New Frubal?

[sun rise]

Abstract because there was no proposed frubal so people including me assumed something. I personally assumed something similar to the Facebook "care" image which is not what you clearly want.

 

[Trailblazer]

I don't get it. If someone says they want to pray for me, its their time, their effort.... it hurts and bothers me 000000%

It doesn't bother you, but since we are all different, it bothers other people
It bothers me and I am a believer.

 

[SalixIncendium]

Part of the problem is that the discussion is very abstract. If there were a few real candidates for a new frubal and a vote that allowed "I like", "I don't like" "I can live with" and maybe other choices we might wind up with a different situation.

Bollocks.

Very few, if any, asked for any details. Nearly everyone that participated in this thread passed judgment based on their own preconceived notions of what such frubals might be.

 

[We Never Know]

It doesn't bother you, but since we are all different, it bothers other people
It bothers me and I am a believer.

I see it no different than someone saying good luck, best wishes, etc.

 

[SalixIncendium]

It doesn't bother you, but since we are all different, it bothers other people
It bothers me and I am a believer.

Why does it bother you?

 

[sun rise]

Bollocks.

Very few, if any, asked for any details. Nearly everyone that participated in this thread passed judgment based on their own preconceived notions of what such frubals might be.

I assumed it was a general idea and that if people like it then details would happen later.

 

[Rival]

Abstract because there was no proposed frubal so people including me assumed something. I personally assumed something similar to the Facebook "care" image which is not what you clearly want.

Most of us here aren't even on Facebook. I have never had an account there.

But the OP clearly says 'prayer'. I mean, what on earth did you think that would look like?

 

[sun rise]

But the OP clearly says 'prayer'. I mean, what on earth did you think that would look like?

The OP said "prayer/well wishes". I had in the past suggested something which basically was ignored at the time outside of a pro-forma response https://www.religiousforums.com/threads/request-for-new-post-reaction-care.273161/ so I naturally assumed a followup. I also posted some-serious "suggestions" such as the "coexist" image of many religions which did not get a staff response which again reinforced my sense that this was a vague proposal.

I certainly did not take "prayer" to be explicitly theistic. In my universe "prayer" is not a ritual tied to religion. "Have a nice day" is to me a prayer because "prayer" after all has two different meanings:

• a religious service, especially a regular one, at which people gather in order to pray together.
  "500 people were detained as they attended Friday prayers"
• an earnest hope or wish.
  "it is our prayer that the current progress on human rights will be sustained"

But now I have the strong sense that you all have something very specific in mind and wanted a general buy-in before revealing it.

At this point, you will do whatever you want. I'm done with this thread.

 

[Rival]

But now I have the strong sense that you all have something very specific in mind and wanted a general buy-in before revealing it.

Err, what? We're not some clandestine organisation. We were pretty clear that 'prayer' is involved and the forum is called 'religious forums'. It's not difficult to work out what that might mean. If someone had asked us we'd have said it looks like this , which is exactly what @SalixIncendium said pages back, and then people lost their minds.

 

[VoidCat]

Ive asked for prayers on here before. Maybe that thread was the one who inspired this frubal idea. Honestly I see no issue with a prayer frubal. At first my knee jerk reaction was no but I didn't know why it's just that was my knee jerk reaction to the frubal. But after thought i realized there was no reason for me to oppose the idea. Why would me asking for prayers be fine but a rating is not? That's a strange contradiction and i may have to analyze why i had an issue to begin with.

 

[VoidCat]

Ive asked for prayers on here before. Maybe that thread was the one who inspired this frubal idea. Honestly I see no issue with a prayer frubal. At first my knee jerk reaction was no but I didn't know why it's just that was my knee jerk reaction to the frubal. But after thought i realized there was no reason for me to oppose the idea. Why would me asking for prayers be fine but a rating is not? That's a strange contradiction and i may have to analyze why i had an issue to begin with.

I'd like folk to think on this. If someone asked for prayers would it offend y'all? If not then why is there an issue with the rating?

 

[Rival]

Ive asked for prayers on here before. Maybe that thread was the one who inspired this frubal idea. Honestly I see no issue with a prayer frubal. At first my knee jerk reaction was no but I didn't know why it's just that was my knee jerk reaction to the frubal. But after thought i realized there was no reason for me to oppose the idea. Why would me asking for prayers be fine but a rating is not? That's a strange contradiction and i may have to analyze why i had an issue to begin with.

It was your thread. I just wanted to be able to give it a rating, then realised we didn't have one, so brought it up to Staff.

So we put it to the membership and then everything just kind of exploded.

 

[VoidCat]

It was your thread. I just wanted to be able to give it a rating, then realised we didn't have one, so brought it up to Staff.

So we put it to the membership and then everything just kind of exploded.

It may be an autonomy thing thinking on it. Asking for prayers the person is autonomously giving consent. Some folk view you dont pray for someone without that persons consent. Doing so is trying to cause change in that persons life without them saying thats ok.

Maybe folk feel giving a frubal like that takes away their ability to consent to that prayer?

 

[Rival]

It may be an autonomy thing thinking on it. Asking for prayers the person is autonomously giving consent. Some folk view you dont pray for someone without that persons consent. Doing so is trying to cause change in that persons life without them saying thats ok.

Maybe folk feel giving a frubal like that takes away their ability to consent to that prayer?

Here in the UK I've never really seen people be bothered by this.

 

[VoidCat]

Here in the UK I've never really seen people be bothered by this.

Folk may have a lot of religious trauma. It's mostly christians who pray for folk without asking that person for consent. often where i live its often done in ways like I'll pray you'll turn to God and such. They may say I'll pray you change your lifestyle. It's not all christians that are like that but many folk have trauma surrounding this. Where their relatives who are not ok with them will offer to pray for them and try to change things they arent ok with.

Heck ive had this experience with folk praying God will get rid of my autism...i don't want that.

Me personally i feel I can use all the help i can get. Pray for my wellbeing to whoever you like. If it's something that can harm me or i dont want changed im sure the god you asking knows this.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

Folk may have a lot of religious trauma. It's mostly christians who pray for folk without asking that person for consent. often where i live its often done in ways like I'll pray you'll turn to God and such. They may say I'll pray you change your lifestyle. It's not all christians that are like that but many folk have trauma surrounding this. Where their relatives who are not ok with them will offer to pray for them and try to change things they arent ok with.

Heck ive had this experience with folk praying God will get rid of my autism...i don't want that.

Me personally i feel I can use all the help i can get. Pray for my wellbeing to whoever you like. If it's something that can harm me or i dont want changed im sure the god you asking knows this.

I think that you're a kind person with a good heart, VoidCat. I'd also like to say that you are spot on about the religious trauma.

My response in a spin-off thread:

I Will Pray for You

I'm gay, and I've been told by people I know that they'll pray for me in a context that makes it clear that they're praying for me to be straight or "repent" of my "lifestyle." That's annoying, since there's nothing wrong with gayness. If people say they'll pray for me with genuine good will...

www.religiousforums.com

 

[VoidCat]

I think that you're a kind person with a good heart, VoidCat. I'd also like to say that you are spot on about the religious trauma.

My response in a spin-off thread:

I Will Pray for You

I'm gay, and I've been told by people I know that they'll pray for me in a context that makes it clear that they're praying for me to be straight or "repent" of my "lifestyle." That's annoying, since there's nothing wrong with gayness. If people say they'll pray for me with genuine good will...

www.religiousforums.com

Praying can be a good thing and I dont see an issue with folk praying for others even without consent. It's a request mostly. It's often done with good intentions. Folk praying for healing for example. It's a shame folk have trauma surrounding it. In my opinion folk who are willing to pray for you to change things you arent ok with being changed will pray for you even without the prayer frubal. I'd prefer it to be there so that folk can see when folk are being supportive like praying for emotional and physical healing for example.

However I also see the argument with the idea this is a religious forum...some religious folk have a rule in their religion you dont pray without the person you praying for's consent. That prayers without consent violates autonomy. Some may say that the frubal shouldn't be there as a result. But folks beliefs differ. Many folk believe it's ok to pray without consent. And they likely will anyway. So there is an argument that it should be allowed as religious freedom does not dictate what others do. Only what you do.

Ill read your thread

 

[We Never Know]

Greetings RFians!

After receiving a suggestion for such, the staff have been considering adding a "prayers/well wishes" frubal. But, we wanted to get an idea about how the community felt about it.

We understand there are a lot of frubals already; there is an option in the poll for replacing the 'angry' frubal rather than just adding a new one.

Please let us know what you think!

After some thought... Just makes a **** happens frubal

Down on your luck, **** happens
Sick, **** happens
Whatever, **** happens

**** does happen so no one should be offended by it lol

 

[Trailblazer]

I see it no different than someone saying good luck, best wishes, etc.

There is a big difference since one involves God. That is why some of us object to prayer.

 

[We Never Know]

There is a big difference since one involves God. That is why some of us object to prayer.

Luck, wishes, a god. Its all in the mind.