How is the immaterial soul connected to material body?(theists only)

[Logical Faith]

Hello. I want this conversation to be made between theists, so no atheists are welcome to participate.

Brothers, since the soul is immaterial, outside of space and time, how does it receives signals from the body and the rest of the outside world? Isnt a connection made only between material parts?

Thank you.

 

[syo]

In my religion a body is an incarnated soul. So they are connected.

 

[wizanda]

From within my NDE, i left my body by going down and through my heart... So personally would think our soul is connected to us via our heart, which is why the heart feels things before the brain.

 

[George-ananda]

Hello. I want this conversation to be made between theists, so no atheists are welcome to participate.

Brothers, since the soul is immaterial, outside of space and time, how does it receives signals from the body and the rest of the outside world? Isnt a connection made only between material parts?

Thank you.

Great question. I'll give you my understanding from eastern and theosophical sources I respect. Western science and religion are pretty much clueless on this question. Humans are actually multiple interpenetrating bodies; physical, etheric and astral-mental. There is a hierarchy of realms from the dense physical up to much higher realms. Each realm is at its own vibrational and dimensional (beyond our normal three dimensions) such that higher realms are not perceptible by lower realms. Thought starts at the highest level and is carried down to the next lower (more dense) level by sympathetic vibrations. So for example, at death, there is a dropping off of the last link in the chain (the physical body) and the higher bodies continue on without the densest body (as reported in Near Death Experiences).

This is a vast subject and the above is the basic idea of how signals are received.

 

[Jainarayan]

Stuart Hameroff has a theory he calls quantum consciousnes. Is it the soul? Maybe. http://www.quantumconsciousness.org/

 

[DawudTalut]

Hello. I want this conversation to be made between theists, so no atheists are welcome to participate.

Brothers, since the soul is immaterial, outside of space and time, how does it receives signals from the body and the rest of the outside world? Isnt a connection made only between material parts?

Thank you.

Peace be on you.
Soul is latent in basic chemicals related to making of human, as fire is latent in flint.

"...soul is a fine light developed inside the body and which is nurtured in the womb. To begin with it is hidden and imperceptible and later it is made manifest. From the very beginning its essence is present in the sperm. It is related to the sperm in a mysterious manner by the design and command and will of God. It is a bright and illumined quality of the sperm. It cannot be said that it is a part of the sperm as matter is part of matter, nor can it be said that it comes from outside or falls upon the earth and gets mixed with the matter of the sperm. It is latent in the sperm as fire is latent in the flint. "

"..As the soul is affected by physical conduct, in the same way sometimes the soul affects the body..."

"...there is a mysterious relationship between the soul and the body which is beyond the ken of man...."

page 10, 11, 14 and more @ https://www.alislam.org/library/books/Philosophy-of-Teachings-of-Islam.pdf
An Ahmadiyya-Muslim resource

n.b= the word soul appears 97 times in above links

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Human Soul and Science

https://www.alislam.org/egazette/articles/Human-Soul-and-Science-201009.pdf

 

[Acim]

Hello. I want this conversation to be made between theists, so no atheists are welcome to participate.

Brothers, since the soul is immaterial, outside of space and time, how does it receives signals from the body and the rest of the outside world? Isnt a connection made only between material parts?

Thank you.

I don't think it's technically possible for material parts to connect (at a quantum level). So, there's that.

The distinction between soul and spirit impacts perspective of the question. Both immaterial. One (I think) is assumed to be 'contained' to an individual, the other said to permeate all (non material) existence, as a collective whole.

I have no way of proceeding without introducing concept of Mind which I see as immaterial and that which is Knowledge, of (or from) Spirit, shared with all souls. I see (split) Mind as manifesting existence, I'd say illusion, of physicality, namely own self as 'body.' The body itself being inherently neutral (for lack of better word) while split in Mind (between Knowledge and lack thereof) sees body as useful tool or own little kingdom, and/or entirety of self existence, where Spirit can enter not.

Spirit / Knowledge equals Mind, body / thinking equals mind.

Soul, utilizing Mind, sends all signals to body for all conceivable purposes. These signals (or ideas) never leave their source. Within illusion (physical existence) the signals certainly do appear to leave the mind, to the point where mind has possibly nothing to do with signals that body is sending back to mind. Once the split is perceived as occurring at that level, where body is essentially autonomous from mind, then signals from 'rest of the world' are seen as plausibly having nothing to do with Mind.

So, essentially self deception is constantly at work within illusion of body as self. Upheld by denial that asserts "I did not make this. I am not responsible for this world outside of me." This, along with a few other fundamental core assertions are what signals the body are sending back to mind, thinking (or hoping) Mind (if it actually exists) will change the external world to be more pleasing, more aligned with current desires. Whereas Mind, in my understanding, still sees all of that (body/external world) as inherently neutral and given all meaning, purpose and understanding from mind. Ideas really do not leave their source.

To come back to OP inquiry and use those terms, as best I can, soul receives signals from body and rest of the world because it is solely responsible for sending them out. Though 'out' is probably not the best term, for they never left their source.

 

[Skwim]

Hello. I want this conversation to be made between theists, so no atheists are welcome to participate.

Just be aware that although atheists may not be welcome they still have a right to post here. ....................Anyway . . . . . . . . . . . . .

Brothers, since the soul is immaterial, outside of space and time, how does it receives signals from the body and the rest of the outside world? Isnt a connection made only between material parts?

I'm curious, what is your evidence that the soul is outside space and time? And, how do you know it receives signals from the body and the rest of the outside world? And just what kinds of signals are these?


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[Andraste]

Yes I'm interested in the connection (possibly) of the soul and Quantum mechanics.... But would love to see the Evidence of it ..... Bit worried about it having an Islamic claim ... As Islam is a relatively new religion in the scheme of things.... Religions long gone were far older than Islam before they died out ... If there is a genuine connection between soul and the Quantum multiverse it's going to be natural and neutral.....

 

[Subhankar Zac]

In brief, the concept of Purusha is simply the universal consciousness that exists together in all living entities.
Consciousness is the ever-existing, older than time itself and immortal aspect of living beings that live within us.
However, this consciousness or ATMAN is not a part of the body.
Enlightenment means to realize that each of us are actually consciousness and that the body is simply a temporary vehicle.
It is difficult to explain it entirely and there are many many more explanations to it.
So, this is simply my perception.

 

[GoodbyeDave]

Just be aware that although atheists may not be welcome they still have a right to post here

No they do not. The rules of this section state

Same Faith Debates are restricted to members of specified group(s). If you are not a member of the specified group(s), you are not allowed to participate in the debate at all, even if it is to ask a question.

 

[GoodbyeDave]

Why assume everything can be explained? Every explanation has a stopping point. Why did the apple fall to earth? Because of gravity. Why do bodies produce gravity? Because they distort space-time. Why do they distort space-time? Because that's just what they do.

The soul and body interact because that's what soul and bodies do. In fact souls can even interact with other bodies in some cases. Parapsychological research shows that experienced healers can alter the growth rate of bacteria or the activity of enzymes.

 

[Skwim]

No they do not. The rules of this section state

My error.


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[Clear]

Logical Faith asked in the OP : " Brothers, since the soul is immaterial, outside of space and time, how does it receives signals from the body and the rest of the outside world? Isnt a connection made only between material parts?"

Why do you think the spirit associated with a body is immaterial? If the spirit is material in nature it changes the base considerations.

Good luck Logical Faith in coming up with the answers and understanding you want.

Clear

 

[Deeje]

Hello. I want this conversation to be made between theists, so no atheists are welcome to participate.

Brothers, since the soul is immaterial, outside of space and time, how does it receives signals from the body and the rest of the outside world? Isnt a connection made only between material parts?

Thank you.

Can you show me in the Bible where it says that we "have" a soul? In Hebrew, the word "soul" is neʹphesh [נֶפֶשׁ] or Greek, psy·kheʹ [ψυχή])

When I read Genesis 2:7 " then the Lord God formed the man of dust from the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living creature." (ESV)
The word translated "creature" here is "neʹphesh".
In the NABRE it says...." then the Lord God formed the man out of the dust of the ground and blew into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being."

So a soul is a "creature" or "living being". Animals and fish are also called "souls" in Genesis, (Genesis 1:20, 24) so unless we assume that animals and fish also go to heaven and exist as spirits after death, there is no scripture in the Bible that says we "have" a soul that departs from the body at death. We are a "soul" and souls die. (Ezek 18:4)

The consciousness of man requires the working of a material brain. At death, the brain dies along with all the other organs that maintain life.
The spirit in man is the breath that keeps him alive. As demonstrated in Genesis 2:7 giving man breath made him a soul.
When the last breath leaves the body, the soul that is us dies. There is no consciousness after death. (Ecclesiastes 9:5, 10; Psalm 146:4)

 

[rusra02]

Hello. I want this conversation to be made between theists, so no atheists are welcome to participate.

Brothers, since the soul is immaterial, outside of space and time, how does it receives signals from the body and the rest of the outside world? Isnt a connection made only between material parts?

Thank you.

The soul is not immaterial, according to the Bible. (Genesis 2:7)

 

[GoodbyeDave]

Can you show me in the Bible where it says that we "have" a soul? In Hebrew, the word "soul" is neʹphesh [נֶפֶשׁ] or Greek, psy·kheʹ [ψυχή])

Can you show me why I should believe a book written by a bunch of ignorant tribesmen over 2000 years ago? One can be a theist without accepting the Bible!

 

[atanu]

Hello. I want this conversation to be made between theists, so no atheists are welcome to participate.
Brothers, since the soul is immaterial, outside of space and time, how does it receives signals from the body and the rest of the outside world? Isnt a connection made only between material parts?
Thank you.

As per Vedanta Hinduism, and particularly Advaita Vedanta, the so-called material and immaterial are both consciousness (which we are). There is actually no real dichotomy and thus no problem of communication. Consciousness assumes apparent diverse forms, itself remaining the same.

In a treatise called Yoga Vashisth, Sage Vashisth asked Prince Rama the same question and explained that a flesh-bone arm that apparently moves in response to an intangible command, is actually a 'heap/bundle of sensation made of awareness (touch consciousness)', of a shape of arm. Then later he also explained "Rama, that mountain you see is not a solid mountain as senses make you believe."

Meditators might have realised this. As one relaxes more and more, the body sense becomes subtler, and on rare occasions (successful meditation), the body outline vanishes, while awareness remains intact. One gets the idea that the body sense is upheld by tension.

 

[Deeje]

Can you show me why I should believe a book written by a bunch of ignorant tribesmen over 2000 years ago? One can be a theist without accepting the Bible!

I have no doubt that people can call themselves whatever they like. Theism is mere belief in gods, whatever that person perceives them to be.

Personal beliefs to the contrary do not make the Creator go away, nor does unbelief make his word invalid. We will all answer to the same Judge at the end of the day, regardless of what we believe about anything. I believe that no amount of protesting will alter that.

We will have all used the free will given to us in various ways, so we have to hope that we have chosen wisely.