't know what facts you're assuming, so I can't answer.

That being said, responsibility isn't a zero-sum game. I use an "if but for..." test for responsibility: If but for some act by an intelligent agent, consequence X would not have happened, and the intelligent agent chose to do the act knowing what the outcome would be, then the agent is responsible for consequence X. This approach might mean that more than one (or many) people/agents are responsible for a consequence. It can also mean that one agent is responsible for an act that was directly carried out by another intelligent agent.

 

[Revoltingest]

Other: I am a Christian, but my doctrine says people go to Heaven because of their merits, not because of their faith. So I don't see why atheists shouldn't go to Heaven

Just lock up the good booze, & keep a watchful eye on your puppies.

Anyway, if there were gods, it would be their fault for sending me to Hell.
Why?
- They're the ones doing the sending. They could choose otherwise, after all.
- I have no choice but to be a disbeliever. There's no way I could believe in some detailed mythology which totally lacks evidence.
If my salvation depends upon believing that Jesus rides a golden unicorn with Muhammad in a chocolate sidecar, then I'm doomed.

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

I pick God. Too many wish to believe God is devoid of responsibilities for His creations. Unbelievers see no evidence of God. Even Gideon, IIRC, tests God to make sure it was really God giving him commands. God doesn't strike him down for this. He goes along with it ... at least a couple of times.

 

[Estro Felino]

I want to say that it is obviously the commies' fault.

But in a slightly more serious vein, a hell that is designed to target nonbelievers can only be the mark of a very poorly designed theology.

We can also say it otherwise. From a philosophical point of view, the belief according to which salvation is attained through faith in a god is against logic and against reason.
It is more logical to believe that salvation is attained through merits, regardless of personal beliefs.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

We can also say it otherwise. From a philosophical point of view, the belief according to which salvation is attained through faith in a god is against logic and against reason.
It is more logical to believe that salvation is attained through merits, regardless of personal beliefs.

OTOH, it's also illogical that a creator who wants his creation to end up in Heaven would craft any of his creation so that they're unable to do so. If we're the creations of God, then our failings are God's failings.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

One cannot reject something one does not believe exists.

Pass that along. Not loud enough.

 

[RamaRaksha]

Based on my own NDE...

The reason people go to Hell, is through not following Oneness, and instead serving their own Ego's to the point of becoming horrid inside...

As for all this believer BS, it hasn't got that much to do with it; other than the complete denial of needing to repent for being an arsehole....Which many religious people make excuses about as well.

Exactly how does your repenting help the victim? Crying some croc tears of remorse does nothing for the victim. And repent for what? Which side are you on on the issue of abortion? How about gays?
The amazing thing for me is that how easy it is to condemn fellow human beings - these are people with loving families, children and yet you so callously condemn them - just because a religion says so, no different from how Christianity and Hitler condemned the jews

 

[RamaRaksha]

To me the question scares me - how easy it is to condemn fellow human beings - these are our friends, co-workers, people with loved ones, raising families and yet because they don't believe(swear loyalty to the strong man) they must be punished. Primitive backward ideas of swearing loyalty to the king, and those that do not must be cast out. We are still stuck with these primitive ideas. No wonder Jews were almost eliminated, no wonder the likes of ISIS think they are right in killing christians - these are the same sick ideas

 

[Servant_of_the_One1]

Nonbelievers is to blame themselves for being in hellfire.

 

[amorphous_constellation]

I for one blame the Jews.

I thought they didn't have hell?

 

[LuisDantas]

Nonbelievers is to blame themselves for being in hellfire.

That would be odd for so many different reasons at the same time!

 

[LuisDantas]

I thought they didn't have hell?

They must have exported all of it.

 

[amorphous_constellation]

They must have exported all of it.

I thought it was more likely imported to them with with the New Testament.

 

[wizanda]

The amazing thing for me is that how easy it is to condemn fellow human beings - these are people with loving families, children and yet you so callously condemn them - just because a religion says so, no different from how Christianity and Hitler condemned the jews

First off my statements are based on first hand experience of the afterlife.... So I'm not condemning anyone like a religion does.... Just saying this is what happens.

Exactly how does your repenting help the victim? Crying some croc tears of remorse does nothing for the victim. And repent for what?

We're to repent for not living a life of Oneness, so if we hurt people we recognize the ramifications of every action we've ever done.

When shown the brutal truth of how it has affected other people, often that is enough for some to want to remain in Hell, as they hate their own inner reflection so much....

In Heaven everything is Oneness, so all stains upon a person soul are so clear, you wouldn't want to be there, unless you've changed within towards the light.

Repentance originally meant to turn away from our wicked ways, and turn towards what is good.... It isn't about saying a crocodile sorry.

Which side are you on on the issue of abortion? How about gays?

I'm quite open minded to both; yet a person will be judged by the judgements they place on others....

So if someone thinks abortion is wrong, then they end up in hell, as they judge themselves evil for it, then they will repent of it, as it is a stain on their own soul.

Don't think God cares about gays, else he wouldn't have developed a reality where it is possible in many different species...

God cares about our heart, the reasons and intent behind something; basically if it is following Oneness or Ego.

 

[serp777]

Its a way of intimidating ignorant gullible peasants and it works quite well. What could be more persuasive then everyone telling you about eternal torture of the greatest magnitude. Truly hell would be the most sadistic, the most disgusting, the most unjust, the most over the top, ridiculous, and insane way of dealing with sinners. Even Hitler doesn't deserve eternal torture. Maybe he deserves 1000 years of torture or something but eternal torture is infinite.

 

[Estro Felino]

We're to repent for not living a life of Oneness, so if we hurt people we recognize the ramifications of every action we've ever done.

People are totally unable to figure out that when they hurt someone else, they are hurting themselves.
That's why they judge themselves with much more clemency than when they judge others.
Given that they are not able to reach this high degree of awareness, they will never get what you mean by Oneness.

 

[Useless2015]

Other: I am a Christian, but my doctrine says people go to Heaven because of their merits, not because of their faith. So I don't see why atheists shouldn't go to Heaven

What doctrine is that? I am one hundred percent sure that Jesus talked about non-believers going to hell. Where do you get your doctrine from? Made it up yourself?

 

[Thanda]

This is actually a bad question as it is somewhat vague. As a result it is causing a bit of confusion.

The way the term belief as it is often used in the Bible and the way most people understand it today is usually very different.

In the Bible belief pretty much amounts to trust. As such it is not merely an academic exercise. If I call you and tell you to come and get $1000 from me: if you believe or trust me you will come and if you don't you will not.
Thus according to the Bible a person who believes is someone who keeps the commandments of God and a non-believer is a person who does not keep God's commandments.

Jesus explained that a person will keep the commandments of God if they love him. So love of God (which includes trusting him) leads a person to keep God's commandments.
So why do some people not love God? Well there are two main reasons. For one it could be that they don't know about him. The other is that they don't believe He can help them.

The first reason is easy to resolve so we can safely assume no one will ever go to hell for not knowing that God exists. The other is much harder to solve as it requires willingness from the non-believer himself.
For example some people believe everyone should be able to live their lives the way they want to without judgement. Thus the idea of a God who has commandments repulses them and they refuse to entertain the idea.

Others believe they know better than God so that even if they believe God exists they think he really knows everything about everything. They believe that sometimes their solutions are better than God's solutions or that God will not know the answer to a particular question they have. Many Christians fall into this trap. Unfortunately the only way out of their Non-belief is for them to take a leap of faith and do what God commands they do in a particular situation so they can learn for themselves that God really does know all things.

I could mention other things but all in all my point is that the type of unbelief that gets people into hell is not the accidental type. It is willful type of unbelief.

 

[Estro Felino]

What doctrine is that? I am one hundred percent sure that Jesus talked about non-believers going to hell. Where do you get your doctrine from? Made it up yourself?

Well...good point. We Pelagians do not think that St. Paul was right, when he talked about grace. We just hear from Jesus' parables, and through them we can easily (and without doubts) understand that men save themselves through their merits. Besides, Jesus Himself said: you will perform even greater miracles than mine.

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

What doctrine is that? I am one hundred percent sure that Jesus talked about non-believers going to hell. Where do you get your doctrine from? Made it up yourself?

If you did your neighbor bad, kiss and make up or you'll pay for it later -- Jesus