1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

How would the Buddha answer me?

Discussion in 'Religions Q&A' started by ValdresRose, Dec 12, 2020.

  1. ValdresRose

    ValdresRose Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2020
    Messages:
    116
    Ratings:
    +70
    Religion:
    Norrøn, Theravada Buddhist
    My nephew is adamant that in the Christian Bible it say that taking one's own life is condemnation to his interpretation of Hell. The Bible was written by wealthy men who were slave owners and didn't want their slave ending their lives. Is it a condemnation and/or a sign of very low self worth, if I choose to terminate my life if I become terminally ill?
     
  2. Twilight Hue

    Twilight Hue The gentle embrace of twilight has become my guide

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2009
    Messages:
    34,326
    Ratings:
    +14,407
    Religion:
    Philosophical Buddhism
    Best answer is complete silence.
     
  3. crossfire

    crossfire Antinomian feminist heretic freak ☿
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2012
    Messages:
    11,990
    Ratings:
    +4,845
    Religion:
    ☿ Mercuræn Mahayana Buddhist & Pastafarian
    This sutta should be helpful: if you have any questions, ask.
    SuttaCentral
     
  4. ValdresRose

    ValdresRose Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2020
    Messages:
    116
    Ratings:
    +70
    Religion:
    Norrøn, Theravada Buddhist
    Thanks. Yes, I do have questions: How does Mahamudra - the 4 Seals, resolve this conflict, that being, is it a sin in Christian religions to terminate one's own life when the authors of the Bible put the condemnation in the book to protect their own slave property? And does it violate the Buddhist principle of stains by ignorance when a person knows they're life is going to end and they choose to terminate their life before natural causes end it?
     
    #4 ValdresRose, Dec 13, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2020
  5. ValdresRose

    ValdresRose Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2020
    Messages:
    116
    Ratings:
    +70
    Religion:
    Norrøn, Theravada Buddhist
    Thanks. For such a fundamental question that all human kind deals with do you really, honestly believe that Siddhartha Gautama, the Buddha, would remain silent? Would it be fair to say that within each of us there is a Buddha? And we would be silent on the subject of voluntary life termination?
     
  6. crossfire

    crossfire Antinomian feminist heretic freak ☿
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2012
    Messages:
    11,990
    Ratings:
    +4,845
    Religion:
    ☿ Mercuræn Mahayana Buddhist & Pastafarian
    The Four Seals (which is a Mahayana thing, not a Theravada thing) don't have anything to do with it, imo. (As an aside, human trafficking/slave trade is considered to be Wrong Livelihood of the Eightfold Path)
    It would depend on the momentum from the state of mind at the moment of death.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  7. ajay0

    ajay0 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2012
    Messages:
    2,170
    Ratings:
    +1,474
    I found this link on the Buddhist perspective of suicide useful...

    Buddhism And Suicide: Death Doesn’t End the Cycle of Suffering

     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  8. Left Coast

    Left Coast Happy Spring!
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2019
    Messages:
    6,196
    Ratings:
    +9,217
    Religion:
    Dharmic Dabbler
    ***THREAD MOVED TO RELIGIONS Q&A***
     
    • Like Like x 1
  9. ValdresRose

    ValdresRose Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2020
    Messages:
    116
    Ratings:
    +70
    Religion:
    Norrøn, Theravada Buddhist
    Thank you. As I am a beginner to the group there will be mistakes in how to post and how to phrase a new thread. Your guidance will be appreciated.
     
    #9 ValdresRose, Dec 14, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2020
  10. ValdresRose

    ValdresRose Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2020
    Messages:
    116
    Ratings:
    +70
    Religion:
    Norrøn, Theravada Buddhist
    Ajay0, please do not use the "S" word. A better choice is life termination. I know, - a rose is a rose.... but the "S" word carries certain negative connotations. When a person chooses to terminate their life as a result of extreme suffering through medical conditions the process of karma does not apply, unless that person has a very low self worth. It is perhaps not possible for a person who has worthiness to terminate there life, why would a person who values their life terminate it? A person who has a very low self worth entertains thoughts of life terminate almost every day.

    When a healthy minded person has a cancer tumor that is pushing against their spinal cord and endures unbearable pain the only remedy for relief is to use morphine. In that case the brain is virtually dead, only the body sustains itself.

    As a Buddhist, condemnation to Hell doesn't apply since Hell doesn't exist. But to a grown person who is a "born again Christian" it does apply. So how would the Buddha respond?
     
  11. metis

    metis aged ecumenical anthropologist

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2013
    Messages:
    34,442
    Ratings:
    +16,255
    Religion:
    ecumenical & naturalistic Catholic
    In Catholicism, we are taught not to judge, plus there can be reasons that a person may commit suicide that may not be held against them. My son tried twice, my one granddaughter at least seven times that we know of, and both suffer from bipolar disorder. Our son is 48 and owns his own business, and our 21 year old granddaughter just graduated from her university with a degree in chemistry/mathematics combo and will be starting grad school next fall.

    Both are now doing better with the b/p disorder, but we still say our prayers.
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  12. syo

    syo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2016
    Messages:
    3,855
    Ratings:
    +1,089
    Religion:
    pagan, omnist
    Death always comes. Why hurry??? Eat lots of icecream.

    In my opinion, society should do all the favours of terminally ill people. Free food, free travel, etc. PlayStation games. Death will come, you don't want to hurry it, WHY???
     
  13. ajay0

    ajay0 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2012
    Messages:
    2,170
    Ratings:
    +1,474
    There is a spiritual process called Sallekhana in Jainism and Prayopavesa in Hinduism wherein a person disabled by extreme senility or very poor health conditions due to disease commits suicide by fasting. This is only allowed only in cases of terminal disease or great disability especially in old age.

    This is allowed because a healthy body is needed for performing one's material and spiritual duties. If the person is diseased his duty then is to restore his health through all means possible. If however this proves to be impossible, especially due to old age, the person does not incur karma by committing suicide by fasting. Such a death is also a spiritual austerity in itself adding merit due to the self-restraint and self-discipline involved in denial of bodily comforts and endurance.


    However the young and healthy are not supposed to commit suicide as that would be tantamount to cowardice which is considered a sin. It is only the elderly and terminally diseased in a critically weakened state who can perform sallekhan/prayopavesa.

    Those who are suffering from mental illhealth or depression should strive to gain their mental health back through practice of mindfulness, virtue and approved practices. This is their duty and willfully escaping from one's duty due to cowardice is considered sinful.


    Endurance of pain equanimously is a spiritual austerity in itself. I know of cancer patients undergoing surgery who did so practicing meditation or vipassana. This enabled them to endure the rigors of surgery and treatment better and gain spiritual merit in the process.

    Generally in most religions, patient endurance of disease or ill-health is said to be meritorious and wipes out negative karma.

    Hellish worlds has been described in Buddhism. Imo, the state of your mind, strong or weak, positive or negative, attracts similar circumstances after death.

    However unlike Christianity, these hellish conditions are of a temporary nature and not permanent. You are only sowing what you reap, and no one has sowed infinite bad karma to reap eternal hell.

    If a person can die mindfully, it is considered to be very auspicious and meritorious. But most people become unconscious then mainly due to fearful imagination and terror of death. Steady and diligent practice of mindfulness can enable a person to be mindful to the very end and even in death.

    Death is considered to be a very beautiful process when it is experienced mindfully.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  14. crossfire

    crossfire Antinomian feminist heretic freak ☿
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2012
    Messages:
    11,990
    Ratings:
    +4,845
    Religion:
    ☿ Mercuræn Mahayana Buddhist & Pastafarian
    There are hell realms in Buddhism. They are just impermanent, like everything else.
     
  15. PearlSeeker

    PearlSeeker Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2019
    Messages:
    988
    Ratings:
    +327
    Religion:
    Christian
    In Christianity there is also universal salvation.

    Apocatastasis - Wikipedia
     
  16. ajay0

    ajay0 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2012
    Messages:
    2,170
    Ratings:
    +1,474
    But you can see that Origen who promoted reincarnation as well as Apocatastasis, was condemned by the Councils of Constantinople which instead taught and emphasized the existence of eternal damnation and explicitly rejected "the restoration of all things,".
     
  17. IndigoChild5559

    IndigoChild5559 Loving God and my neighbor as myself.

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2018
    Messages:
    5,823
    Ratings:
    +2,539
    Religion:
    Judaism
    Wouldn't the Buddha tell you that life is an illusion? There is no Boddhi tree.
     
Loading...