Is race a choice?

[Smoke]

I'm "white" and my wife is "Asian" - what "race" are our children?

More people than dream of it are of "mixed race," and there is far less genetic diversity among humans than there is among chimpanzees. To imagine that we can all be divided into three or four or five races is absurd. Your "race" is what you think it is, and what your society thinks it is. Barack Obama is "black," for instance, not for any genetic reason, but because that's how he's perceived in our society. Your children will likely be perceived as Asian, or "looks like she's part Asian or something."

I recommend the approach of my friend Leslie, who was often asked what her race was and used to reply, "I'm Leslie. Deal with that."

 

[DallasApple]

No - your race is what others say it is.

Its not just what others say...Im sorry it would be rediculous if I said I am "black" but have no black heritage..No "blacks" in my genetic line...but if I had I"decided" Im black and went around saying it..Or reverse...thats silliness...

If I went around saying Im Asian to Asian people they woud say "how'?i could say...well I make homemade Thai Basil Meat Balls...

Im fixing to be a grandmother..I will tell him (my grandson) he is the race he thinks he is..Its his choice..He is Asian or Indian...White or Black..BUT he is genetically predesposed to have "white" (caucasion)features but that isnt his "race"...

He gets to pick what race in fact he is..
I will look it up on Wikepedia to prove to to him..

Blessings

Dallas

 

[nutshell]

More people than dream of it are of "mixed race," and there is far less genetic diversity among humans than there is among chimpanzees. To imagine that we can all be divided into three or four or five races is absurd. Your "race" is what you think it is, and what your society thinks it is. Barack Obama is "black," for instance, not for any genetic reason, but because that's how he's perceived in our society. Your children will likely be perceived as Asian, or "looks like she's part Asian or something."

I recommend the approach of my friend Leslie, who was often asked what her race was and used to reply, "I'm Leslie. Deal with that."

Thanks for your post.

My question was for those who don't think like you and me.

 

[nutshell]

Its not just what others say...Im sorry it would be rediculous if I said I am "black" but have no black heritage..No "blacks" in my genetic line...but if I had I"decided" Im black and went around saying it..Or reverse...thats silliness...

If I went around saying Im Asian to Asian people they woud say "how'?i could say...well I make homemade Thai Basil Meat Balls...

Im fixing to be a grandmother..I will tell him (my grandson) he is the race he thinks he is..Its his choice..He is Asian or Indian...White or Black..BUT he is genetically predesposed to have "white" (caucasion)features but that isnt his "race"...

He gets to pick what race in fact he is..
I will look it up on Wikepedia to prove to to him..

Blessings

Dallas

I really don't think you get it. Sorry. It doesn't matter what you or any individual says. It's about the labels applied by society.

I'm done.

 

[McBell]

I really don't think you get it. Sorry. It doesn't matter what you or any individual says. It's about the labels applied by society.

I'm done.

You lasted longer than me...

:bow:

 

[Kungfuzed]

I'm not sure what you are asking exactly but if you are a white guy from DE and your family came over on the first boat and settled there... I'm a white guy from PA and my family was on one of the first boats so I would think our DNA would be very similar in origin. As far as my DNA being different than someone in Europe who's family has been there for 5000 years sure our DNA is different but not enough to constitute a new race.

A very good article that explains genetic differences between individuals compared to genetic differences between races Confusions About Human Races

The United States, with a very large population whose ancestors came from all over the earth including the original inhabitants of the New World, is genetically very variable whereas small populations of local Amazonian tribes are less genetically variable, although they are by no means genetically uniform. Despite the differences in amount of genetic variation within local populations, the finding that on the average 85% of all human genetic variation is within local populations has been a remarkably consistent result of independent studies carried out over twenty-five years using data from both proteins and DNA.

Of the remaining 15% of human variation, between a quarter and a half is between local populations within classically defined human “races,” between the French and the Ukrainians, between the Kikuyu and the Ewe, between the Japanese and the Koreans. The remaining variation, about 6% to 10% of the total human variation is between the classically defined geographical races that we think of in an everyday sense as identified by skin color, hair form, and nose shape. This imprecision in assigning the proportion of variation assigned to differences among population within ”races” as compared to variation among “races,” arises precisely because there is no objective way to assign the various human populations to clear-cut races. Into which “race” do the Hindi and Urdu speakers of the Indian sub-continent fall? Should they be grouped with Europeans or with Asians or should a separate race be assigned to them? Are the Lapps of Finland and the Hazari of Afghanistan really Europeans or Asians? What about Indonesians and Melanesians? Different biologists have made different assignments and the number of “races” assigned by anthropologists and geneticists has varied from 3 to 30.

Basically it would be easy to find another white American who has greater genetic differences to me than you do to me. We have many more genes than obvious phenotypes. Different skin, hair, eyes, and facial features do not necessarily equate to huge genetic differences. There are genes for those features but they are spread over a much wider geography and mixed with other races as well. Colonized countries are a good example. My wife is from the Philippines. She has some Chinese, native Filipino, Japanese, and Spanish blood. Is she Asian? I call her Asian because that's the name we have here for people with Asian eyes. I could probably even call her a Pacific Islander since the Philippines is a bunch of islands in the Western Pacific. But if she were in another Asian country they would probably refer to her as Filipina.

 

[Somkid]

More people than dream of it are of "mixed race," and there is far less genetic diversity among humans than there is among chimpanzees. To imagine that we can all be divided into three or four or five races is absurd. Your "race" is what you think it is, and what your society thinks it is. Barack Obama is "black," for instance, not for any genetic reason, but because that's how he's perceived in our society. Your children will likely be perceived as Asian, or "looks like she's part Asian or something."

I recommend the approach of my friend Leslie, who was often asked what her race was and used to reply, "I'm Leslie. Deal with that."

My wife is Asian and I am white, one of our children looks 100% Asian and one looks 100% white and they are citizens of 2 countries

 

[nutshell]

My wife is Asian and I am white, one of our children looks 100% Asian and one looks 100% white and they are citizens of 2 countries

And their "race" will be whatever society chooses to label them - not what their genes are.

 

[kai]

people are tribal they need a race, and they need to label everybody else while they are at it , if you ask a frenchman they will tell you that ,americans .british, australians and canadians,new zealanders are all anglo saxons

 

[Sola'lor]

Holy cow! How many of us are "white" with "asian/filipina(or whatever you want to call it)" spouses?

 

[Persephone]

Okay, people. Race is based on more than just skin color- it is a culmination of genetic traits that tend to be shared by the people who gathered and lived in all the different areas of the world. If I remember correctly, it has been proven that we all descended from the same race- originally in Africa. From there we spread and settled down all over the world (except antarctica of course, lol) and whichever traits suited the environment that the people settled down in are the traits that we now think of defining them as a "race." Of course, in today's world, what with industrialization and globalization, genetic traits have very little to do with our worldly success and with everyone travelling and blending the gene pool back to its prior glory and the lines between the races has begun to blur.

So, race is genetic- but only in the abstract and in todays world is largely irrelevant.

 

[nutshell]

Okay, people. Race is based on more than just skin color- it is a culmination of genetic traits that tend to be shared by the people who gathered and lived in all the different areas of the world. If I remember correctly, it has been proven that we all descended from the same race- originally in Africa. From there we spread and settled down all over the world (except antarctica of course, lol) and whichever traits suited the environment that the people settled down in are the traits that we now think of defining them as a "race." Of course, in today's world, what with industrialization and globalization, genetic traits have very little to do with our worldly success and with everyone travelling and blending the gene pool back to its prior glory and the lines between the races has begun to blur.

So, race is genetic- but only in the abstract and in todays world is largely irrelevant.

There's no such thing as genetic in the abstract.

Race is a social construct created to arbitrarily divide people into differing groups. The genetic traits you refer to don't define race. Society defines race by arbitrarily selecting certain traits.

 

[modernmoonlight]

Its not just what others say...Im sorry it would be rediculous if I said I am "black" but have no black heritage..No "blacks" in my genetic line...but if I had I"decided" Im black and went around saying it..Or reverse...thats silliness...

If I went around saying Im Asian to Asian people they woud say "how'?i could say...well I make homemade Thai Basil Meat Balls...

Im fixing to be a grandmother..I will tell him (my grandson) he is the race he thinks he is..Its his choice..He is Asian or Indian...White or Black..BUT he is genetically predesposed to have "white" (caucasion)features but that isnt his "race"...

He gets to pick what race in fact he is..
I will look it up on Wikepedia to prove to to him..

Blessings

Dallas

No, I agree with nutshell, I don't think you get it. It doesn't matter what you label yourself. It matters what other people think. In reference to:

My wife is Asian and I am white, one of our children looks 100% Asian and one looks 100% white and they are citizens of 2 countries

The 100% Asian looking child will always be classified as "asian" by people who look at his/her face, and similarly the 100% white looking child will always be classified as "white" by those same people, because that is how race is determined. Genetics and DNA determine one's phenotypes. Society then groups people into different "races" based on those phenotypes. It's all based on perceptions and definitions. If we were to suddenly invert the definitions of the color names "black" and "white," all those people we consider "white" would now be "black," and vice versa. Thus, race is simply a social construct based on peoples' perceptions.

 

[nutshell]

It's all relative. For example, my "half" kids look "Asian" when they are next to "white" kids, but they look "white" when they are next to "Asian" kids. And, no, they are not transformers or chamaleons (or however you spell that - too lazy right now). They don't change. the perception of others around them change based on the surroundings.

 

[gnomon]

So where does dark skin and light skin come from? What about hair color? What about Eye color? Height, etc? THose are part of what we call race. Those are genetic traits inherited from our parents. I am what could be considered caucasian. My fiancee is Filipina. When we have children they will have lighter dark skin(or darker light skin depending on your view). They will probably also have dark hair and brown eyes. Those racial traits will come from the genetics of their parents. I don't see how anyone can deny that these traits come from genetics.

Those are not what we call racial traits. They are genetic traits. If you claim held true then there would be no albinos in Africa.

 

[gnomon]

Its not just what others say...Im sorry it would be rediculous if I said I am "black" but have no black heritage..No "blacks" in my genetic line...but if I had I"decided" Im black and went around saying it..Or reverse...thats silliness...

If I went around saying Im Asian to Asian people they woud say "how'?i could say...well I make homemade Thai Basil Meat Balls...

Im fixing to be a grandmother..I will tell him (my grandson) he is the race he thinks he is..Its his choice..He is Asian or Indian...White or Black..BUT he is genetically predesposed to have "white" (caucasion)features but that isnt his "race"...

He gets to pick what race in fact he is..
I will look it up on Wikepedia to prove to to him..

Blessings

Dallas

If you were born in an Asian nation and raised with an Asian culture you would be Asian, no matter your physical appearance.

Thank you, reason will be here most the day.

 

[gnomon]

To be clear,

race, when used to denote an idea other than ethnicity in which case there is no reason to use the term race, is not biological. There is greater genetic variety among a population of any given homogenous so called race than there is between two races. Picking the melanin level in skin (for black/white) or the bone structure in ones face (Asian/everyone else), which both leave out the people of India for the most part, is not only useless but a mark of an inferior intellect.

Here's a pop quiz.

My sister-in-law is from Cambodia. My brother, her husband, is from Georgia(US). What is the race, and for bonus points, the ethnicity of their son, my nephew? And here is a hint: Asian-American or Asian anything is the wrong answer.

 

[Somkid]

Holy cow! How many of us are "white" with "asian/filipina(or whatever you want to call it)" spouses?

I have lived in Asia since I was 18 so.... And I'm not sure there are many white American girls (or Western girls in general) that want to marry a former Buddhist monk, tear up their roots in their country and move to Asia to live in a lower standard than they are used to in the USA just because I won't live in Western culture for more than 1 year at a time. That is why I have an Asian wife.

 

[whereismynotecard]

"Race" is based on skin colour and facial features. Biologically race doesn't exist. If you lined up everyone in the world, from darkest to lightest skin, how would you know where to draw the line between races?? The difference between any two consecutive people would not even be noticable.

(And certain facial features and other physical characeristics are shared between all races. There is no feature that belongs to only one race, and there is no race in which everyone belonging to that race shares a common feature)

So you can choose your own race if you want to, but society probably won't go along with you. Your race is pretty much whatever society says it is.