My Comment On The Debate

[Friend of Mara]

The psychology of it is pretty simple - sociopathy. Those who enjoy the misery and suffering of others are sociopaths. It's a serious mental health condition that wreaks havoc in that person's life and more significantly in the lives of those around them. In that regard, some measure of understanding is warranted; they are deficient in the social and moral reasoning present in most people.

To be clear here - not everyone who delights in the misery of others would qualify as a sociopath. Like anything related to mental health, there's a spectrum from absent to extreme. The prevalence rate of sociopathy is estimated at around 5% of the population, so a lot of what is going on here is instead manifestations of in-group and out-group dynamics or simple cultural differences. Yet there is the slice of people who are just sociopaths. Our president is one of them. That's worth keeping in mind when attempting to listen to their bile.

It does go back to the monkey brain part of our psyche. That if you are big and standoffish you are strong. They want a big daddy strong man who simultaneously validates their hatred towards other people. That hatred is rooted in personal insecurity. That insecurity that is appealed to specifically ticks with men who feel emasculated. I don't want to put any more specific claims on it but it seems to pan out when you look at the voter demograpic information from 2016. Men voted in favor of Trump overall. Women voted for Clinton. If you shape it by race and gender Black Women voted for Trump by less than 2 percent. Perhaps even lower since the range of error is 2 percent. But white men voted for Trump 62% of the time. The highest demographic that voted for Trump was uneducated white voters at 64% (a whole whopping 44% of the total electorate which is kinda scary. Especially when we think that they get a disproportionately high voting power due to the EC). Too bad they didn't split it into specifically uneducated white men because that would probably top 70% (though this is speculation since we do not have that data)

Chart for reference.

 

[LightofTruth]

I'm bored by Biden, already! He's a life-long empty suit. A political toady that's done the bidding of his rich benefactors his entire career. He's basically a moderate republican, and has voted as a moderate republican, consistently, his whole career. He voted against raising the minimum wage, every time. Against raising social security, every time. He is against medicare for all. He was against Obama's attempt at achieving universal health care. He voted in favor of every military action that's ever come up for approval. And he's done nothing and said nothing about the wholesale legalized bribery of our legislature, of which he is a member. And he voted against any and all attempts in the past at stopping it.

The best we can hope fro from Biden is that he will hold things together until someone better comes along. Or until the plutocrats and their republican stooges regroup, and stage another all-out assault on democracy, again.

The legalized bribery of our legislature is the whole problem with this country.

 

[PureX]

The legalized bribery of our legislature is the whole problem with this country.

It is what's driving us into the abyss. And yet there is almost no politician of either party even willing to speak of it. That's how powerful and pervasive that bribery really is.

 

[Father Heathen]

If Trump doesn't win we'll all get bored by Biden and want another Trump.

Uh, no. I'll taking boring over a disasterous dumpster fire any day. Some of us actually prefer that our country be intact and on track. If you want garbage go visit a landfill rather than ruin the country for the rest of us.

 

[MNoBody]

Uh, no. I'll taking boring over a disasterous dumpster fire any day. Some of us actually prefer that our country be intact and on track. If you want garbage go visit a landfill rather than ruin the country for the rest of us.

too late, the new deal trashed the place....totally FUBAR. just a slow demise.

 

[LightofTruth]

It is what's driving us into the abyss. And yet there is almost no politician of either party even willing to speak of it. That's how powerful and pervasive that bribery really is.

They owe their wealth to legalized bribery. Why should they speak out against. And the people just let it continue. But there's no answer for it. The odds are, if they did away with it, then it'd be more corrupt.

 

[Father Heathen]

God said that He rules in the kingdoms of men and sets over them whomsoever He wills. And that they are the basest of men. Daniel 4:17

The word "basest" means "the lowest".

If he wants a part in the process he can apply for citizenship, and then if granted go register to vote.

 

[LightofTruth]

If he wants a part in the process he can apply for citizenship, and then if granted go register to vote.

They could have no power whatsoever if it had not been given to them from above. (John 19:11)

Except they don't realize that. They take too much pride in themselves to acknowledge that any success they seem to be having ought to go back to where it really comes from. They ought to give the glory to God.

But instead, the success they have is owed to the cash contributors. And if they weren't the lowest of men to begin with, then they'd never get elected.

 

[Revoltingest]

The thing people don't realize is that a lot of Trump's supporters LIKE that whole 'obnoxious bullyboy' shtick. They've been listening to Rush Limbaugh railing against liberals and democrats for decades, and they loved Bill O'Reilly when he would shout down his opponents and turn off their mikes. There are countless 'conservative' media blowhards on TV and radio both nationally and locally spewing the same petty, insulting, dishonest, boorish nonsense as we saw Trump spewing last night. And all these media bullyboys (and girls) have their audiences. People tune in for it, because they LIKE it. And these same people like Trump when he does it. And the more outraged the rest of us, the better they like it.

Don't ask me to explain the psychology, because I can't. All I know is that they are angry, and they like seeing their favorite scapegoats for that anger being treated badly, publicly. They like seeing them being shouted down, and talked over and badgered and humiliated. It's what all these "conservative" media 'talk' shows are all about. They feed these people's anger and resentment to get their eyes and ears on the advertising. And there's big bucks in it or they wouldn't be doing it.

It's basically the only game Trump knows how to play. It's the only show he's capable of putting on. And so he does. Because it works. Like it or not, there are a significant number of our fellow citizens who get excited by this sort of ugly spectacle. And they will consider last night's "debate" a win for Trump. They will see Biden and the press as having been abused and humiliated by Trump and they'll love him for it.
And I think these people have always been among us. We just hadn't noticed them so much, before, until the media and the republican party realized that there were enough of them to be worth capitalizing on, and that they were easy to manipulate because they operate on emotion, rather than reason.

Was last night's debate really that different from a Jerry Springer Show? Or a Bill O'Reilly Show? Or a Rush Limbaugh Show? Or any of a hundred similar media productions intended to stir up people's outrage and indignation for fun, fame, and profit? It's been big business in this country for 40 years, now. Are we really that surprised to see in this context?

I think you have it all wrong.
Trump wasn't playing a strategy.
He was just being himself.....IMO.
Winning over the undecided was his job.
What he did (from all reports) predictably failed.

 

[PureX]

They owe their wealth to legalized bribery. Why should they speak out against. And the people just let it continue. But there's no answer for it. The odds are, if they did away with it, then it'd be more corrupt.

We still have a recourse, but unfortunately they have us way too divided to ever enact it. That is that we need to uniformly vote out every incumbent candidate in every election, regardless of party affiliation, unless and until we get people in office that ACT (not just talk) to stop the legalized bribery. It's the literally the only way short of a bloody revolution to take control of our government back from the wealthy corporate conglomerates that now totally control it.

If we did manage to succeed in doing this, we would then have to constantly hold the threat of being un-elected over their heads, to keep them acting on behalf of their constituents instead of on behalf of the cronies that supported and ran their campaigns. But we would also need to be willing to reward those who do act on behalf of their constituents with re-election. It means we need to pay constant attention, and be willing to vote for the well-being of EACH OTHER, and not just for our own petty concerns. One of the reasons we're in this mess is that way too many of us go into the voting booth looking to further our own petty agendas. Abortion, taxation, social biases, religious biases, ethnic biases; these are issues that divide us against each other and allow for all that corruption to find a foothold. When we deliberately vote for candidates that promise to stack the courts with biased judges, we get biased, unjust, courts. When we deliberately vote for candidates that promise to oppress certain segments of the citizenry, we get an oppressive, unjust, government. When we deliberately vote for candidates that we know are corrupt because we think their opponent is even more corrupt, we will inevitably get corrupt politicians in office. We have to stop voting for the lesser of two evils, and DEMAND accountability. From them, but also from ourselves.

Our government does not have to be dysfunctional and corrupt. It was not always so, and it need not always be so. But WE have to be the overseers. WE have to think about the well-being of each other when we vote, and not just our own. Integrity begins with us. Then we can demand it from our politicians.

 

[PureX]

I think you have it all wrong.
Trump wasn't playing a strategy.
He was just being himself.....IMO.

I never implied otherwise. But what he is, 'plays' to his base, and he knows it. It's about all he knows. And it's all that matters to him. He's incapable of doing anything else.

Winning over the undecided was his job.
What he did (from all reports) predictably failed.

That was only his job according to the republican party; that wants him to win no matter what so they can retain their influence and control, and abuse it as they see fit. But Trump isn't a republican. Or a democrat. He's a narcissistic sociopath. He is a member of the Trump party, only. And the Trump party agenda was being fulfilled by his boorish behavior in the debate. He does not have the capacity to care about those "undecided voters". In Trumplandia, there is only himself, and his imagined throng of adoring fans. And no one else matters.

 

[Revoltingest]

It does go back to the monkey brain part of our psyche. That if you are big and standoffish you are strong. They want a big daddy strong man who simultaneously validates their hatred towards other people. That hatred is rooted in personal insecurity. That insecurity that is appealed to specifically ticks with men who feel emasculated.

I get to offer some pop psychology too....
Democrats offer security, & control over scary things like the
economy, big corporations, health care, employment, etc.
They tend to see the President as a parental figure who'll
protect & care for them. This explains why they focus so
much more on the President's personality & behavior than
on actual public policy. They want someone to respect,
love, & admire.

 

[PureX]

I get to offer some pop psychology too....
Democrats offer security, & control over scary things like the
economy, big corporations, health care, employment, etc.
They tend to see the President as a parental figure who'll
protect & care for them. This explains why they focus so
much more on the President's personality & behavior than
on actual public policy. They want someone to respect,
love, & admire.

How dare they desire a 'leader' that would represent their well-being in the face of corporate greed, military avarice, systemic corruption and incompetence, and the misfortunes of fate!

How DARE they!

 

[LightofTruth]

We still have a recourse, but unfortunately they have us way too divided to ever enact it. That is that we need to uniformly vote out every incumbent candidate in every election, regardless of party affiliation, unless and until we get people in office that ACT (not just talk) to stop the legalized bribery. It's the literally the only way short of a bloody revolution to take control of our government back from the wealthy corporate conglomerates that now totally control it.

If we did manage to succeed in doing this, we would then have to constantly hold the threat of being un-elected over their heads, to keep them acting on behalf of their constituents instead of on behalf of the cronies that supported and ran their campaigns. But we would also need to be willing to reward those who do act on behalf of their constituents with re-election. It means we need to pay constant attention, and be willing to vote for the well-being of EACH OTHER, and not just for our own petty concerns. One of the reasons we're in this mess is that way too many of us go into the voting booth looking to further our own petty agendas. Abortion, taxation, social biases, religious biases, ethnic biases; these are issues that divide us against each other and allow for all that corruption to find a foothold. When we deliberately vote for candidates that promise to stack the courts with biased judges, we get biased courts. When we deliberately vote for candidates that promise to oppress certain segments of the citizenry, we get an oppressive, unjust, government. We we vote for candidates are we know are corrupt because we thing their opponent is even more corrupt, we will inevitably get corrupt politicians. We have to stop voting for the lesser of two evils, and DEMAND accountability. From them, but also from ourselves.

Our government does not have to be dysfunctional and corrupt. It was not always so, and it need not always be so. But WE have to be the overseers. WE have to think about the well-being of each other when we vote, and not just our own. Integrity begins with us. Then we can demand it from our politicians.

That's a wonderful idea. But I don't feel very optimistic.

 

[PureX]

That's a wonderful idea. But I don't feel very optimistic.

Now you see why keeping us divided against each other is so important to those who are exploiting all this corruption. It impedes the one means we still have of ending the corruption.

 

[Revoltingest]

How dare they desire a 'leader' that would represent their well-being in the face of corporate greed, military avarice, systemic corruption and incompetence, and the misfortunes of fate!

How DARE they!

The point is that they want a parental figure taking care of them.

 

[LightofTruth]

Now you see why keeping us divided against each other is so important to those who are exploiting all this corruption. It impedes the one means we still have of ending the corruption.

There's always going to be division when people have different ideas about things. Nowhere is that more evident than religion and politics. The only answer I can see is for the great majority to have the same ideas. If there truly is a best way, then that way must be agreed upon by everyone. it must become clearly evident for all to see.

True or pure religion and true or pure politics comes when all speak the same language of agreement.

 

[PureX]

The point is that they want a parental figure taking care of them.

The point is that they want someone in charge that represents the needs and desires of the people, rather than the needs and desire of the wealthy elite. You can characterize that in as childish a way as you want, but it's not an unreasonable expectation. It is, after all, the purpose of those elected to office in a representational democracy. Which we used to have, more or less, before we became the corrupt plutocracy that we are, now.

 

[PureX]

There's always going to be division when people have different ideas about things. Nowhere is that more evident than religion and politics. The only answer I can see is for the great majority to have the same ideas. If there truly is a best way, then that way must be agreed upon by everyone. it must become clearly evident for all to see.

True or pure religion and true or pure politics comes when all speak the same language of agreement.

Unfortunately, the last time that happened in the U.S. was after a generation had faced both the Great Depression and WW2, together, which unified them against the would-be plutocrats and fascists among us, so as to reign them in. Unfortunately, too, that generation has died off and did not successfully teach the lesson of unity against greed and oppression to their offspring. And now we are right back to where we were 100+ years ago.

 

[Trailblazer]

If Trump doesn't win we'll all get bored by Biden and want another Trump.

I'll never get THAT bored.