Massive star two and a half MILLION times as bright as sun...vanishes

[dad]

That's a perfect description of the bible.
It's an interesting book in its way. You really must have a look at it at some stage.

If you're a thoughtful person and interested in history and culture, you'd also enjoy the epic of Gilgamesh in Andrew George's excellent translation. It'll give you some of the background to the writing of the bible, not least a 'Noah' story much closer to the original.

Post flood pagan stories don't interest me, thanks.

 

[blü 2]

Post flood pagan stories don't interest me, thanks.

Religion as the straitjacket of the mind?

No, you can do better than that.

The truth about history will set you free.

 

[dad]

Religion as the straitjacket of the mind?

No, you can do better than that.

The truth about history will set you free.

The truth about the time near the tower of Babel incident is not known in secular history. I do not consider ignorance a beacon of truth light or freedom.

 

[blü 2]

The truth about the time near the tower of Babel incident is not known in secular history. I do not consider ignorance a beacon of truth light or freedom.

On the contrary the truth about the tower of Babel and its environs is reasonably well understood.

And all real history, by virtue of being real, is secular.

For example, if you want to test any statement for its truth, you need to compare it to reality; and the more accurately it conforms with reality, the truer it is.

So reality is where truth is found.

 

[Tiberius]

The fables of so called science that deal in origins are very devoutly believed in. You are a case in point. Rather than debate issues, you try to insult.

I've tried providing you with evidence. You ignore it. Why should I waste my time with you if you are just going to ignore what I have to say?

 

[dad]

On the contrary the truth about the tower of Babel and its environs is reasonably well understood.

No. Not true.

And all real history, by virtue of being real, is secular.

On the contrary. The history of man was never secular.

For example, if you want to test any statement for its truth, you need to compare it to reality; and the more accurately it conforms with reality, the truer it is.

Using the word reality does nothing to endear one to it.

So reality is where truth is found.

Science isn't about truth.

 

[dad]

I've tried providing you with evidence. You ignore it. Why should I waste my time with you if you are just going to ignore what I have to say?

Very tired joke.

Looking at the topic for example, link to where you offered evidence for the missing star that is 130 million times bigger than earth?

 

[blü 2]

The history of man was never secular.

But Yahweh didn't even exist until about 1500 BCE. History is much older than that ─ packed with gods and goddesses, indeed, but we have no evidence to suggest that creatures other than man think in terms of gods and goddesses, and the universe is maybe 200,000 times older than modern man.

Using the word reality does nothing to endear one to it.

But when you get the hang of it, it can be quite user-friendly. It's where coffee is found, for example.

Science isn't about truth.

Science is about exploring, describing and seeking to understand and explain reality. You state that you don't get on well with reality, but as I said, it's not too late to get the hang of it.

 

[halbhh]

Naturally, science is clueless as to why.

"From 2001 to 2011, the light from the galaxy consistently showed evidence that it hosted a 'luminous blue variable' star some 2.5 million times brighter than the Sun. Stars of this type are unstable, showing occasional dramatic shifts in their spectra and brightness. Even with those shifts, luminous blue variables leave specific traces scientists can identify, but they were absent from the data the team collected in 2019, leaving them to wonder what had happened to the star. "It would be highly unusual for such a massive star to disappear without producing a bright supernova explosion," says Allan."

A cosmic mystery: ESO telescope captures the disappearance of a massive star

Could it be their theories are wrong?

Ha

Well, in the first article I saw announcing this very shortly after it happened, was also the hypothesis of what happened.

But, you could have read about it ahead of time!

Depending on the quality of your news source.

https://phys.org/news/2020-06-black-hole-reveals-star-collapse.html

A small percentage of all stars were also found to rotate slowly enough—below the threshold for this gas stalling to occur—and could, indeed, collapse into black holes quietly.

So, you could have been entirely un-surprised, see.

 

[dad]

But Yahweh didn't even exist until about 1500 BCE. History is much older than that ─ packed with gods and goddesses, indeed, but we have no evidence to suggest that creatures other than man think in terms of gods and goddesses,

The existence of God did not start with when Israel needed a written record.

and the universe is maybe 200,000 times older than modern man.

Pick a number game, eh?

Science is about exploring, describing and seeking to understand and explain reality.

If that were true is would not be wrong much of the time on origin issues. If that were true it would have some basis other than a little bag of beliefs to use in explaining the unknown..

 

[dad]

Well, in the first article I saw announcing this very shortly after it happened, was also the hypothesis of what happened.

Of course they need to scramble to dig out possible reasons the unexpected disappearance of a star supposedly 130 millions times as big as earth vanished with no trace!

A small percentage of all stars were also found to rotate slowly enough—below the threshold for this gas stalling to occur—and could, indeed, collapse into black holes quietly.

Coulda woulda shoulda. So tell us if the massive bright star was to turn into a pumpkin suddenly or a black hole in this case, how long would it be before we saw evidence?

 

[halbhh]

Of course they need to scramble to dig out possible reasons the unexpected disappearance of a star supposedly 130 millions times as big as earth vanished with no trace!

Coulda woulda shoulda. So tell us if the massive bright star was to turn into a pumpkin suddenly or a black hole in this case, how long would it be before we saw evidence?

The time scale for that new relatively modest mass black hole to encounter another star or suck in a significant mass into an accretion disk? I'd guess that time scale is fairly long. Stars don't tend to collide much (but instead deflect each other onto new trajectories from a distance), and it takes a close approach for tidal forces to rip apart a star. But if a new black hole did encounter enough mass to create a new accretion disk and that accretion disk begin radiating, it would look like a significant new object showing up quickly I'd suppose.

Question: Does all of this stuff about stars ending their normal life and becoming a new object bother you? God made everything else in this universe to end in time naturally.

We should feel quite comfortable about novae, supernovae, flares.... Both as explainable, explained, and finally as not truly a threat to us, because of you know why....

Yes?

(Our sun flares at times....but, and this is very, very interesting: It flares significantly less than other stars of similar mass tend to flare.

Here's an accessible article on it:
Our sun is a weirdly 'quiet' star — and that's lucky for all of us | Space

That's so interesting. I think that's why we are here -- that's why this star we have helps make our Earth so well suited for us.)

 

[ecco]

We do know that stars are there for one thing, as signs to man. So when we see something unusual out there, it could be some sign. What that is would be something I would not know yet.

However, the star of Bethlehem appeared and vanished also. It had a known purpose.

I suppose if a modern cosmo scientist was transported back in time they might offer similar guesses as to why it vanished. 'Gee, maybe a black hole ate it'. Then when it reappears maybe something like 'gee, I guess it was really dust that covered it, and then went away' etc etc.

Speculating based on possible scientific concepts is better than believing something that comparatively ignorant people wrote 2000-3000 years ago.

But we all understand that you will not let science interfere with your deeply ingrained religious views. I'm willing to bet that you follow Trump's unscientific views regarding face masks (nah - no one needs to wear them) rather than the scientific views of Dr. Fauci. No face masks for Dad. Of course, it may just be that you are anxious to meet your maker.

 

[ecco]

We as in any person on earth.

But I wasn't talking to any person on earth. I was talking to you.

Why speculate?

Are you that afraid of being wrong?

 

[dad]

The time scale for that new relatively modest mass black hole to encounter another star or suck in a significant mass into an accretion disk? I'd guess that time scale is fairly long.

So God will likely have returned by then so science will never have the evidence. OK.

Stars don't tend to collide much (but instead deflect each other onto new trajectories from a distance), and it takes a close approach for tidal forces to rip apart a star.

Great, can you name one or two that were ripped apart this week? Or even this month? Let's make it easy, this year?

But if a new black hole did encounter enough mass to create a new accretion disk and that accretion disk begin radiating, it would look like a significant new object showing up quickly I'd suppose.

Quickly as in a million years? A thousand? Ten?

Question: Does all of this stuff about stars ending their normal life and becoming a new object bother you? God made everything else in this universe to end in time naturally.

Some stars just blink, so how would I know if this star might just go on again? Who says it is dead? Proof?

We should feel quite comfortable about novae, supernovae, flares.... Both as explainable, explained, and finally as not truly a threat to us, because of you know why....

I find is all just fine. What I do not like is the baseless belief based theories of godless science assigning false sizes and distances and years and origins every time they see anything out there.

(Our sun flares at times....but, and this is very, very interesting: It flares significantly less than other stars of similar mass tend to flare.

Maybe it is not another star.

Here's an accessible article on it:
Our sun is a weirdly 'quiet' star — and that's lucky for all of us | Space

From your link..

"To understand what the sun was doing before those records begin, scientists can interpret a host of data types, like levels of specific elements in tree rings and ancient ice."

No. They cannot. The ages they assign to these things are belief based. They believe in a same nature on earth in the past. The record in Scripture indicates nature was not the same at all. For example trees grew in weeks. So ancient tree rings do not give dates at all, they just assume that the rings grew slowly in this present nature.

So their dates are wrong as can be. In real time, there was no stars or earth 9000 years ago.

That's so interesting. I think that's why we are here -- that's why this star we have helps make our Earth so well suited for us.)

The reasons science calls stars sun are all belief based.

 

[dad]

Speculating based on possible scientific concepts is better than believing something that comparatively ignorant people wrote 2000-3000 years ago.

Not when the star of Bethlehem was observed by many, and the disappearing star 2 and half million times brighter than the sun is a mystery.

. I'm willing to bet that you follow Trump's unscientific views regarding face masks (nah - no one needs to wear them) rather than the scientific views of Dr. Fauci.

Well, if the experts never changed their stories so much, I might have a little more confidence in what they say. You see if someone made a statement that political rallies were very bad, but never mentioned the mass rioting and disorder of violent mobs, I might ask if they had some sort of agenda.

No face masks for Dad. Of course, it may just be that you are anxious to meet your maker.

There is a time and place for everything. When I see some folks get self righteous about masks, it makes me question them. However, if I was visiting an old folks home or taking a plane, one assumes that one would err on the side of safety.

 

[dad]

But I wasn't talking to any person on earth. I was talking to you.

And I am one of those people on earth. Are you not one of us?

Are you that afraid of being wrong?

We all should be ready to be wrong on certain things, especially when our house is built on sand, like science. They need to be always at the ready!

 

[blü 2]

The existence of God did not start with when Israel needed a written record.

The existence of gods is much older. You'd know if you'd read your bible that many verses acknowledge the reality of other gods. That doesn't change till after the Babylonian captivity, when the religious politics of the Hebrews decided theirs was the only god.

Pick a number game, eh?

No, you're confusing science with the Trinity.

On the evidence available, the age of the universe is about 3.8 bn years, and modern H sap sap appears about 70,000 years ago. Now you can do the calculation for yourself!

If that were true is would not be wrong much of the time on origin issues.

Unlike you, science follows where the evidence leads. As we find more, we learn more.

If that were true it would have some basis other than a little bag of beliefs to use in explaining the unknown..

You don't like the findings of science because they show the errors of the bible. Yet the bible thinks the earth is flat and immovably fixed &c, and you know neither of those things is true.

So you've put yourself into a state of doublethink ─ cognitive dissonance, as some call it.

One day you might feel like addressing the problem. Meanwhile, good luck!

 

[Tiberius]

Very tired joke.

Looking at the topic for example, link to where you offered evidence for the missing star that is 130 million times bigger than earth?

I was never talking about that in this thread, was I? I was commenting on why Jayhawker put you on ignore.

Of course, wouldn't be the first time you ignore what actually happens to fulfill your fantasies.

 

[dad]

]

The existence of gods is much older.

Not older than creation and Adan and Eve.

You'd know if you'd read your bible that many verses acknowledge the reality of other gods.

This is news? They are also called demons.

That doesn't change till after the Babylonian captivity, when the religious politics of the Hebrews decided theirs was the only god.

Bad imagination.

On the evidence available, the age of the universe is about 3.8 bn years, and modern H sap sap appears about 70,000 years ago

Spam dates you can't support.

Unlike you, science follows where the evidence leads.

Say it like you mean it.

As we find more, we learn more.

Yet never come to a knowledge of the truth.

You don't like the findings of science because they show the errors of the bible

There are none.

. Yet the bible thinks the earth is flat and immovably fixed &c, and you know neither of those things is true.

You do have errors though, and repeat old wives tales.

So you've put yourself into a state of doublethink ─ cognitive dissonance, as some call it.

The truth may look that way from your vantage point.