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Luther's attitude toward the Jews changed over the course of his life. In the early phase of his career—until around 1536—he expressed concern for their plight in Europe and was enthusiastic at the prospect of converting them to Christianity through his religious reforms. Being unsuccessful in that, in his later career, Luther denounced the Jewish people and urged for their harsh persecution and destruction. In a paragraph from his On the Jews and Their Lies he deplores Christendom's failure to expel them.[1] Moreover, he proposed "What shall we Christians do with this rejected and condemned people, the Jews":[1]
- "First, to set fire to their synagogues or schools … This is to be done in honor of our Lord and of Christendom, so that God might see that we are Christians …"
- "Second, I advise that their houses also be razed and destroyed."
- "Third, I advise that all their prayer books and Talmudic writings, in which such idolatry, lies, cursing, and blasphemy are taught, be taken from them."
- "Fourth, I advise that their rabbis be forbidden to teach henceforth on pain of loss of life and limb …"
- "Fifth, I advise that safe-conduct on the highways be abolished completely for the Jews. For they have no business in the countryside …"
- "Sixth, I advise that usury be prohibited to them, and that all cash and treasure of silver and gold be taken from them …"
- "Seventh, I recommend putting a flail, an ax, a hoe, a spade, a distaff, or a spindle into the hands of young, strong Jews and Jewesses and letting them earn their bread in the sweat of their brow … But if we are afraid that they might harm us or our wives, children, servants, cattle, etc., … then let us emulate the common sense of other nations such as France, Spain, Bohemia, etc., … then eject them forever from the country …"
Generally villain, IMO.Was German reformist Martin Luther good or bad, hero or villain?
Could you elaborate on this if you will?Luther was reacting to the rejection of the "true" Jesus from... the Catholic Church.
Sure. It's not like only protestants get to go to heaven for believing that Jesus paid everything for them to get there. (Though the Bible may teach that.) Luther was a heretic and yet he was orthodox about it. In the Catholic Church's mentality Jesus and the Church are synonymous. Whatever the Church says, God says. And it's even more so in that day and time because people are without the Scriptures to interpret them for themselves. In Martin Luther's mind it seems to me that God had become an oppressive force in the world and that he would change God by changing the Church back to what he felt was the way the first century Church was. And he was obviously pretty good at it.Could you elaborate on this if you will?
We could debate a couple of these points, but that would take us beyond what the OP is about. Let me just say that the Evangelical Church's ("Lutheran") and the Catholic Church's teachings on Jesus are very much the same and that the difference lies elsewhere, part of which you mentioned above. Another problem is that Luther did not bring the church back to its earliest roots, and he well knew that, and actually ended up being quite depressed about the Pandora's box that he had opened.Sure. It's not like only protestants get to go to heaven for believing that Jesus paid everything for them to get there. (Though the Bible may teach that.) Luther was a heretic and yet he was orthodox about it. In the Catholic Church's mentality Jesus and the Church are synonymous. Whatever the Church says, God says. And it's even more so in that day and time because people are without the Scriptures to interpret them for themselves. In Martin Luther's mind it seems to me that God had become an oppressive force in the world and that he would change God by changing the Church back to what he felt was the way the first century Church was. And he was obviously pretty good at it.
I'll message you. Is that okay?Anyhow we could maybe discuss this on anther thread if you disagree with me if you're interested.
50 years??? I hope you're getting a discount on the tithing rates!BTW, I grew up in a fundamentalist Lutheran church (yes, they do exist), had tentative plans to go into the ministry, but I have gone to my wife's Catholic church with her for some 50 years now.
Anyhow, thanks for your response.
Sure.I'll message you. Is that okay?
The discount doesn't save me any money because that and more goes towards shul dues.50 years??? I hope you're getting a discount on the tithing rates!
I guess that's what you get for playing both sides of the fence!The discount doesn't save me any money because that and more goes towards shul dues.
The problem with playing both sides of the fence is that it gives me a very sore crotch, which sometimes makes me very crotchety.I guess that's what you get for playing both sides of the fence!