If you could ask one question to God?

[Thief]

God would know in advance that a person wouldn't want to be here but would still either: allow them to exist or directly create them. Why not be merciful and not create them/allow them to exist in the first place?

yeah....I want to home
so to speak

but not having this life....
I would have been another mirror image of heaven
with nothing unique to speak of

have you considered?
the imperfections are entertaining

 

[Aupmanyav]

have you considered? the imperfections are entertaining

Ask those who suffer.

That is ludicrous because God gave humans free will to choose whether to do good or evil.

It is even more ludicrous that God gives free will but not the intelligence to understand what is good and what is evil. The whole idea is to make most humans suffer here on earth and then in hell for eternity. God loves cruelty, he is a sadist.

 

[Trailblazer]

A common claim, but aside from that what's your evidence?

The evidence is that people make choices and they are aware of it when they do.

Regardless, it still doesn't absolve god of the crime of omission. He could stop these people from ending up in hell by keeping them from being born. However, he chooses not to. In effect he prefers to let them suffer in an eternal hell..

Any crimes that are committed are crimes of commission and they are crimes humans commit.
People can stop themselves from ending up in hell by living by the Golden Rule and not being selfish.

There is no eternal hell but rather hell is distance from God, and there is always a chance for anyone to get close to God if they reach out for the mercy of God. Nothing is permanent as people can progress in the spiritual world.

 

[Skwim]

The evidence is that people make choices and they are aware of it when they do.

And the reason they make the so-called "choices" they do is because? Because they are predetermined.

Any crimes that are committed are crimes of commission and they are crimes humans commit.

Doesn't really say anything does it: Things that are done are things of doing, and they are things people do.

People can stop themselves from ending up in hell by living by the Golden Rule and not being selfish.

If only. Trouble is, free will is but an illusion, We do what we do because we can do no differently.

There is no eternal hell but rather hell is distance from God,

But the Christian hell, which is the hell I was referring to, is one of eternal suffering.

and there is always a chance for anyone to get close to God if they reach out for the mercy of God. Nothing is permanent as people can progress in the spiritual world.

Gotta disagree. We do what we do because we can't do any differently.

.

 

[JJ50]

God, why did you help a poster on another forum find their lost keys but not help people in mortal danger?

 

[Jos]

have you considered?
the imperfections are entertaining

They're also really distressing and can actually cause a lot of suffering as another person pointed out.

 

[ChristineM]

Wrong. Yhwh forbids good and evil. The first commandment is not to kill. The sermon on the mount where Jesus gives non-resistance. The white horse of the apocalypse who conquers to conquer. And finally, the final battle between good and evil, armagedon.

I have quoted it to you before, as have others, seems you deliberately ignore the bits of the bible that dont dont agree with you

Isaiah 45:7 KJV - I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things. KJV

Perhaps your bible is new fangled one, cherry picked so all the bad bits are removed

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

God knew what He was doing, we just do not know the reasons for all of it because we are not All-Knowing....

IOW... evil could be excused and suffering could be seen as all for the best if we had a better understanding of how things work?

Do you ever apply this sort of thinking to anyone but God?

"Yeah, that mass murderer had evil intent, but it's a good thing he blew up that busful of kids - we figure that was all for the best somehow, so the world is presumably better off because of what he did."

 

[Trailblazer]

IOW... evil could be excused and suffering could be seen as all for the best if we had a better understanding of how things work?

No, if we had a better understanding of how things work, we would better understand why there is suffering in the world. It has to be for the best because God is All-Knowing and All-Wise, so God knows what is in the best interest of humans. Because of the human ego some people think they know more than God but they cannot know more because that is logically impossible.
We already know why there is evil in the world, because people have free will and choose to do evil. God has no part in it.

Do you ever apply this sort of thinking to anyone but God?

No, I don't because God is infallible so God does not make any mistakes God can never be blameworthy, whereas humans are fallible and makes all kinds of mistakes and are often blameworthy.

 

[Trailblazer]

And the reason they make the so-called "choices" they do is because? Because they are predetermined.

Choices are not predetermined, that is a contradiction in terms.
Some things are predestined but not everything is.

If only. Trouble is, free will is but an illusion, We do what we do because we can do no differently.

I have to disagree with that. Free will is what causes everything to happen.

But the Christian hell, which is the hell I was referring to, is one of eternal suffering.

The Christian hell does not exist.

Gotta disagree. We do what we do because we can't do any differently..

I do not believe in predetermination. I consider it a cop-out.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

No, if we had a better understanding of how things work, we would better understand why there is suffering in the world. It has to be for the best because God is All-Knowing and All-Wise, so God knows what is in the best interest of humans.

So therefore, we can be sure that the suffering God allows is in our best interest, right?

Because of the human ego some people think they know more than God but they cannot know more because that is logically impossible.
We already know why there is evil in the world, because people have free will and choose to do evil. God has no part in it.

So God has no moral obligation to act in the face of evil?

I personally feel an obligation to act. Why wouldn't God? Is your god less moral than I am?

No, I don't because God is infallible so God does not make any mistakes God can never be blameworthy, whereas humans are fallible and makes all kinds of mistakes and are often blameworthy.

If God in his infallible wisdom chooses to allow some sort of suffering - a mass shooting - then we can infer from God's actions that this particular suffering is approved by God.

But how can the same mass shooting be a good thing when we're talking about God's role in it, but a bad thing when we're talking about the shooter's role? It's the same event.

 

[Thief]

God loves cruelty, he is a sadist.

so......you think God gave command?
Do unto Job all but kill him

as compared to?
Do unto Job as you will
all but kill him

 

[Aupmanyav]

I do not know your fables, but if you think a God exists, then this is what I see him doing in the world.

 

[viole]

Yeah, entangling beaks would have been just as exciting. Good that he did not use Salmon as our model.Mom and Pa, sometime in a December cold night.

Yes, and having a beak would also avoid a lot of expensive visits to dentists and such.

Ciao

- viole

 

[MonkeyFire]

What are you talking about? God creates evil. He even admits as much in Isaiah 45:7

"I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things."

.​

The forbidden fruit is knowledge of good and evil. It's about the angel of morality being tempted by hate.

 

[MonkeyFire]

I have quoted it to you before, as have others, seems you deliberately ignore the bits of the bible that dont dont agree with you

Isaiah 45:7 KJV - I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things. KJV

Perhaps your bible is new fangled one, cherry picked so all the bad bits are removed

Compassion allows for evil to exist in a world of salvation. If there were no evil there would be no hate and thus non-violence would colapse.

 

[ChristineM]

Compassion allows for evil to exist in a world of salvation. If there were no evil there would be no hate and thus non-violence would colapse.

So back to square one... God created evil before apologetics became the vogue.

 

[MonkeyFire]

So back to square one... God created evil before apologetics became the vogue.

God created evil in order to have ultimate compassion.

 

[ChristineM]

God created evil in order to have ultimate compassion.

Ahh, so now you change your mind but add a rider that he kills innocent children, allows mass killings, destroys the twin towers because he is compassionate. Wow.

 

[MonkeyFire]

Ahh, so now you change your mind but add a rider that he kills innocent children, allows mass killings, destroys the twin towers because he is compassionate. Wow.

No he's a pacifist.