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Is masturbation wrong?

Flankerl

Flankerl

Well-Known Member
Ben Masada said:
If one is married, it becomes wrong also socially because it means cheating on the married companion. And this applies to both, male and female.
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I really have to disagree on this.
Why should it be cheating? You know there are people out there who take pleasure in watching their loved one masturbating.
And even if you do it alone. Whats the big deal? You cant cheat with yourself. Except if you have different personalities.





@Levite do you mean the part where it says that you shouldnt waste your semen or something like that? I cant really remember it right now.
 
Rakhel

Rakhel

Well-Known Member
Flankerl said:
I really have to disagree on this.
Why should it be cheating? You know there are people out there who take pleasure in watching their loved one masturbating.
And even if you do it alone. Whats the big deal? You cant cheat with yourself. Except if you have different personalities.
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Agreed





@Levite do you mean the part where it says that you shouldnt waste your semen or something like that? I cant really remember it right now.
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I think he is talking about Onan.
 
Levite

Levite

Higher and Higher
rakhel said:
I think he is talking about Onan.
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Actually, I'm not sure which part Flankerl was talking about.

Onan is definitely not about masturbation. That got completely misunderstood by Christians. Onan's sin isn't masturbating, and it isn't even pulling out and using the withdrawal method of contraception, per se. Onan's sin is that he was Tamar's brother-in-law, and was liable for the duty of yibum (levirate marriage), in that his brother died and left no heir, and it was his duty to sire such an heir with Tamar. That joining is not supposed to be just for pleasure, it is to produce the needed heir: by pulling out and not impregnating her, Onan turned it from his familial duty to an act of selfish pleasure. That was his sin.

As for "wasting seed," there is no clear consensus in the Talmud that it is forbidden to "waste" seed. The only clear consensus is that if a man ejaculates, he is ritually impure until he goes to the mikveh (ritual pool of immersion). However, these days, we are all ritually impure, since there is no way to remove death impurity anymore, and in any case ritual impurity doesn't matter, since there is no Temple which must be kept ritually pure.

It was the rabbis of the mussar tradition, in the Middle Ages, who took the isolated and non-binding Talmudic viewpoints that any ejaculation not during intercourse for the purposes of procreation should be forbidden, combined them with a structure of ascetic philosophy, and produced the sexually repressive ethics that has come to dominate Orthodoxy today.
 
Rakhel

Rakhel

Well-Known Member
Levite said:
Actually, I'm not sure which part Flankerl was talking about.

Onan is definitely not about masturbation. That got completely misunderstood by Christians. Onan's sin isn't masturbating, and it isn't even pulling out and using the withdrawal method of contraception, per se. Onan's sin is that he was Tamar's brother-in-law, and was liable for the duty of yibum (levirate marriage), in that his brother died and left no heir, and it was his duty to sire such an heir with Tamar. That joining is not supposed to be just for pleasure, it is to produce the needed heir: by pulling out and not impregnating her, Onan turned it from his familial duty to an act of selfish pleasure. That was his sin.

As for "wasting seed," there is no clear consensus in the Talmud that it is forbidden to "waste" seed. The only clear consensus is that if a man ejaculates, he is ritually impure until he goes to the mikveh (ritual pool of immersion). However, these days, we are all ritually impure, since there is no way to remove death impurity anymore, and in any case ritual impurity doesn't matter, since there is no Temple which must be kept ritually pure.

It was the rabbis of the mussar tradition, in the Middle Ages, who took the isolated and non-binding Talmudic viewpoints that any ejaculation not during intercourse for the purposes of procreation should be forbidden, combined them with a structure of ascetic philosophy, and produced the sexually repressive ethics that has come to dominate Orthodoxy today.
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Yeah, I know and I agree that Onan's sin was not about masturbations. I have argued this with several people. However, there are several Jewish websites claim that Onan was were the masturbation prohibition came from. Jewfaq for one. A number of modern day chassidim also claim this to against Jewish law.
 
ninerbuff

ninerbuff

godless wonder
Pegg said:
sorry guys but this man-thread makes me feel icky, so i'll be brief

masturbation is not directly condemned in the Bible but that doesn't mean it's harmless. Its a means of arousing ones sexual appetite and if your sexual appetite becomes too great, then you might find it difficult to resist the temptation to practice sex whenever you can and this will certainly put you at odds with Gods laws on sexuality and cleanness.

Colossians 3:5-6 "Deaden, therefore, YOUR body members that are upon the earth as respects fornication, uncleanness, sexual appetite, hurtful desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry. 6 On account of those things the wrath of God is coming.

Christians need to be found acceptable to God and if we loose control of our own sexuality by developing a sexual appetite that we cannot control, then we will likely stand disapproved.

Is a few seconds of pleasure really worth it?
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Glad I ain't christian then cause sexual appetite keeps me from using viagra.
 
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