Jeremiahcp
Well-Known Jerk
If you don't believe: Could you force yourself to believe in God?
Or
If you do believe: Could you force yourself not to believe in God?
Or
If you do believe: Could you force yourself not to believe in God?
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- Thread starter Jeremiahcp
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psychoslice
Veteran Member
I was a Christian for many years, after some time I gave up the belief in god, and Jesus as a real person, members in my church begged me and prayed for me to come back and give it another try which I did, but it didn't last love, for me personally the jig was up, and the truth for me was discovered.
Meander_Z
Member
I can't do it. I already do both all the time. It's the current natural state of my faith (if I can still call it that).
I ask my god, "How do I know that I'm not just an evolved animal imagining myself having a conversation with a god?"
His answer, "How do you know that you are not just a god imagining yourself having a conversation with an evolved animal?"
His point... This is what we are, and this is what it looks like when the divine being imagines a universe, and the universe imagines a divine being. There is nothing left to doubt. There is nothing left to prove. Everything is doubt. Everything is proof. The spaces in between are spaces for play and wild imaginings.
I ask my god, "How do I know that I'm not just an evolved animal imagining myself having a conversation with a god?"
His answer, "How do you know that you are not just a god imagining yourself having a conversation with an evolved animal?"
His point... This is what we are, and this is what it looks like when the divine being imagines a universe, and the universe imagines a divine being. There is nothing left to doubt. There is nothing left to prove. Everything is doubt. Everything is proof. The spaces in between are spaces for play and wild imaginings.
Deathbydefault
Apistevist Asexual Atheist
I could, but it wouldn't be true belief.
The closest I'll ever get would be through putting myself in a hypothetical situation where a belief in god is necessary.
The question has at most a sliver of meaning, since "God" is such a vaguely defined idea.
That said, assuming a stereotypical Abrahamic-styled God, I just don't see any way of doing so that does not involve mental harm of some form.
Jeremiahcp
Well-Known Jerk
"since "God" is such a vaguely defined idea."
I think that depends on who is reading the question.
Indeed it does! That is the point.
God is a human construct, not an independently existing entity.
Jeremiahcp
Well-Known Jerk
Then the "meaning" of the question will be relative to who is reading it, since God's vagueness is also relative.
I don't believe in god. I don't think I could force myself to believe in god as it would be quite a leap in my intellectual evolution and wouldn't be limited to one thing but would affect other ideas too like creationism and morality etc.
YmirGF
Bodhisattva in Recovery
I could not force myself to believe anything but I could outwardly act like I did believe enough to pass scrutiny if I had to.
To me, it isn't just a matter of us knowing God, but is more about whether God knows us. He is looking at us as individuals to see if we will make valuable citizens of his incoming kingdom. If we qualify, he will find us....even when we didn't think we were looking for him. 
Like most words, the word "belief" has more than one meaning. People sometimes use the word to refer to what they know to be the case. I might say, for instance, that I believe there is a tree in my yard. I might as well say that I know there is a tree in my yard because my belief is based on knowledge that there is a tree in my yard.
People also sometimes use the word "belief" to refer to their convictions, in the absence of knowledge, that something is the case. For instance, I might say I believe in trickle down economics even though I have little or no evidence or knowledge that trickle down economics is the case.
It seems to me that one cannot force oneself to believe or disbelieve in matters that one has knowledge of. But one can force oneself to believe or disbelieve in matters that one has no knowledge of. It's done in religion and politics every day.
People also sometimes use the word "belief" to refer to their convictions, in the absence of knowledge, that something is the case. For instance, I might say I believe in trickle down economics even though I have little or no evidence or knowledge that trickle down economics is the case.
It seems to me that one cannot force oneself to believe or disbelieve in matters that one has knowledge of. But one can force oneself to believe or disbelieve in matters that one has no knowledge of. It's done in religion and politics every day.
Reggie Miller
Well-Known Member
Absolutely not.
Yep. In essence you are asking whether our personal understandings of "God" sustain the idea of forcing oneself to believe in his/its existence.
Kuzcotopia
If you can read this, you are as lucky as I am.
I think "force" is the wrong word. It suggest that you put a great effort into it. If either scenarios happen, I'd think it's more about giving up.
A good example of this is how Norma Leah McCorvey converted to Christianity. Once she lost anonimity, she was harassed by Christians incessantly. In fact, a church got a permit to move in next door to her house, just so they could harass her 24/7.
Finally, she gave up and converted. Guess what? They all embrace her like family. I can't find a clip, but it's in the abortion documentary "Lake of Fire."
I'm not including all faiths or people in this, but there can be awful psychological, and even physical, tortures inflicted on people in the name of a god. The pressure can be enormous if you're unlucky enough to have that kind of family.
"Am I holding up four fingers or five."
Jeremiahcp
Well-Known Jerk
And I have no problem with that.
Nup.
Jeremiahcp
Well-Known Jerk
As the person asking the question, I think force is the right word.
"Finally, she gave up and converted."
Did she just convert, or did she believe?
No.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
No. I don't know what that means in the abrahamic point of view. God, if I used the term, isn't independent of ourselves and "he" is not a he and he cannot do things as an entity or person. He's not a person/spirit.
How could you force yourself to believe in something that doesn't exist unless you are pretending or imaging what you'd like to be god and, with that idea, let that idea help you?
Some people say let god contact you; and, I find that odd. How does an non-existent entity contact you? What characteristics does he have that doesn't not mirror the needs and wants of humans (a reflection of humans). And if we are a reflect of god, is there a way to describe god without poetic language.
I would have to experience god to believe in god. Outside of that, I can't believe in something that doesnt exist unless I pretend or entertain the idea that he does.