1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Featured Jesus' Second Coming

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Fool, May 4, 2018.

  1. stvdv

    stvdv Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2018
    Messages:
    3,666
    Ratings:
    +1,967
    Religion:
    Sanathana Dharma [The Eternal Religion]
    No need to worry about that. I have the indian scriptures full of wisdom, and even more important "my eye is open"
     
    • Like Like x 1
  2. shmogie

    shmogie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2014
    Messages:
    4,538
    Ratings:
    +765
    Religion:
    Christian
    Revelation is difficult book, no doubt. Scholars and theologians have debated the possible interpretations for hundreds of years.

    Before becoming a Christian, it seemed to me that magic mushrooms were growing on Patmos and John found them.

    Revelation has little to do with salvation if it is found in the Other books.
    ]
    The book is important because of its warnings of what takes place before the end.,

    It is valuable to openly discuss it and weigh the arguments.

    It is unwise to reflect rancor in these conversations. As one fighting that impulse, I know
     
  3. Furchizedek

    Furchizedek Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2015
    Messages:
    105
    Ratings:
    +26
    Religion:
    Urantian
    Yes, sure. I would say that "we" that I mentioned is the majority of serious Urantia Book readers and believers, those who know the history about the book. And if you want to read what is probably a pretty good job on the history, you can find it here: A History of The Urantia Papers

    Larry Mullins, the author of "A History of The Urantia Papers" also did an update to the one above in 2010. It's essentially the same but with some later material added.

    Oh, an edit. All my life I've wanted to use this word and then when I got the chance, I blew it.

    The "we" that I mentioned is the cognoscenti. LOL.
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Qualifier: Everything I say above or below is my opinion and/or my beliefs some of which I may have derived from The Urantia Book or other sources. Or not.
     
    #83 Furchizedek, May 7, 2018
    Last edited: May 7, 2018
  4. paarsurrey

    paarsurrey Veteran Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2012
    Messages:
    14,906
    Ratings:
    +1,477
    So it means that when one talked of Jesus having blood and flesh one took it symbolically for Jesus being a human nothing more nothing less, one did not take it literally. Right, please?

    Regards
     
  5. Faithofchristian

    Faithofchristian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2017
    Messages:
    6,111
    Ratings:
    +486
    Religion:
    Christian
    While Jesus was here on earth, Jesus was of flesh and blood and bones.

    But after the Resurrection of Jesus, Jesus told his disciples to feel him and see that he has flesh and bones.that a spirit does not have.
    So I'm curious, did Jesus have blood, seeing Jesus never made mentioning about having blood.
    I haven't found anything that indicates or even Jesus made any mentioning after his resurrection, of having blood.

    I have found before Jesus resurrection,
    Jesus had all 3 flesh, blood, bones.

    But after Jesus resurrection, Jesus only made mention of having ( flesh ) ( bones)
    But said nothing of having ( blood )
    Luke 24:39

    Here's a eye catcher for you.
    In the book of Mark 16:12--"After that
    he ( Jesus ) appeared in another( form) unto two of them, as they walked, and went into the country"

    Notice that Jesus appeared in another
    ( Form ) maybe this is why the disciples didn't recognize Jesus, all because Jesus appeared in another ( form ) to what they were use to seeing Jesus as. But now after the resurrection of Jesus, Jesus didn't have the same form that the disciples were use to seeing Jesus as.
    But now Jesus appeared in another ( form)
    Than what the disciples were use to.
     
  6. paarsurrey

    paarsurrey Veteran Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2012
    Messages:
    14,906
    Ratings:
    +1,477
    It only shows that Christians have a wrong perception/understanding of Jesus' resurrection after the event of Cross. Jesus did not die on the Cross, he was only seriously wounded and after treatment in the tomb he was able to walk. Jesus showed his wounds to the disciples so that they know that G-d has heard his prayers in the Garden and saved his life. This is what I believe and understand, others could believe differently with sound reasons and arguments, if any. Right, please?

    Regards
     
  7. Faithofchristian

    Faithofchristian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2017
    Messages:
    6,111
    Ratings:
    +486
    Religion:
    Christian
    It seems like you come up with things, but have no proof to support them.
    Your just to funny.
     
  8. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2016
    Messages:
    7,863
    Ratings:
    +1,247
    Religion:
    Grace




    obviously some are having an experience that others don't seem to be having. fantasy and believing are not proof. proof is being ability to repeat the experience by another.

    jesus says you can do all these things and more; if you believe. most christians say you can't because jesus was unique and the only son of god.

    jesus didn't say that.
     
  9. Furchizedek

    Furchizedek Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2015
    Messages:
    105
    Ratings:
    +26
    Religion:
    Urantian
    There's a fly in that ointment, though, and that's 10 verses earlier Jesus said:

    Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God. (John 20:17)

    I suggest that if John 20:17 is correct, then John 20:27 is incorrect. (IMO)
     
  10. Faithofchristian

    Faithofchristian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2017
    Messages:
    6,111
    Ratings:
    +486
    Religion:
    Christian
    Had you any knowledge what is and what is not.
    At the time when the disciples went to the tomb, And Jesus told Mary not to touch him, because Jesus hadn't ascended to his Father.
    Now at the time Jesus appeared to the disciple and was eating with them, by this time Jesus had already ascended to his Father and came back to his disciples.

    The same with John 20:17 and John 20:27,

    In John 20:17, Jesus was just resurrected from the tomb, telling Mary not touch him, for Jesus had not ascended to his Father Yet.

    Now John 20:27, at this time, Jesus had already ascended to his Father and came back to his disciples, at this time the disciples can touch Jesus.

    It seems like your having a hard time
    Adding 2+2= 4

    Jesus saying not to touch him, for he had not ascended to the Father.

    Now Jesus tells his disciples to touch him.
    This means that Jesus had already ascended to his Father and came to the disciples.
     
  11. Furchizedek

    Furchizedek Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2015
    Messages:
    105
    Ratings:
    +26
    Religion:
    Urantian
    Just because you believe the bible version of events is true, does not make it true.

    God may ask you to believe things you don't understand, but He will never ask you to believe things that don't make sense. (IMO)

    From The Urantia Book:

    189:4.12 As Mary sought to embrace his feet, Jesus said: “Touch me not, Mary, for I am not as you knew me in the flesh. In this form will I tarry with you for a season before I ascend to the Father. But go, all of you, now and tell my apostles—and Peter—that I have risen, and that you have talked with me.”

    189:4.13 After these women had recovered from the shock of their amazement, they hastened back to the city and to the home of Elijah Mark, where they related to the ten apostles all that had happened to them; but the apostles were not inclined to believe them. They thought at first that the women had seen a vision, but when Mary Magdalene repeated the words which Jesus had spoken to them, and when Peter heard his name, he rushed out of the upper chamber, followed closely by John, in great haste to reach the tomb and see these things for himself.

    189:4.14 The women repeated the story of talking with Jesus to the other apostles, but they would not believe; and they would not go to find out for themselves as had Peter and John.
    ...[time passes]

    189:5.3 Peter at first suggested that the grave had been rifled, that enemies had stolen the body, perhaps bribed the guards. But John reasoned that the grave would hardly have been left so orderly if the body had been stolen, and he also raised the question as to how the bandages happened to be left behind, and so apparently intact. And again they both went back into the tomb more closely to examine the grave cloths. As they came out of the tomb the second time, they found Mary Magdalene returned and weeping before the entrance. Mary had gone to the apostles believing that Jesus had risen from the grave, but when they all refused to believe her report, she became downcast and despairing. She longed to go back near the tomb, where she thought she had heard the familiar voice of Jesus.
    189:5.4 As Mary lingered after Peter and John had gone, the Master again appeared to her, saying: “Be not doubting; have the courage to believe what you have seen and heard. Go back to my apostles and again tell them that I have risen, that I will appear to them, and that presently I will go before them into Galilee as I promised.”
    189:5.5 Mary hurried back to the Mark home and told the apostles she had again talked with Jesus, but they would not believe her. But when Peter and John returned, they ceased to ridicule and became filled with fear and apprehension.

    [Meanwhile (later) back at the ranch]:
    5. SECOND APPEARANCE TO THE APOSTLES (in Paper 191)
    191:5.4 When the Master had so spoken, he looked down into the face of Thomas and said: “And you, Thomas, who said you would not believe unless you could see me and put your finger in the nail marks of my hands, have now beheld me and heard my words; and though you see no nail marks on my hands, since I am raised in the form that you also shall have when you depart from this world, what will you say to your brethren? You will acknowledge the truth, for already in your heart you had begun to believe even when you so stoutly asserted your unbelief. Your doubts, Thomas, always most stubbornly assert themselves just as they are about to crumble. Thomas, I bid you be not faithless but believing—and I know you will believe, even with a whole heart.”

    191:5.5 When Thomas heard these words, he fell on his knees before the morontia Master and exclaimed, “I believe! My Lord and my Master!” Then said Jesus to Thomas: “You have believed, Thomas, because you have really seen and heard me. Blessed are those in the ages to come who will believe even though they have not seen with the eye of flesh nor heard with the mortal ear.”

    191:5.6 And then, as the Master’s form moved over near the head of the table, he addressed them all, saying: “And now go all of you to Galilee, where I will presently appear to you.” After he said this, he vanished from their sight.

    PAPER 189 The Resurrection
    0. The Resurrection
    1. The Morontia Transit
    2. The Material Body of Jesus
    3. The Dispensational Resurrection
    4. Discovery of the Empty Tomb
    5. Peter and John at the Tomb

    PAPER 190 Morontia Appearances of Jesus
    0. Morontia Appearances of Jesus
    1. Heralds of the Resurrection
    2. Jesus' Appearance at Bethany
    3. At the Home of Joseph
    4. Appearance to the Greeks
    5. The Walk with Two Brothers

    PAPER 191 Appearances to the Apostles and Other Leaders
    0. Appearances to the Apostles and Other Leaders
    1. The Appearance to Peter
    2. First Appearance to the Apostles
    3. With the Morontia Creatures
    4. The Tenth Appearance (At Philadelphia)
    5. Second Appearance to the Apostles
    6. The Alexandrian Appearance

    PAPER 192 Appearances in Galilee
    0. Appearances in Galilee
    1. Appearance by the Lake
    2. Visiting with the Apostles Two and Two
    3. On the Mount of Ordination
    4. The Lakeside Gathering

    PAPER 193 Final Appearances and Ascension
    0. Final Appearances and Ascension
    1. The Appearance at Sychar
    2. The Phoenician Appearance
    3. Last Appearance in Jerusalem
    4. Causes of Judas's Downfall
    5. The Master's Ascension
    6. Peter Calls A Meeting

    PAPER 194 Bestowal of the Spirit of Truth
    0. Bestowal of the Spirit of Truth
    1. The Pentecost Sermon
    2. The Significance of Pentecost
    3. What Happened at Pentecost
    4. Beginnings of the Christian Church
     
    #91 Furchizedek, May 8, 2018
    Last edited: May 8, 2018
  12. Furchizedek

    Furchizedek Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2015
    Messages:
    105
    Ratings:
    +26
    Religion:
    Urantian
    And I would just like to say that I fail to understand what difference it makes to anyone if Jesus had or had not ascended at such and such a time, if Mary was or was not a virgin, and so on. Why argue about any of it? None of that has anything to do with anyone's salvation. Regardless of who you think did or didn't die for you, YOU MUST DO THE FATHER'S WILL to be saved, (Matthew 7:21) according to the bible.

    ...Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? (Luke 10:25)
    "Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbor as thyself." (Luke 10:27)

    "Not every one who says to me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven." (Matthew 7:21)

    "For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother." (Matthew 12:50)
     
  13. Faithofchristian

    Faithofchristian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2017
    Messages:
    6,111
    Ratings:
    +486
    Religion:
    Christian

    My question is, ( Death is swallowed up in victory) Who is death, What is the name of Death, what is his name ?
     
  14. Faithofchristian

    Faithofchristian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2017
    Messages:
    6,111
    Ratings:
    +486
    Religion:
    Christian

    As Jesus said unto Mary touch me not in
    John 20:17
    Now what is the spirit of the word that Jesus spoke unto Mary ?

    Notice that in John 6:63--"It is the spirit that quickens, the flesh profiteth nothing,
    The words that I speak unto you , They are spirit, and they are life"

    Ok, so what is the spirit of the word that Jesus spoke unto Mary, saying touch me not?
     
    #94 Faithofchristian, May 8, 2018
    Last edited: May 8, 2018
  15. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    14,488
    Ratings:
    +831
    Religion:
    Christian
    I believe since He has been in the flesh since resurrection it is not reincarnation. Resurrection is a form of reincarnation but it is not the traditional rebirth associated with the term.

    I believe so and the angels at his ascendance said so also.

    I believe God is a Spirit that is everywhere so when he Paraclete came, it is the same thing as having the Spirit of Jesus. However that is referred to as a sending and not a coming.

    I believe He was not Melchizadek.
     
  16. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    14,488
    Ratings:
    +831
    Religion:
    Christian
    I believe your statement is contrary to scripture.
     
  17. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    14,488
    Ratings:
    +831
    Religion:
    Christian
    I believe that is incorrect. Flesh doe not inherit the realm of spirit. Jesus is in the flesh. What can be said is that The Spirit in Jesus is in the Spirit although that is only perspective since the Spirit is one.
     
  18. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2016
    Messages:
    7,863
    Ratings:
    +1,247
    Religion:
    Grace
    resurrection is not reincarnation. resurrection is the birth of the spirit already entombed in the flesh

    there are two birth and two deaths


    John 3:6
    That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

    John 3:8
    The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.”

    Galatians 4:29
    But, as he who was born according to the flesh then persecuted him who was born according to the Spirit, even so it is now.
     
  19. dfnj

    dfnj Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2017
    Messages:
    2,220
    Ratings:
    +923
    Religion:
    My Own
    What does it mean for your body to be in a "glorified state" ? Do you still have human needs? What does incorruptible mean? Does your body glow?
     
  20. InChrist

    InChrist Free4ever

    Joined:
    May 9, 2011
    Messages:
    6,251
    Ratings:
    +1,110
    I'm not totally sure, but from the scriptures it means the glorified body will not die or suffer disease or pain, it will be eternal.
     
Loading...