Is living a gay/lesbian lifestyle a problem with God?

[tarasan]

I didn't have you or any particular person in mind. However, I'd be willing to bet you don't apply the scriptures as strictly in cases that apply to yourself as you apply them to gay people. Do you obey all the commandments of Jesus?

maybe you should state them first? so that i can refute what you say or just agree to them. Its just this way I dont back myself into an intellectual corner.

 

[Smoke]

maybe you should state them first? so that i can refute what you say or just agree to them. Its just this way I dont back myself into an intellectual corner.

You mean you don't know them? You took the time to find out what the Bible says about homosexuality, but haven't bothered to find out how Jesus tells you to live?

 

[Mr Cheese]

we all know Jesus hated minorities

biblical homphobia.............solved through Jesus

amen

 

[tarasan]

You mean they don't know them? You took the time to find out what the Bible says about homosexuality, but haven't bothered to find out how Jesus tells you to live?

ohhh i do i just want you to state them, seeing as in im not which ones you will cite, is that ok? unless you want me to line them all up and describe what Jesus means by them? a tall order on an internet forum right?

 

[Mr Cheese]

ohhh i do i just want you to state them, seeing as in im not which ones you will cite, is that ok? unless you want me to line them all up and describe what Jesus means by them? a tall order on an internet forum right?

so do you think the golden rule is garbage when it comes to unmarried non-missionary position hetero sex?

fornicators of the world unite

 

[tarasan]

so do you think the golden rule is garbage when it comes to unmarried non-missionary position hetero sex?

fornicators of the world unite

I believe adultery is jsut as wrong as sex, I believe all sexual sins are just as bad as each other, Im not elevating Homosexuality above any of them, so no it isnt garbage.

ohhh and the whole only missionairy thing? trying proving that throught the bible!

says nothing about positions.

 

[Smoke]

ohhh i do i just want you to state them, seeing as in im not which ones you will cite, is that ok?

I asked you if you obeyed all of them. That's a yes or no question. If you'd like to rationalize your failure to obey all of them, just list the ones you don't obey and the reasons you think you don't have to.

 

[tarasan]

I asked you if you obeyed all of them. That's a yes or no question. If you'd like to rationalize your failure to obey all of them, just list the ones you don't obey and the reasons you think you don't have to.

look mate state teh ones you have a problem with ok, Im not going through the entire new testament listing everything Jesus taught and interpreting what he meant, Jesus states alot of things that arnt meant literally like the cutting off a hand that sins, it isnt what he means and a brief look at the jewish culture at that time would tell you that, so im not agreeing with you just for you too pull one of those out and "claim victory" which then involves me trying to convince you your interpretation is wrong while your already "uncorking the shampaine" so to speak

so tell me what you have a problem with.

 

[Smoke]

look mate state teh ones you have a problem with ok, Im not going through the entire new testament listing everything Jesus taught and interpreting what he meant, Jesus states alot of things that arnt meant literally like the cutting off a hand that sins, it isnt what he means and a brief look at the jewish culture at that time would tell you that, so im not agreeing with you just for you too pull one of those out and "claim victory" which then involves me trying to convince you your interpretation is wrong while your already "uncorking the shampaine" so to speak

so tell me what you have a problem with.

I didn't say I had a problem with Jesus' commandments, though I don't agree with all of them. I just asked you if you obeyed all of them. It's not a trick; it's a simple question. But you want examples, okay.

Do you love your neighbor as yourself?
Do you give to him who asks you?
Do you lend to people even if they're unlikely to pay you back?
When you pray, do you go into your room and close the door?
If somebody sues you, do you give him what he sues you for and then give him extra?
Do you refrain from resisting an evil person?
Do you take care not to do your charitable deeds before men?
Do you refrain from laying up treasures for yourself on earth?
Do you take no thought for tomorrow?
Do you refrain from worrying about what you'll wear or eat or drink, knowing that God will provide all your needs?
Do you refrain from judging others?
Do you love your enemies?

Those aren't all of them, of course, just examples. Do you obey all of these, and all of his other commandments?

 

[tarasan]

I didn't say I had a problem with Jesus' commandments, though I don't agree with all of them. I just asked you if you obeyed all of them. It's not a trick; it's a simple question. But you want examples, okay.

Do you love your neighbor as yourself?
Do you give to him who asks you?
Do you lend to people even if they're unlikely to pay you back?
When you pray, do you go into your room and close the door?
If somebody sues you, do you give him what he sues you for and then give him extra?
Do you refrain from resisting an evil person?
Do you take care not to do your charitable deeds before men?
Do you refrain from laying up treasures for yourself on earth?
Do you take no thought for tomorrow?
Do you refrain from worrying about what you'll wear or eat or drink, knowing that God will provide all your needs?
Do you refrain from judging others?
Do you love your enemies?

Those aren't all of them, of course, just examples. Do you obey all of these, and all of his other commandments?

of course i try but I cannot, so ultimately I accept that not doing these things is wrong but i fail to keep them.

Just like I accept that homosexuality is wrong. I believe i can only state something is wrong as it says it in the bibles moral law, however i cannot condem and reject people who fail as well, I can merely state that it is wrong. Its why i can still love and accept others with a different sexual orientation while still disagreeing with what they do.

so what is your response?

 

[Smoke]

of course i try but I cannot, so ultimately I accept that not doing these things is wrong but i fail to keep them.

If you can't keep them, why is it wrong not to keep them?
Why does Jesus command you to do the impossible?

 

[tarasan]

If you can't keep them, why is it wrong not to keep them?
Why does Jesus command you to do the impossible?

to show that we need God to be saved, its not something that we ourselves can do rather it is what God can do in us. Ultimately we cannot be perfect, or always keep these commands, rather we strive to live up to them.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

Why do you think that? Your religion says Anglican Diet. Anglicans teach homosexuality is not a sin anyhow. You disagree?

 

[tarasan]

Why do you think that? Your religion says Anglican Diet. Anglicans teach homosexuality is not a sin anyhow. You disagree?

yeah, i do anglicianism has gotten a little strange as of yet. they have no biblical backing at all they just caved to culture.

although that one things isnt why im anglican diet its a whole bunch of stuff.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

Oh I see. Well I trust you remember that one of the core precepts of Anglicanism is reasoning. Not scripture and tradition alone. Maybe people have determined by their God-given reason that homosexuality can't possibly be a damning sin, and that the Bible doesn't necessarily need to be taken literally on this, it's an ancient manuscript written by primitive people.

 

[tarasan]

Oh I see. Well I trust you remember that one of the core precepts of Anglicanism is reasoning. Not scripture and tradition alone. Maybe people have determined by their God-given reason that homosexuality can't possibly be a damning sin, and that the Bible doesn't necessarily need to be taken literally on this, it's an ancient manuscript written by primitive people.

its not even housed on reason either its a desire to be accpeted, i have had debates with other christians on this, there is no reason other than "they dont like it" and we dont ahve to like it for it to be true, cause lets face it I dont like the idea of homosexuality being wrong, but i dont think i can just alagorise something in the bible because my culture at this point in time says its ok.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

Tarsan from what I've seen so far I think it's that "you don't like it". And because you don't like it, you don't care what the Church or anyone else says. Homosexuality is wrong to tarsan, therefore, tarsan is right and the Church is wrong.

 

[Autodidact]

the slavery laws were not moral laws, that is what I am stating and apparently you agree with me.

But in terms of slavery and weather God was really a supporter of it, is a hihgly debated subject, what with how he treated slaves on a one to one basis, how the very nation he built up was a slave nation, and about how he let slaves into the kingdom of God in the New Testament, with such statements as everyone is equal undre God we have a good reason to believe God was "for" Slaves, however this is not a topic we are talking about on this thread. If you want to talk about it make another thread.

Homesexuality is a moral law, which is in the unbrella of sexual immorality. If you can somehow refute all the biblical material saying it is I gladly welcome it.

That is the question. You are assuming your conclusion. Why on earth should the gender of whom you love be a moral matter? Did not Christ come to teach us that morality is loving each other and God? You can tell it's part of the ancient purity code, because it's found in Leviticus, right in and among all those other rules about what to eat and what to wear. Those are the rules Christ throws out the window. It's no longer about what you eat or what kind of sex you have--it's about loving each other and God. That's the whole point of Jesus.

And, as I keep saying and no one cares, because it does not involve men, which is all that matters to you, even the old purity codes never included lesbianism. Lesbianism was always permitted. Period.

 

[tarasan]

Tarsan from what I've seen so far I think it's that "you don't like it". And because you don't like it, you don't care what the Church or anyone else says. Homosexuality is wrong to tarsan, therefore, tarsan is right and the Church is wrong.

really? well then you have a very limited view of what i do and do not like, the Anglican church has alot i dont agree with biblically this is just one, and the "church" generally doesnt.

and dont tell me how i feel about something cause this is the kind of stuff i really want to be proved wrong about. not that Im sure a person like you would care considering ive probably been viewed as a bigot as soon as I spoke up, I just take solice in the face that my gay friends dont kind me one, even though ive said i dont agree but still love them as much as i love my striaght friends.

heck i even feel bad seperating them like that but hey.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

And as I already explained the NT verses can mean something totally different then the popular interpretation, which was developed by homophobic bigots anyhow. Of course they'd want the verses to read that way if they didn't like gays. I tell ya for Christianity supposed to be a religion that's inclusive, people sure like to shut the door in some people's face.