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Is jesus his own father?

U

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
you have hope not faith said:
why does jesus/god need to become human? humans were not exiciptable sacrofices.
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Good point. All born to Adam were born with human imperfection so could not be an acceptable equal or correspond to perfect human Adam before sin.

Except for those of Matt 12v32; Heb 6vs4-6, 'death' cancels out our inherited sin from Adam as Romans 6v7 says that the one who has died is freed or acquitted from sin. 'Death' stamps the price tag for sin as 'Paid In Full', but that still leaves us with no one to resurrect the dead or restore the dead back to life. We can not resurrect oneself or another so we need someone that can do that for us.

Since Jesus did not have a human Father then Jesus could be born with the same human perfection of healthy mind and body that Adam originally had.
So Jesus could be the 'ransom' sacrifice for us to cover our Adamic sins.
Jesus balanced the scales of justice for us. Adam unbalanced the scale and Jesus balanced the scale for us.

That is why God sent his perfect heavenly Son to earth for us.
Col 1v15; Rev 3v14 B
 
you have hope not faith

you have hope not faith

New Member
but, even a perfect human, is still not an acceptable sacrofice, human sacrofice is what the pagans did. and rember too all women sin thru adam too, so jesus could not be like adam unless he had no mother and no father.
 
U

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
you have hope not faith said:
but, even a perfect human, is still not an acceptable sacrofice, human sacrofice is what the pagans did. and rember too all women sin thru adam too, so jesus could not be like adam unless he had no mother and no father.
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But Adam had a Father. The same Father as Jesus had.
Adam is called 'son of God' at Luke 3v38

Adam was not forced by Eve to sin. Eve sinned first and Adam did not have to obey Eve over God. Please see 1st Tim 2 v 14 because Adam was Not deceived, so the passing down of sin to us comes through Adam as our family head. Please see: Romans 5 vs 12-19.

Pagan sacrifices were burning alive their children. They were Not 'ransom' sacrifices. Jesus willingly giving up his life [sacrifice], and according to Matthew 20v28 B Jesus was a 'ransom' for us. Jesus paid the ransom price for us because we can not pay for it ourselves.

Think of a person being held hostage, and the one holding that person asks for a ransom price to be paid in order to set free the hostage. We are held hostage to sin with death in view. Jesus paid the ransom or corresponding ransom asking price for what Adam brought upon our race; human race.
 
Beaudreaux

Beaudreaux

Well-Known Member
Charity said:
There would have been no eggs, so sperm but sort of an artificial insemination with the embryo already formed.
Christians believe that God created all, so if that is true then He would have created and formed the embryo within the Uterus without the use of any external interference.....
After all we're talking supernatural here......;)
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Charity said:
Because He had to be born human with flesh and blood. It would have been nothing for a supernatural being to die and be raised from the dead. The mother had to be a virgin proving that she was his mother and that another man could not have been the father.....Who else said they were born of a virgin? The descending comes later, but he did ascend which still proves nothing to the unbeliever....They conclude that Superman can also fly.....
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I am trying to understand here, but I am having difficulty. In your first quoted post, you say that God supernaturally "poofed" and embryo into exsistence because Jesus didn't have to be born of a union of male sperm and a female egg. But in the next post you seem to say that it is important the Jesus was born as humans are born, the natural way. If so, God had to fertilize Mary with his sperm.
 
U

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
Beaudreaux said:
I am trying to understand here, but I am having difficulty. In your first quoted post, you say that God supernaturally "poofed" and embryo into exsistence because Jesus didn't have to be born of a union of male sperm and a female egg. But in the next post you seem to say that it is important the Jesus was born as humans are born, the natural way. If so, God had to fertilize Mary with his sperm.
Click to expand...

God's active force that was used in creation at Genesis [1v2] is the same force or spirit of God that God used with Mary.

Jesus had to have a perfect parent in order not to be born with human imperfection. All the rest of us [since Adam] have imperfect parents.
 
U

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
you have hope not faith said:
but, even a perfect human, is still not an acceptable sacrofice, human sacrofice is what the pagans did. and rember too all women sin thru adam too, so jesus could not be like adam unless he had no mother and no father.
Click to expand...

Pagan human sacrifice was the sacrifice of an imperfect human.
God forbid what the pagans were doing. -Deut 12v31; 18v10

Sure all women sin through Adam. Adam did Not have to listen to Eve.
So the final responsibility [choice] according to Romans 5vs12-19 rests with Adam.
 
Beaudreaux

Beaudreaux

Well-Known Member
URAVIP2ME said:
God's active force that was used in creation at Genesis [1v2] is the same force or spirit of God that God used with Mary.

Jesus had to have a perfect parent in order not to be born with human imperfection. All the rest of us [since Adam] have imperfect parents.
Click to expand...
If God just "poofed" Jesus' embryo into existence, then why did Mary have to be without sin? Wouldn't your proposition mean that Mary is not actually Jesus' mother? At best, she would be a surrogate.
 
U

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
Beaudreaux said:
If God just "poofed" Jesus' embryo into existence, then why did Mary have to be without sin? Wouldn't your proposition mean that Mary is not actually Jesus' mother? At best, she would be a surrogate.
Click to expand...

According to the Scriptures [Romans 5vs 12-19] Mary was Not without sin.
There is No scripture that says Mary was sinless.
If Mary was perfect [sinless] she would still be alive on earth today because sinless people do not die. [Romans 6v23;6v7] Consider before Adam sinned he had healthy human perfection of mind and body, and if Adam had not sinned he would still be alive today. Adam was offered, in exchange for obedience to God, everlasting life. That eternal life would have been right here on earth.

Mary was Jesus fleshly mother. No imperfect human could produce a sinless child that is why God sent Jesus to earth so Mary's child could be born without sin and have the healthy human perfection of mind and body that Adam originally had. Thus Jesus could balance the scales of justice for us and be a ransom which no imperfect sinning person could be. We can not resurrect oneself or another. We need Jesus to do that for us. -Acts 24v15
 
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