How can a Jew reject Jesus as the Messiah?

[metis]

I assume it would have been incredibly easy for Jesus to say: "No, child, you and your kin are not dogs. I simply have other priorities."

And this is why I tend to have a different view of Jesus versus my fundamentalist friends. Jesus was a human, not a god, therefore he exhibited human iidiosyncrasies, including anger. At one point, for another example, he tells Peter "Get behind me Satan", which isn't exactly a compliment.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Let me just briefly mention is that with the Catholic "understanding" of the Trinity, Jesus and the Holy Spirit are of God but not exactly the same as God. Since this is beyond our ability to more fully comprehend, we often refer to it as being the "Mystery of the Trinity".

No, the Son and the Holy Spirit are God. I don't know where you're getting that from.

 

[Harel13]

To understand what Jesus said one has to understand the context of the Bible verses. Jesus didn't call the Canaanite woman a dog in a derogatory way. Why did Jesus call the Canaanite woman a dog? | GotQuestions.org

Oh, now I get it. Jesus called her his "pet". Yeah, that's wayyy better.

 

[Skywalker]

Oh, now I get it. Jesus called her his "pet". Yeah, that's wayyy better.

He was testing her faith. Why did Jesus call the Canaanite woman a dog? | GotQuestions.org

So, according to both the context and language involved, Jesus wasn’t referring to the Canaanite woman as a “dog,” either directly or indirectly. He wasn’t using an epithet or racial slur but making a point about the priorities He’d been given by God. He was also testing the faith of the woman and teaching an important lesson to His disciples.

 

[Harel13]

He was testing her faith. Why did Jesus call the Canaanite woman a dog? | GotQuestions.org

So if you're testing someone's faith, you can lord over them and call them your pets?

 

[Skywalker]

So if you're testing someone's faith, you can lord over them and call them your pets?

Jesus doing certain things was different because He is God. 6. The Day Jesus Went AWOL (Luke 2:39-52) | Bible.org

Third, I believe that Jesus remained on in Jerusalem because He would not have been given permission to stay there. Think about it for a moment. What do you think Mary and Joseph would have said in response to this request: “Can I stay on in Jerusalem for a few days to discuss the Old Testament and theology with the leading teachers of Israel?” More than now, children were to be seen and not heard. I can’t imagine our Lord’s earthly parents giving Him permission to do what He needed to do. Thus, He did not ask them.

Finally, and most importantly, Jesus did not ask permission to stay on in Jerusalem because He was God. On one level, the level from which Mary and Joseph saw it, Jesus was but a young boy, a boy incapable of making such critical decisions, a boy who was not old enough to stay by Himself in Jerusalem, a boy who was too young to be discussing the Scriptures with the finest teachers in Israel. But while He was a human being, a 12 year-old boy, He was also God incarnate, just as the angel had said to Mary and Joseph years before (Matt. 1:20-25; Luke 1:32, 35). On the divine level, God did not need to have man’s permission to act any way He saw fit, nor was it required of God to explain His actions to man. Indeed, God is even free to do those things which cause men pain and consternation. It is only the fact that Jesus was fully God (as well as fully man) that explains how He could act as He did and not be wrong for so doing. If it were any other child, we would have sided with the parents, but since the child is the Son of God, we quickly acknowledge that He was right. Jesus, unlike any other 12 year-old in history, was God.

 

[Harel13]

Jesus doing certain things was different because He is God. 6. The Day Jesus Went AWOL (Luke 2:39-52) | Bible.org

So if you're god you can call people dogs and pets and still expect mankind to be kind to one another?

 

[Skywalker]

So if you're god you can call people dogs and pets and still expect mankind to be kind to one another?

The context of Matthew 15:21-28 doesn't mention Jesus calling the Canaanite woman a dog or a pet. Why did Jesus call the Canaanite woman a dog? | GotQuestions.org

So, according to both the context and language involved, Jesus wasn’t referring to the Canaanite woman as a “dog,” either directly or indirectly. He wasn’t using an epithet or racial slur but making a point about the priorities He’d been given by God. He was also testing the faith of the woman and teaching an important lesson to His disciples.

 

[Harel13]

The context of Matthew 15:21-28 doesn't mention Jesus calling the Canaanite woman a dog or a pet. Why did Jesus call the Canaanite woman a dog? | GotQuestions.org

You realize that up until now you agreed that Jesus did indeed call the woman a dog. Why are you flipping now? If you think you made a mistake, I think you should say so.

 

[Skywalker]

You realize that up until now you agreed that Jesus did indeed call the woman a dog. Why are you flipping now? If you think you made a mistake, I think you should say so.

Jesus didn't literally mean that the woman was a dog or a pet.

 

[metis]

No, the Son and the Holy Spirit are God. I don't know where you're getting that from.

Nope.

For just one example, when asked when the end-of-times would be, Jesus said that he didn't know as only the Father would know for sure. And there's many more examples like this.

Even though he's not a Catholic, Bart Ehrman does an excellent job dealing with this in his book "How Jesus Became God". His main point of contention is that the first century leaders of the Church were not all in agreement as to the specificity of Jesus' relationship with God but that they generally knew he was of God in some way. This eventually all led to the Trinitarian concept that had developed even prior to the Council of Nicea, which included a compromise to bring those in Arianism aboard.

But, this relationship is rather complicated ["the Mystery of the Trinity"] because it is at least somewhat unknown. Thus, when many began to teach this within the Church, simplifying this by saying that both Jesus and the Holy Spirit are God because of their essence, thus invoking Aristotle's & Plato's concept, which would be quite familiar to the Greeks especially. And since the NT was largely written in Koine Greek and written to a scholarly audience versed in Greek, there ya go.

So, are Jesus and the Holy Spirit God? Well, if we use essence, the answer is yes.

 

[Harel13]

Jesus didn't literally mean that the woman was a dog or a pet.

Let's set that aside for a moment, because we have a more pressing issue at hand: Did he call the woman a dog or not?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Nope.

For just one example, when asked when the end-of-times would be, Jesus said that he didn't know as only the Father would know for sure. And there's many more examples like this.

Even though he's not a Catholic, Bart Ehrman does an excellent job dealing with this in his book "How Jesus Became God". His main point of contention is that the first century leaders of the Church were not all in agreement as to the specificity of Jesus' relationship with God but that they generally knew he was of God in some way. This eventually all led to the Trinitarian concept that had developed even prior to the Council of Nicea, which included a compromise to bring those in Arianism aboard.

But, this relationship is rather complicated ["the Mystery of the Trinity"] because it is at least somewhat unknown. Thus, when many began to teach this within the Church, simplifying this by saying that both Jesus and the Holy Spirit are God because of their essence, thus invoking Aristotle's & Plato's concept, which would be quite familiar to the Greeks especially. And since the NT was largely written in Koine Greek and written to a scholarly audience versed in Greek, there ya go.

So, are Jesus and the Holy Spirit God? Well, if we use essence, the answer is yes.

I'm sorry, but that's just how it is. Jesus Christ is God, and the Holy Spirit is God according to the Trinity.

Jesus Is God
Is the Holy Spirit God?

 

[Skywalker]

Let's set that aside for a moment, because we have a more pressing issue at hand: Did he call the woman a dog or not?

The term dog has negative connotations, like that of a promiscuous man. He didn't mean it in that way. Why did Jesus call the Canaanite woman a dog? | GotQuestions.org

So, according to both the context and language involved, Jesus wasn’t referring to the Canaanite woman as a “dog,” either directly or indirectly. He wasn’t using an epithet or racial slur but making a point about the priorities He’d been given by God. He was also testing the faith of the woman and teaching an important lesson to His disciples.

 

[Harel13]

The term dog has negative connotations, like that of a promiscuous man. He didn't mean it in that way. Why did Jesus call the Canaanite woman a dog? | GotQuestions.org

So he did.

And was Jesus unable to use a term that had only positive connotations?

 

[Skywalker]

So he did.

And was Jesus unable to use a term that had only positive connotations?

God does everything with order and a purpose. God used that term in his parable because it was meaningful to what he was talking about. Why did Jesus call the Canaanite woman a dog? | GotQuestions.org

Jesus frequently tested people to prove their intentions, often through response questions or challenges (see John 4:16–18; and 4:50–53). His response to the Canaanite woman is similar. In testing her, Jesus declined her request and explained that she had no legitimate expectation of His help. The woman, however, lived out the principle Jesus Himself taught in the parable of the persistent widow (Luke 18:1–8). Her response proved that she understood fully what Jesus was saying, yet had enough conviction to ask anyway (Matthew 15:27). Jesus acknowledged her faith—calling it “great”—and granted her request (Matthew 15:28).

 

[Harel13]

God does everything with order and a purpose. God used that term in his parable because it was meaningful to what he was talking about. Why did Jesus call the Canaanite woman a dog? | GotQuestions.org

That explanation from GotQuestions you keep bringing doesn't explain why he specifically called her a "dog".

 

[rosends]

God does everything with order and a purpose. God used that term in his parable because it was meaningful to what he was talking about. Why did Jesus call the Canaanite woman a dog? | GotQuestions.org

you can't claim to know why God used this term because his ways are not your ways. Isaiah 55, I think.

 

[dybmh]

Jesus didn't literally mean that the woman was a dog or a pet.

Jesus didn't mean what he said? Again???

 

[metis]

I'm sorry, but that's just how it is. Jesus Christ is God, and the Holy Spirit is God according to the Trinity.

Jesus Is God
Is the Holy Spirit God?

Again, what's missing is the use of the concept "essence", which ties it altogether. Without it, we just move into absurdity.

As an example, if you didn't know what an automobile is, and you asked me to explain it, and what I did was to list every single part of a car but stopping there, then your rather logical question would probably be "Well then, what is it used for?"-- iow, what is its "essence". Thus, "essence" is more than just a sum of its parts.

So, with the Trinitarian concept, we have the "parts", namely God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit, but clearly they are not identical or we would even be calling them by these different names. But, if we ask "What is the "essence" of Jesus, God, and the Holy Spirit?", we can then quote Jesus saying that he and the Father are One and then add the Holy Spirit on to that.

The trouble is that this is a rather complicated concept, thus just saying that "Jesus and the Holy Spirit are God" is a lot easier and it doesn't betray their connection per "essence".