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Featured Is it possible?

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by Conscious thoughts, Apr 15, 2021.

  1. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    Who would one be without an idea of who one wants to become?
     
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  2. sun rise

    sun rise "This is the Hour of God"
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    Possible, yes, but rare upon rare. Those that can have names in Islamic sufism: qutub (qutb) and pir - those who have truly attained and those on the very edge of true attainment. I accept that the number of such people is so small that I would not run out of fingers and toes counting them among all the billions of people living today.

    Some are never publicly known. The ones that are known are those like Rumi and Hafiz and their words inspire and motivate people for hundreds and hundreds of years.
     
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  3. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    I think it is possible to not hate anyone but how we treat people is another matter.

    Abdu’l-Baha said the following:

    "Act in such a way that your heart may be free from hatred. Let not your heart be offended with anyone. If someone commits an error and wrong toward you, you must instantly forgive him. Do not complain of others. Refrain from reprimanding them, and if you wish to give admonition or advice, let it be offered in such a way that it will not burden the bearer. Turn all your thoughts toward bringing joy to hearts. Beware! Beware! lest ye offend any heart."

    That seems to be contradicted by the following quote but it really isn’t because hate is a feeling and kindness is a behavior. He is saying that we should not be kind to a tyrant, the deceiver, or the thief, because, far from awakening them to the error of their ways, it will make them to continue in their perversity as before. But we can still refrain from hating them.

    “O ye beloved of the Lord! The Kingdom of God is founded upon equity and justice, and also upon mercy, compassion, and kindness to every living soul. Strive ye then with all your heart to treat compassionately all humankind—except for those who have some selfish, private motive, or some disease of the soul. Kindness cannot be shown the tyrant, the deceiver, or the thief, because, far from awakening them to the error of their ways, it maketh them to continue in their perversity as before. No matter how much kindliness ye may expend upon the liar, he will but lie the more, for he believeth you to be deceived, while ye understand him but too well, and only remain silent out of your extreme compassion.” Selections From the Writings of ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, p. 158
     
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  4. Conscious thoughts

    Conscious thoughts Veteran Member

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    Unconditional love to me is when someone can fully selfless love anyone no matter what they do to you. Even if they kill you, your heart and mind is still. And that they are fully forgiven for what they do to you.
     
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  5. Conscious thoughts

    Conscious thoughts Veteran Member

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    A selfless being
     
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  6. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    yes, we know babies and small children are incapable of making certain decisions about their well being. the same goes for psychologically immature people. Everyone wants to be loved but not everyone is loving.


    once we have a situation where a psychologically immature, or spiritually unhealthy person, is a threat to others, or themselves, then you can compassionately restrain them from doing so.


    we already do this in some aspect with criminals and anti-social people.
     
  7. Isolde Schulz

    Isolde Schulz Member

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    I won't pontificate as to which of many forms of "love" are better than others. What are lemons to one, may be lemonade to another. The latter can be made from the former at will. But can one will oneself to have an affinity for a human whose deficits are greater than our own? There can be a fine line between admiration and pity.
     
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  8. Evangelicalhumanist

    Evangelicalhumanist "Truth" isn't a thing...
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    Remember back to the joyful half-time entertainments at football games in Kabul, Afghanistan, where the Taliban would trot out women in burkas who had committed great sins -- like going shopping without being invigilated by a male relative -- and shot them in the head. A lot less expensive than hiring singers and dancers and building stages with lighting and sound-systems, yet still hugely entertaining ------ for those who like that sort of thing.

    No, I could never do anything except hate that sort of person.

    And we'll all be happy to know that soon after September 11, 2021, they'll be able to start up the program again, with a whole bunch of other female "stars," (soon to become angels).
     
  9. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    Do you set up a boundary between others and your heart and mind when it comes to having unconditional love?

    For example, I can give love (in general for simplicity sake) to someone who tried to murder me (in the sense I do not believe in the death penalty and any premeditated punishments). But I do have conditions in whether that express of my love is setting boundaries between myself and the other person by putting a lock on my door.... or if its unconditional and selfless, just let the person come in my house as long as I forgive them regardless what she does, it's alright.
     
  10. Isolde Schulz

    Isolde Schulz Member

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    If love were unconditional (to varying degrees in various locales), as practiced by those humans, it would not be manuevered as a form of "currency" like money. Give and take, dog eat dog, are just two paradoxes of the objective truth: that love is indeed conditional.
     
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  11. Bird123

    Bird123 Well-Known Member

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    Oh yes, given enough time, lives and lessons we will all acquire that higher level for ourselves. The beauty of God's system is that we will all get there of our own free will.

    What generates hate? Do the choices others make, cause one to hate? Is wanting to control others and their choices the real problem? Everybody wants to rule the world is mankind's greatest problem above all else.

    Let's look with a different view. We are all God's children. With that, we are all Special. We all deserve Unconditional Love just as God gives it. If God is High Intelligence, copying God in this way will prove Intelligent in the end.

    Life is about the education of God's children. In a multilevel system, one will see others learning lessons we have already learned. There are choices we could not make because we Understand. Others will see us learning lessons they have already learned. There are choices we make they could never choose because they Understand.

    Control is one of those petty things mankind holds so dear. Is control really an excuse to hate others who are learning lessons we have already learned?? Of course not!!

    There are people who can make some horrific choices. Is this an excuse to hate? What will hate get you? Hate generates more hate. It hurts not only the hated but it hurts the one hating. Is hate really an intelligent choice? Of course not!!

    Let's THINK for a moment. Unconditional Love always does what is Best for the other. If we help others learn the lesson, they could never make that horrific choice again.

    When one understands all sides, intelligence will pick the best choices. Copy God. Place Truth in their lives. Point them in the right direction. Lead them to the Higher Level we all walk toward.

    Hate them, Kill them or Help them, Fix them and Love them. Which are the Intelligent choices?

    The petty things mankind holds so dear are all around us. Hating, Judging, Condemning, Controlling, Intimidating, Coercing, Greed, Anger, Wrath, Manipulation, Pay back, and the list goes on. What do these things really result in? See them,Know them, and Understand them, for one will never be able to Love Unconditionally when one values them, holds onto them, or practices them. You will never find these petty things in God. Why? Because those petty things are not Intelligent!!!

    WE all have the power to Choose what we deem important. In fact, choosing for ourselves is an important part of God's learning system. When it all returns, one will Discover what the Best choices really are.

    In time, we will all Discover that the price for Hate will always be too High, while Unconditional Love just leads everyone to a Higher Level.

    WE were never ever meant to never make bad choices. So much learning results from those bad choices. On the other hand, we can all make it easier, and advance quicker making Intelligent choices. With that in mind, I will always do my best to Love Unconditionally. It's not only the most intelligent choice. It's how I want to define myself. How about you??

    That's what I see. It's very clear!!
     
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  12. lewisnotmiller

    lewisnotmiller Grand Hat
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    I've thought about this in a slightly different manner. I'm trying to work out if it's possible to love ONE person completely unconditionally.
    I know that it's at least very nearly possible...I have three daughters, and it's tough to imagine any situation which would diminish my love for them. But if one hurt another intentionally...I mean...as horrible as that is to think about, I think there are scenarios that would impact on my love for them, even if they are in the 'unlikely' or 'extreme' realms.

    So in terms of loving ALL people unconditionally? No...I don't see it. I try to respect people, but that is somewhat conditional.
     
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  13. Twilight Hue

    Twilight Hue The gentle embrace of twilight has become my guide

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    Too much love is as bad as too much hate.

    I agree with @The Hammer , expanding the fact that some people themselves don't harbor emotions like love or empathy, particularly psychopaths. Love isn't practical nor beneficial for those void of love themselves and who cannot feel likewise.

    Going in another direction, obsession is another form of love that is out of control , and can lead one down some difficult or even dangerous terrain.

    Extremes are never healthy. Even love.
     
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  14. blü 2

    blü 2 Well-Known Member
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    I don't hold with the word 'love' ─ when I say 'love', I refer to particular and special relationships and particular and special emotions. To generalize those to the world would make the word meaningless.

    However, I think it's possible to obtain a degree of objectivity ─ never complete, of course ─ starting with oneself (age helps here) and applied to others, so as to understand the agreeable ones and the nasty ones, and to realize the significance of background, opportunity, the genetic lottery, and fortune and misfortune more generally. And also the often mistrusted but real power of forgiveness.

    This is why I think, were there a benevolent God, [he] would never bother to invent Hell ─ [he]'d simply understand all things good and bad about each person, and heal the badness instead of wasting time ─ eternity, for goodness sake, such breathtaking inefficiency! ─ and effort punishing it.

    My own view favors decency, respect and inclusion as the norm. In reality exceptions will be forced on me from time to time, but they mustn't become the norm.
     
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  15. Deeje

    Deeje Avid Bible Student
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    Actually that is what Jesus taught...agape is a love that holds no hatred towards anyone.

    As fellow human beings, they have the same rights was we all do to make our own choices and to choose to do good instead of evil. So how do we tolerate evil people in the world? History proves that evil people do not hold sway for long and that in the end they pass off the worldly scene and hopefully are not replaced by someone worse.

    For Christians, Jesus said we are to be "no part of the world" just as he was. He did not interfere with the political situation of his day, but taught his disciples to love their fellow man as they loved themselves. His parable of the "Good Samaritan" angered the Jews because the hero of the story was a hated Samaritan and the villains were self righteous Jews.

    Exposing religious error was not something Jesus held back from speaking....but to his disciples he was the most loving of teachers. After his death, his apostles were arrested and flogged for preaching about Jesus and then told not to do it again....what was their reaction?

    Acts 5:41-42....
    "So they went out from before the Sanʹhe·drin, rejoicing because they had been counted worthy to be dishonored in behalf of his name. 42 And every day in the temple and from house to house they continued without letup teaching and declaring the good news about the Christ, Jesus."

    Imagine rejoicing after a painful flogging!? But why were they rejoicing.....? Because they were being persecuted for the right reasons. (John 15:18-21) It was proof to them that they were on the right track.
     
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  16. Aupmanyav

    Aupmanyav Be your own guru

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    IMHO, possible, even if the person is your enemy and is at war with you. Hate weakens reason, it can wrongly influence one's decisions. For example hate can make you start a war even at an inopportune moment.
     
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  17. rational experiences

    rational experiences Well-Known Member

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    As a baby human I became aware of my female holy mother's life lived heavenly records.

    Seen in visionary conditions of life changing constantly due to our heavens being constantly UFO irradiated.

    I began to see as I went to sleep my human family dying. So I asked why...always had answers given after years of meditation.

    I saw my mother coming from the unconditional living being the eternal form. Not human at all. Saw it. Felt the uncondition of its interactive release of our life. But it was not consoling.

    I cried as we no longer owned it as a human. But were taught by it.

    Why I can feel angry as cause effect relationship reasoning without guilt.
     
  18. darkskies

    darkskies Active Member

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    I think it's possible, but not healthy.
     
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  19. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    I agree, but not hating is not the same as loving unconditionally.
     
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  20. darkskies

    darkskies Active Member

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    True. I don't think unconditional love is possible.
     
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