Friend of Mara
Active Member
As the title says. Every worker should at least have the opportunity to be part of a union. Discuss.
Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
You guys don’t have that?As the title says. Every worker should at least have the opportunity to be part of a union. Discuss.
A great dues collection racket. Special interest and lobbying opportunities for bought and paid for politicians who honor favors for votes.As the title says. Every worker should at least have the opportunity to be part of a union. Discuss.
What's not to love?
I don't believe that for a moment.I have never had a position that was unionised.
If I did not like the terms on offer I went elsewhere.
I found union rules and conditions worse than I could negotiate for myself.
It comes down to both sides' BATNA.How ever unions are good for people where individual negotiation is out of the question. It makes life easier for both employer and employee.
"Unionized" does not have to mean "confrontational.'But like businesses,, unions, are only as good as the people running them.
Often that is just confrontational and worse than useless.
I don't believe that for a moment.
It comes down to both sides' BATNA.
When the negotiation is between you the individual worker and an employee, your BATNA is very weak: if you walk away from the job, you lose your entire livelihood. OTOH, the employer's BATNA is generally very strong: without that individual position filled, they'll probably be able to get along okay until they fill it.
With a union that has the power to strike and has a decent strike fund, suddenly the BATNA changes: the workers' livelihood isn't on the line (if the strike is short or the strike fund is large), so your BATNA as a worker is improved. And the employer's BATNA is worsened, since the union has the power to stop the employer's operations altogether with a strike.
All else being equal, this shift in power will lead to better negotiated outcones for the workers.
"Unionized" does not have to mean "confrontational.'
That is an atypical situation. Unions on average have better working condition and significantly better pay. They also are fired less. ll.I have never had a position that was unionised.
If I did not like the terms on offer I went elsewhere.
I found union rules and conditions worse than I could negotiate for myself.
I can agree that there may be bad unions. Lets take a union I dislike for example. The police unions. They have definitely taken it a step too far and while I don't think it should be abolished it should be re-worked. There should be some sort of system that keeps a pulse on unions as well as rules for them as well. I think by extension the leadership of a union should ALWAYS come from the population rather than an external or outside leadership. They should be democratically elected by the workers that they represent and should be subject to removal by democratic means as well.How ever unions are good for people where individual negotiation is out of the question. It makes life easier for both employer and employee.
But like businesses,, unions, are only as good as the people running them.
Often that is just confrontational and worse than useless.
How is this literally any different than the current system except unions also get a slice of the pie not just corporations?A great dues collection racket. Special interest and lobbying opportunities for bought and paid for politicians who honor favors for votes.
What's not to love?
We disagree on almost as much as we agree sometimes. But I got to tell you I do respect the rebel outcast vibe you got. If it is any consolation I don't want forced unionization. I just want it to be universally optional. More choices. Not less.Never been in the Boy Scouts.
Never been in the military.
Never been in a parade.
And never been in a union.
All that uniform wearing & thinking alike & tribalism...ugh.
Unions generally suck in my experience.As the title says. Every worker should at least have the opportunity to be part of a union. Discuss.
Did you not enjoy the increased pay and benefits?Unions generally suck in my experience.
Actually the union jobs are the only ones where I had to work forced overtime.Did you not enjoy the increased pay and benefits?
Both the GDP and production have outpaced inflation over the last 30 years. However wages have not? Why do you think they are not needed? Right to work states have been stomping out every opportunity to increase wages or worker conditions. If from the 90's median household income and simply stayed with inflation we would have over 100k as the median. If it had stayed in pace with production value of labor since the 90's it would be nearly 200k an average household.Actually the union jobs are the only ones where I had to work forced overtime.
And it seems to me it kind of enhances the pecking order, everything becomes about seniority.
But that was just my experience.
The unions were needed in thier day... Now in this country we have so many regulations every business is supposed to follow, I'm not really sure how much they help.
Oh I thought you wanted an opinions based on experiences in unions. I'm not the math guy, I just know what I like. I will say that since I've been self-employed, I get a lot of breaks, and nobody complains if I'm on the phone, but my boss is a real slave driver.Both the GDP and production have outpaced inflation over the last 30 years. However wages have not? Why do you think they are not needed? Right to work states have been stomping out every opportunity to increase wages or worker conditions. If from the 90's median household income and simply stayed with inflation we would have over 100k as the median. If it had stayed in pace with production value of labor since the 90's it would be nearly 200k an average household.
Being self employed can definitely be better than being in a union. But being in a union is better than being in a non-unionized workforce such as mcdonalds, walmart, amazon ect.Oh I thought you wanted an opinions based on experiences in unions. I'm not the math guy, I just know what I like. I will say that since I've been self-employed, I get a lot of breaks, and nobody complains if I'm on the phone, but my boss is a real slave driver.
It's the special interest and lobbying associated with unions that I have a contention with.How is this literally any different than the current system except unions also get a slice of the pie not just corporations?